Primitive Archer

Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: Fred Arnold on January 22, 2016, 04:22:04 pm

Title: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 22, 2016, 04:22:04 pm
I need to know who hasn't been contacted with their recipients name and bow specs.

I lost my first database sheet on my word processor and had to start over about halfway through the signups.



   We want all of you especially  the newest to this fantastic hobby and craft to enjoy and learn. By participating and asking questions you should be able to turn out a bow you'll be proud of.  8)

I need to know who hasn't been contacted with their recipients name and bow specs.

I lost my first database sheet on my word processor and had to start over about halfway through the signups.

Okay gentlemen the cards have been shuffled and here is the current members list. A few more maybe to add and then the wheel gets spun for the drawing. Hope you are all as excited as I am.

half eye
hammertime
turtle
Swampman
Mo_coon-catcher
tatoo dave
Tower
DuBois
pincushion
TimothyR
Gutshot
ajooter
Drewster
Dakota Kid
Blaflair2
kid bow
ty_in_ND
PlanB
jandersson
stixnstones
jeffp51
Loope
mwosborn
David Ewing
dylanholderman
Fred Arnold
stuckinthemud
Otter
sidmand
cabinetbowguy
Ryan C
Ranasp


Since this will probably be the smallest PA bow trade and there will a lot of new and younger participants than normal I've decided to add a little icing on the cake this year.

I will build a sinew backed osage and all participants in this years trade will be entered with the bow going to the winner of the drawing.

Every month there will be a drawing for the new members that haven't participated before or have under 1 year under their belt.

I will donate either a stave, draw knife, Nicholson rasp, sinew, arrow shafts, or something related to bow building each month for those showing the most participation. This is not how many times you've posted but rather what you've posted. We want to see what you're working on. The more pictures you show and questions you ask the more you'll learn and assure that  you will likely send out a bow you can be proud of.

Anyone wanting to donate items to this cause will be a great help. I want to see this with at least if not more participants than the invitational :laugh:

I'll be posting the sign up and rules shortly.

For all of you old timers on here I know you'll be glad to give advice and help these new guys out.
That's what it's all about.

Cheers ;)

#1  Send me a PM with
       Full Name
       Full Address
       Email Address
       Telephone #
       Which countries you will ship to (duh :P)

#2 Reply to this thread saying you're in with the following information:
      Bow specs preferred
      Example  LH  or  RH
      Draw weight  45-55#  10# increment
      27-29" draw (3" increment with the missing number  being your actual draw length

#3  If a new member (1 year or less) or never built a bow before you must send me a PM for
       verification.
       And if your under the age of 18 I will need to speak to you and parents via email and
       telephone.
       I'm not going to turn anyone down whom I believe is serious about fulfilling their obligation.

#4  All members including myself must participate actively by posting progress reports,pictures,
      asking questions, and helping those in need. Anyone not participating regularly after the first
      30 days will be removed and the bow being built for them will be either passed to someone
      else or given to a charitable cause.

#5   No bows are to be sent out individuals who are not participating. If you are ready to ship
       early please make sure that your recipient is doing their part in the trade.

#6  Any questions please ask them here and someone will respond. Pm me only for private
       discussion as my mailbox may be peaking.

#7 through #10 left open in case we don't have enough rules.

#7 State which area of the map you are willing to ship to. I knew there was a reason to leave my
     rules open to modification.

   We want all of you especially  the newest to this fantastic hobby and craft to enjoy and learn. By participating and asking questions you should be able to turn out a bow you'll be proud of.  8)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 22, 2016, 04:41:14 pm
I'd might as well get in on this. I have an ich to build a sinew backed ERC, so that's what will probably be leaving my hands.

Right hand
45-55 pounds
26-28"
If you want to make a short bow with short draw or a massive warbow, go for it. I'm open to anything.
Prefer to stay within the states but willing to ship  international if need be to fill a spot.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: kid bow on January 22, 2016, 04:46:58 pm
right hand
draw weight 50-60
27-29 inches.
I honestly don't mind what style as long as its hunting weight and shootable. I look forward to seeing what everyone has going on.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 22, 2016, 04:53:39 pm
Fred,
     I would be proud to trade bows with any of the new members.
handed....dont care
draw......dont care
weight....maybe about 50 + or - whatever
    Make the best bow you can, I'll appreciate it.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 22, 2016, 05:00:43 pm
Rich,
I'm elated!!  ;D Thank you for your support.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 22, 2016, 05:08:59 pm
Fred, your a good man for heading this up....I'm sure it will benifit the new builders. I'll see what I can come up with to throw in the "stew-pot" as well.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: JonW on January 22, 2016, 05:30:10 pm
Fred I wont be participating in the trade but I will donate something for the incentive thing.

