Author Topic: Shot shoots  (Read 5292 times)

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Offline Tsalagi

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Shot shoots
« on: January 10, 2010, 09:33:41 pm »
I tried my first arrows I ever made from shoots today. I got three arrows finished from sourwood shoots I got in a trade from PatB. Man, these arrows are great! They're a lot more rugged than Port Orford Cedar! And very accurate! I basically made them barreled and tapered using a thumb plane and sandpaper and they hit like a brick through a plate glass window! I am very impressed!! Worth every second of labor.

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Offline nugget

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2010, 09:45:55 pm »
Besides cane they are my favorite material to use.
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intentions of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body. But rather to slide in sideways, thoroughly used up, totally worn out and loudly proclaiming....WOW WHAT A RIDE!!

Offline Pat B

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2010, 01:05:24 am »
OK now! you know we need pics. ;)
Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline aero86

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2010, 02:15:04 pm »
yes, pics are good.  you guys must have lots of time into this stuff!
profsaffel  "clogs like the devil" I always figured Lucifer to be more of a disco kind of guy.

Offline Hillbilly

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2010, 04:42:54 pm »
Sourwood shoots make great arrows. They're my favorites out of the hardwood shoots.
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Offline zeNBowyer

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #5 on: January 11, 2010, 06:14:24 pm »
I second the  motion-pictures!
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Cowards always run in  packs
Ishi did not become the arrow, I suspect. The arrow became Ishi.

Offline Tsalagi

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2010, 10:27:28 pm »
Well, unfortunately, I can't post pics. I don't have a digital camera.
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Offline Pat B

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #7 on: January 12, 2010, 12:03:55 am »
Did you use the one that I had worked on. It needed a little more straightening but it was almost good to go.
Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline zeNBowyer

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #8 on: January 12, 2010, 12:05:38 am »
Tsalagi
I'de  be  interesting  in any  other  specs  on  your  arrows, their  weight,  speed, how  they work  in  general,
how  do  they  compare  to  bamboo?
Thanx:)
zeNBowyer-++
"There's  something  immoral  about  abandoning  your  own  judgement"
Cowards always run in  packs
Ishi did not become the arrow, I suspect. The arrow became Ishi.

Offline Tsalagi

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #9 on: January 12, 2010, 12:59:57 am »
First, I'll need to make some bamboo arrows to compare them to. I'll tell you this. They're a heckuva lot better than Port Orford Cedar. More work, but worth every second. I couldn't tell you about the weight as I don't have a grain scale. They fly fast and straight. As fast or faster than POC. And more rugged than POC. Those three group tight together. Like, at 10 feet, all three grouping together within an inch or less. Often, two almost touching and the third 1/2 inch from the other two. While the POC I had were ok, but not like that. Stepping back to about 25 feet, I could see that these arrows fly straight and fast and hitting right on target. They hit HARD. The POC would go "thwap, thwap" into the portable bale we use. While these shoot arrows go "POK! POK!" That's because I barreled and tapered these.

See, I kinda cheated on these. I used glue on 145 grain field points because these are for targets. So, the point ends were about 1/2" to 3/8" wide on the raw shaft after stripping bark and a quick sanding. I tapered the ends starting at 5 inches behind the point end; just enough to get the taper tool over the end and far enough to shave the taper on. I used a thumb plane and sandpaper to accomplish that. So, the shaft is barreled. It's naturally tapered at the nock and I took advantage of that. But what I did not do was create a parallel shaft. I made a barreled shaft, tapered at the end to accept an 11/32" field point. I used 5-1/2" banana fletching, offset.

I would not hesitate for a second to use sourwood shoots to make hunting arrows. I have a weird theory that most Native American bows ranged between 40 and 60 pounds on average and that the traditional shoots used for arrows---sourwood, red osier, etc.---are the perfect spine for these bows at the growing cycle where they're thick enough to make proper arrows.
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Offline Tsalagi

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #10 on: January 12, 2010, 01:02:55 am »
Pat, no, the one you worked on I kept as a "graphic training aid". I use it as a reference point of what a shaft should look like. I'll use it later, after I get the hang of this more.
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Offline aero86

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #11 on: January 12, 2010, 01:09:08 am »
how thick do you cut shoots of any species?

and, if you make me 3 dozen shoot arrows, ill send you my digital camera ;)
profsaffel  "clogs like the devil" I always figured Lucifer to be more of a disco kind of guy.

Offline Pat B

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #12 on: January 12, 2010, 01:13:54 am »
That is pretty typical of my sourwood arrows. I sometimes have to reduce the diameter of the butt end so I also use a thumb plane to reduce them.  My finished arrows with stone points usually go about 600gr mol.
  
   Below is my shoot arrow and cane arrow making tools...



Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline Pat B

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2010, 01:22:28 am »
aero, I usually cut shoots that are from 3/8" to 1/2" at the butt. Once they dry and the bark is removed that diameter gets smaller and then you can reduce it more with a thumb plane if needed. A more important aspect to consider when cutting shoots is you want at least 2nd year growth. First year growth will work but they are flimsy and hard to keep straight.
  First year growth has leaves along the shoot. The second year small branches grow from buds below the leaf scar from last year. These are the shoots you want to harvest.    Also, with sourwood you can strip the bark as soon as you cut them. Many other shoot material will check(drying cracks) if you strip the bark too soon. Do a few samples of whatever you cut to see if you can remove the bark right away. They will dry quicker if you can.
Make the most of all that comes and the least of all that goes!    Pat Brennan  Brevard, NC

Offline aero86

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Re: Shot shoots
« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2010, 09:34:02 am »
ive been gathering privet, and i do think im cutting it too thin.  im going for 5/8 shafts.  what would a good taper for a 5/8 shaft be?  if i wanted the point end to be that big?  11/16's at the nock?
profsaffel  "clogs like the devil" I always figured Lucifer to be more of a disco kind of guy.