How would you deal with this side knot?

[WhistlingBadger]

Working on this bow from Rocky Mountain juniper.  It will be sinew backed.  It's about 60" long ntn, with a 4" handle and 4" fades.  Limbs are about 2" wide and fairly knot free...except for this beast.  It is almost exactly mid limb (the handle is directly behind the vise in the first picture).  The knot just goes inside and disappears; it doesn't come out on the belly or the back.

I've had a more terrible time than usual finding untwisted juniper lately, so I don't want to just discard the stave.  How would you work this?

[WhistlingBadger]

in the picture, back is up, belly side is down.

[ajooter]

What does it look like on the belly?  A lot of time a drawknife will pop it right out as long as it leaves you enough material.

[Pappy]

This Hawthorn bow had 2 just like that, as ajooter said, if it don't go deep or come out the belly or back usually the will pop right out, I popped these out and filled them with epoxy , sanded it down and was just a little careful while tillering , maybe just a little less bend and left a little wider  in them areas, worked out fine. 
 Pappy

[WhistlingBadger]

Well, it doesn't go all the way through.  The bulge is just on one side; I think it goes to the heart of the tree and stops, if that makes sense.  It is a fairly significant part of the wood so I don't know if there would be enough left if I just popped it out.

Back:


Belly:

[WhistlingBadger]

Juniper is always an experience in working around knots.  I haven't found any exceptions yet.   

[Hamish]

 A knot that runs across the grain is the most dangerous, when it comes to chrysalling. Its basically like have an empty hole at that point.

I've never dealt with one that large, but I have plugged plenty of yew staves with "Dutchmans". Drill / ream the knot out and plug with a clean section of fresh wood. Use a bow makers epoxy, or something like urea formaldehyde/or resorcinol glue.

Easier said than done though. I would really need a closer look and dimensions to see how feasible it would be to try in your situation.

[Hamish]

Hopefully Del will chime in soon. He works plenty of knotty yew, with plugs and fillings. I'd be very surprised if he hasn't tackled similar knots successfully.

[superdav95]

If I knew it was solid and looks like it isn’t too crumbly I might just leave it.  Like Hamish said,  Del is a good resource on this.  I recall referring to his page when I did something similar a a couple yew bows with knots on the edge.  I had one that I made for the bow trade last year in fact that had plugs and held up great and hopefully still is.  I sent this bow to the recipient, Will B, after shooting it a bunch to be sure it would be good to go.  It had a few edge knots like this that I dealt with and one of them needed to be removed and plugged as hamish mentioned.  It’s doable.   I just used a little plug of heartwood to match.  I’ll try and dig up a picture or two to post it here.

I was able to locate the thread link for the bow I referenced


http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,72776.msg1023267.html#msg1023267

[simk]

If you cannot get rid of it (how close to final thickness are you?) Its a very bad situation. I usually follow tha grain and remove it completly. If there is not enough meat then for a bow i do skip that stave. The leftover knot will act like a rock inside you bending limb otherwise. With a sinew backed bow that sharply bends you want clean wood for a clean tiller anyways. Sorry for that. Cheers

[mmattockx]

Del's most recent video on the scruffy yew bow talks all about knots on the edge and how he deals with them.

https://youtu.be/L1YtBSpQqr4?si=h4clLUEVEmNTvm_P


Mark

[Burnsie]

Possibly drill it out with an appropriately sized forstner bit and fill with some Total Boat - flexible epoxy??

[Hamish]

You definitely don't want any flexible epoxy. It will peel at the glue line sooner or later. You want a really rigid glue line, bowmakers epoxy, urea formaldehyde, or resorcinol.

[superdav95]

Del's most recent video on the scruffy yew bow talks all about knots on the edge and how he deals with them.

https://youtu.be/L1YtBSpQqr4?si=h4clLUEVEmNTvm_P


Mark

Ya I just watched this one.  It’s great.  Thanks to Del!   

[WhistlingBadger]

Thanks, guys.  Del's video is really helpful--which ones he's concerned about and why, and what he does with the problematic ones.

So.  Looking closely at this knot, a few things I notice:  It's very solid--no bark around it or pith in the middle.  It is more toward the belly than the back.  And it's about 1/2" across both ways, probably too big to just ignore.  There does seem to be a little crack toward the middle, and a much smaller sub-knot underneath.  Here's a better close-up of the knot.



I'm wondering if my best option is to just carve it out, approximately where the pencil line is, and hope there's enough wood left to not make a hinge...maybe put some extra sinew on that spot.  The back is highly crowned, and I'm hoping to get about a 50#er out of this, so I'm not sure how much wood I'll have to remove from the rest.  Thoughts?