Jon W
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 22, 2016, 05:39:08 pm
Thanks Jon!! I sent you a PM.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 22, 2016, 05:52:36 pm
I'd might as well get in on this. I have an ich to build a sinew backed ERC, so that's what will probably be leaving my hands.

Right hand
45-55 pounds
26-28"
If you want to make a short bow with short draw or a massive warbow, go for it. I'm open to anything.
Prefer to stay within the states but willing to ship  international if need be to fill a spot.

Kyle

Minus building a sinew backed erc you nut haha....which I can't wait to see btw   :D. All my stats and sentiments are the same!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 22, 2016, 05:56:35 pm
I'm in.

RH
55# and up
28"-30" draw, but I can short draw just fine if someone wants to make a shorty or horse bow.

To whom ever will be making my bow,
No pressure at all. This is more about getting to know the board members and having fun than getting "your money's worth" in my opinion. As long as you enjoy yourself during the process, I'm happy to receive your creation.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 22, 2016, 06:00:34 pm
ajooter and Dakota Kid, read rule #1
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 22, 2016, 06:15:38 pm
Dakota Kid, :D Got yours in my emails after I logged off.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on January 22, 2016, 06:16:23 pm
I'm liking the attitudes and talk thus far, for this trade. I hope we can make this a great trade again. Count me in. I'll send you a pm shortly Fred. I'll be happy to receive any bow from anyone, no matter what the persons experience level!

Glad to see you joining in also Rich! I'm looking forward to seeing some bows soon. I put a silk backing on a hickory bow today, after getting it roughed out.

Tattoo Dave
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 22, 2016, 06:16:42 pm
I'm in! :)

My normal (not essential.... ie. shortdraw horsebow, longbow, etc. ) specs:

RH
40-50#
26"-28'"

Really open to just about anything interesting, but that's what I shoot normally.

(sorry, just one request...... no snake skin backs. thx.)

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: pincushin on January 22, 2016, 06:41:29 pm
Im in
Lh
50 and up
25-29
open to anything
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on January 22, 2016, 06:57:02 pm
I'm in again this year.....enjoyed last year's trade.

RH

40#-50#

29" - 31"

I would be delighted with any style bow.....and hope I can help others some too.  Let's roll!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mullet on January 22, 2016, 06:58:49 pm
Sounds like you are off to a good start, Fred. let me dig through my goodies for a drawing donation.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: kid bow on January 22, 2016, 07:09:48 pm
when do we find out our recipient?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 22, 2016, 07:14:58 pm
Thanks Mullet for the extra help. I've had a few of the guys in the Invitational already offer their help and support. We really appreciate it and hope you watch over us and give advice.

Hey guys JonW donated a stave for our monthly rewards program. What do you say to that? ;D

I'll post the match ups after I feel we have enough commitments to make it interesting. Sometime shortly after the 1st of FEB. Our deadline will be mid August so that will give us over 6 months to make sure we do this right.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 22, 2016, 07:27:58 pm
I'm in.  Here is my info.

RH
45-65 pounds
26-28 inch draw

I am open to anything too.  I also shoot well with a shorter draw if need be.

Looking forward to this.  Mike
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 22, 2016, 08:09:07 pm
Getting excited...I would be more then happy to donate some shwag to the cause.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 22, 2016, 08:13:30 pm
Urban Dictionary: Shwag
www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Shwag

"shwag" is short for "shwiggity shwag" which was birthed from the phrase "sliggety slag": a cute reference to slag bud. "Slag bud" is marijuana that has been highly ...
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on January 22, 2016, 08:20:29 pm
It dont say in the rules anything about what cant be traded. I mean, we are tryin to motivate folks to join right?

If that dont get folks to gather in i dont know what will. Way to make it a joint effort.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on January 22, 2016, 08:26:37 pm
Urban Dictionary: Shwag
www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Shwag

"shwag" is short for "shwiggity shwag" which was birthed from the phrase "sliggety slag": a cute reference to slag bud. "Slag bud" is marijuana that has been highly ...

Highly what?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 22, 2016, 08:35:34 pm
LMAO!!!  I don't reference the urban dictionary Fred and im not in the position to donate and 'shwag'.  I think of that word defining materials associated with a certain brand or common theme.  I literally just made that up and I hope it works. 

Although some hemp cordage could be a good donation.  :P
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PatM on January 22, 2016, 08:36:47 pm
Swag is the more appropriate word if used rather broadly.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 22, 2016, 08:43:41 pm
aj, Dumb me didn't know what it was so I yahoo'd it and first thing I run into was that. I'm so tired I didn't look any further. It did put a smile on my face though.

