Main Discussion Area > Primitive Skills
Hand thrown spear better than the Atlatl?
lebhuntfish:
--- Quote from: mullet on December 04, 2015, 09:24:14 pm ---I think you believe that. Everybody else has tried to tell you what they believe but you are too busy listening to yourself to read it.
Joe is right, trolling, I guess you had a lot of time to think with the last 30 day suspension.
--- End quote ---
Thanks you Eddie.
Patrick
Zuma:
"Much to do about nothing"
"Lol I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be abrasive but I think prehistory and history have been mythologized beyond belief."
Zuma agrees
"Some people seem to think that everyone around back then was running around looking like Arnold Schwarzenneger, throwing atlatl darts 100,000m to hit squirrels, doing roundhouse kicks to take down elephants and actually killing something with a promontory peg trap, and that the only reason people aren't doing that stuff nowadays is because they don't have time to practice, or didn't eat enough organic food when they were a child, or because their mom didn't breastfeed them, or whatever."
Zuma disagrees
And for some reason people seem very, very unwilling to rethink this idea.
Zuma agrees
Here is my opinion about the opinions here in this thread.
Not one, is backed up by more than an opinion.
LOL including mine. But I do have the data if you all are interested.
Does any one here know the real reason for the development
of the Bannerstone? Atatl weight?
Zuma
M-P:
Hey Folks, There is a lot of info on Atlatls on the web and if that's not enough you can check out the atlatl association. The bottom line is that atlatls were used world wide and for thousands of years. and in some cultures until historic times. I would argue that someone found the atlatl/ dart useful and effective, or it would not have spread or lasted. The central American city states armed their warriors with atlatls ( and really wicked obsidian-bladed clubs) and gave Conquistadors a workout. ( It turns out that steel armor works well against obsidian weapons.)
I think John32r is placing an awful lot of emphasis on the account of one observer, and the results of an amatuer competition and conveniently ignoring other accounts, experiences and archeologic artifacts. Atlatls ( for me at least) take a lot more practice than archery to obtain any accuracy, but I'm more accurate with them than rocks or thrown spears.
As for banner stones, their method of use is conjectoral, based on positioning in archeologic finds. Modern experiments using them on atlatls has failed to find a proven advantage. That doesn't mean they weren't used as atlatl weights, just means they have no proven advantage. They do make your atlatl look cool though which is reason enough for me. Ron
Grasshopper Mouse:
Tom Mills is a past president of the World Atlatl Assoc. and I have the pleasure and honor to know him personally.
I have participated in 3D archery shoots for which Tom has received permission from the organizers to do the course with his atlatl. It is quite embarrassing to be a fairly good archer using a modern glass/wood longwow and to be outscored by a guy with a little board and some pointy darts. In fact, Tom has outscored quite a number of the participants using his atlatl and darts.
To postulate that the atlatl is not accurate simply shows me that someone hasn't practiced enough.
Guy
John32r:
--- Quote from: Grasshopper Mouse on December 05, 2015, 12:19:43 am ---Tom Mills is a past president of the World Atlatl Assoc. and I have the pleasure and honor to know him personally.
I have participated in 3D archery shoots for which Tom has received permission from the organizers to do the course with his atlatl. It is quite embarrassing to be a fairly good archer using a modern glass/wood longwow and to be outscored by a guy with a little board and some pointy darts. In fact, Tom has outscored quite a number of the participants using his atlatl and darts.
To postulate that the atlatl is not accurate simply shows me that someone hasn't practiced enough.
Guy
--- End quote ---
Isn't Tom Mills Paleoaleo from Paleoplanet? By his own admission his maximum accurate throwing distance is 30 yards.
--- Quote ---Posts: 14954
May 26 05 6:34 PM
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I met the guy who holds the distance record (or at least he did hold it...don't know if he still does). A guy from Arizona. Something crazy like 800 feet or something. I forget exactly. I saw the equipment he used. Was a really long atlatl (betwen 24 and 30" in length) and a really short dart (about 4 1/2' to 5' long). The dart was carbon or aluminum with what appeared to be razor blades (not sharp) for fletching.
With my 7' arundo darts and 22" atlatl, I can throw just under 100 yards. My darts are built for close up accuracy (anywhere from a few feet to 30 yards or so) though, and not for distance.
I hate throwing distance...it always blows out my elbow!"
--- End quote ---
http://paleoplanet69529.yuku.com/topic/12715/distance-of-throw-for-atlatl#.VmJ3_FnnZJ9
These guys at the competitions are struggling to hit big targets at 20 yards. And making a lot of noise doing so. The darts are very slow and have low kinetic energy by the time they get to the target. I have never seen videos of Atlatl champs throwing at farther distances.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYC5o7RUAnI
EDIT: Warning there is a lot of cussing in this video by frustrated throwers so please be warned if children are nearby.
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