I'm going to the easy chair to read a book and will check back in before bed time.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 22, 2016, 08:45:24 pm
I should have used the spell checker...I does raise a red flag to shwag :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PatM on January 22, 2016, 08:50:39 pm
Swag is basically "goods".
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 22, 2016, 09:24:38 pm
As apposed to low quality Mexican brick weed.  :laugh:


Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 22, 2016, 09:27:02 pm
On a more serious note, is 6 months enough time for those planning on a sinew backing? I was toying with the idea, but I'd hate to watch all my potential work time disappear while waiting for hide glue to cure.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 22, 2016, 09:40:03 pm
Dakota,
      If you have not made enough sinew backed bows to have a good feel for timing, just a suggestion that you develop a plan more within your knowledge base. Not being a jerk, but try to do a bow you like, and do it really well.....then you wont have the time thing sneak up and bite you.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 22, 2016, 09:49:24 pm
I'm in

RH
Draw weight  40#-55#
Draw length 28"
I'm ok with any design I just want to hunt with it

I all ready have some pics to show. So can I do that here? Or are y'all gonna make a new thread for that?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 22, 2016, 10:39:39 pm
I've done a couple sinew backed bows but am no expert.  Both were short recurves, one yew and one osage. I just left them on the rack to dry for 8 months or more before I retillered. Most of the recommendations/readings I found suggest waiting a year. If it can be ready before that it would be welcome knowledge and I'd probably make more of them. It is an impressive backing material to say the least. 

As far as running into trouble,  I usually need to have at least three bows in progress at once so I can rotate when I need a break from one. I'll have more than one option if something goes awry with plan A.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 22, 2016, 11:35:27 pm
I skipped last years trade and it was more difficult than I thought it would be the year before that!
But I am in for this one!

RH
40-60#
26-28"

When does the action begin?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 23, 2016, 12:30:28 am
Well it looks like we're going to be setup with names drawn by the 1st of the month and deadline will be mid August but I don't expect any of this bunch to be that late. I see a lot of enthusiasm from these young guys and fully anticipate 100% out of everyone who has responded.

We have an even dozen participants at the moment chomping at the bit.

Even though you don't know your recipient yet you are more than welcome to post pics of what you're working on and let us know a little bit about yourself.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 23, 2016, 07:05:37 am
Well now, I sort of got started yesterday. Went to the wood bin and dug out a few sticks and brought them into the shed (unheated) to clean off the snow and size them up....then into the house for a couple days to warm them up. but here are a couple of pictures of the current state of affairs.

We have had a mild winter so far, but it's tryin hard to make up for it....last couple of weeks more than 70 inches. Of course there is also the obligatory gale force winds. So anyways, here are the pics.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 23, 2016, 07:26:09 am
Those look wide rich....I see half a dozen bows at least!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PEARL DRUMS/PEARLY/PD/DRUMS on January 23, 2016, 07:59:32 am
I've done a couple sinew backed bows but am no expert.  Both were short recurves, one yew and one osage. I just left them on the rack to dry for 8 months or more before I retillered. Most of the recommendations/readings I found suggest waiting a year. If it can be ready before that it would be welcome knowledge and I'd probably make more of them. It is an impressive backing material to say the least. 

As far as running into trouble,  I usually need to have at least three bows in progress at once so I can rotate when I need a break from one. I'll have more than one option if something goes awry with plan A.

A few layers of sinew on wood, with hide glue will dry plenty in 2-4 weeks during cold northern winters. That gives you time to make 4 or 5 of them.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Buckeye Guy on January 23, 2016, 08:49:00 am
Good job Fred!
Thanks for giving your time and energy  to this
Have fun folks
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 23, 2016, 09:07:31 am
Rich, those are nice looking staves. I've never worked ironwood.

As for my sinew backed osage,  I have a nice black walnut  I found in my pile that has been drying indoors for over 3 years that I've decided to use instead. It will only require a couple of sessions of heat straightening and will be ready to back.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: cabinetbowguy on January 23, 2016, 09:32:29 am
Im in

Rh
40-50 #   28-30 inch draw. 
Desgin dont matter to me what ever you send i will be happy have fun

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 23, 2016, 09:42:34 am
well Fred, you way ahead of the old guy.....I got 'em split down to a size that I can work on, and will have the bow preforms finished by this evening. Decided to cut a bunch of different sizes since I dont know who my victim is.....anyway, should be good to go by time the names get put out.

enjoy the pics
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 23, 2016, 09:46:12 am
Your a machine rich.  How do you reduce your staves?  I'm a hatchet man myself.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 23, 2016, 09:54:29 am
Rich,  8)You're a tougher old man than I am. I'm not going out in that snow till the sun turns it to water. I've already got 8 or 10 down to bow dimensions hanging on the rack or laying in a pile. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 23, 2016, 10:00:50 am
I started last week in anticipation of a trade. I have a couple mulberry billets that I'm working on and an Osage character stave that I've got almost to floor tiller  they will both need some heat correction.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 23, 2016, 10:06:45 am
Dont believe that for a new york minuet Fred.....I'm trying to decide between Eastern Woodland, Mollegabet, Penobscot or maybe a 5 curve.....man all this thinkin is gonna hurt my head >:D

AJ  A hand axe is the way to go for sure....but it dont work for one handed guys so I cheat and use a bandsaw for the rough outs then go to the hand tools. By the way that bow your working on looks like a fine specimen to me. By joining the trade ya talked yourself right into starting another one, eh?
That brings up the issue of: What are you making  >:D >:D

Timothy ya been holdin out bud, this is gonna be so cool
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 23, 2016, 10:35:11 am
We've had a really mild winter here, too, Rich, but almost no snow either. I haven't plowed once yet, knock on elm. Guess there's a ways to go though.

Here's a big elm stave I've thought about for something special. I'm also torn between wanting to do ten different kinds of bows. I think this is what I'll use, though.

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeElm1.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 23, 2016, 11:10:18 am
I don't know rich...gonna rough out two staves.  Try my hand at a recurve and another longbow of sorts.  I was really happy with the way that other hickory is coming out.   I still need to post pics of that Osage you coached me thru.  It came out really nice.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 23, 2016, 11:15:40 am
Like I said before fellas, I'd rather have a bow from one of you than all the a-listers on the site. We are gonna have some fun cause of you guys that joined in and are workin hard.....man I love this stuff.

Plan B, Elm makes some screamin nasty bows ....cant wait to see yours bud.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on January 23, 2016, 11:17:00 am
Progress already, looking good fellas! I have some dead standing ironwood I got from rich. I got it roughed out and need to heat some twist out of it. I tried yesterday, that stuff is named correctly that's for sure! Trying to bend the twist out is damn near impossible. I also have a hickory stave I started tillering last night.

Tattoo Dave
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 23, 2016, 11:21:35 am
 ;) This is an invitational also. We asked for people to step up who wanted to try a bow and you have responded. I may have asked a few pointed questions but we haven't turned anyone away yet and don't plan on it if they will make a commitment. This is about learning and having fun.

TimothyR and PlanB those are both some fine looking wood you're working with.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: JonW on January 23, 2016, 11:41:07 am
Nice response so far guys. I didn't want to take away from the annual swap and it looks like it is going to flourish this year.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 23, 2016, 11:48:24 am
If you guys get the chance post a photo of yourself. I don't have any good ones but at least you'll know what my mug looks like.
Last two are of my 2 sons and I next to a big cottonwood down by the creek bed.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Onebowonder on January 23, 2016, 11:51:21 am
Fred - That Cottonwood's just beggin to be made into a burnt out canoe project!  Nice pix sir...

OneBow
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 23, 2016, 11:54:56 am
I got a few staves picked out. It was hard deciding between a highly charactereed stave and letting it be what it wanta to be or a clean stave I can do as I please with. I went with clean this time for ease of making with how busy this spring and summer is starting to look. I picked out an ERC that will be either a mollegabet or recurve, a walnut that'll be a pyramid since I havmt done many of those, and a black locust that'll be a reflex  deflex. Ill mix and match staves between this and another trade for which will be the best to send to which recipient and the third will be the backup. I can't wait to get my names to get started. Now to start pounding sinew during the slow spells at work.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 23, 2016, 11:57:33 am
All I have is hickory so I'm going to probably go with a bendy handle of sorts depending on my candidates draw and then a stiff handled flatbow or longbow for a backup.  I should hopefully have some progress pics up later.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: pincushin on January 23, 2016, 12:05:24 pm
I'm thinking a lam bow rd molly osage belly wenge core bamboo back with purple heart statics
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 23, 2016, 12:37:25 pm
Looks like everybody's gearin up!!

I'm pondering on my wood pile and will make some decisions on a couple of the best...but no hurry, right? HAHAHAHAHA  >:D >:D

That's what I thought last time and it came right down to the last week or 2 after a few failures and less than my best bows.

I'm thinking a lam bow rd molly osage belly wenge core bamboo back with purple heart statics


Hey Pin,
Like how you're keepin it simple  ;)

No really,
That should be awesome to see.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: pincushin on January 23, 2016, 12:44:21 pm
Looks like everybody's gearin up!!

I'm pondering on my wood pile and will make some decisions on a couple of the best...but no hurry, right? HAHAHAHAHA  >:D >:D

That's what I thought last time and it came right down to the last week or 2 after a few failures and less than my best bows.

I'm thinking a lam bow rd molly osage belly wenge core bamboo back with purple heart statics


Hey Pin,
Like how you're keepin it simple  ;)

No really,
That should be awesome to see.

thanks "Doo Boys" I'm exited to see what you make too you have a unique style. >:D >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Tower on January 23, 2016, 12:54:03 pm
Ok count me in.   I'm a better knapper, but I have been working on a few bows lately.
RH
50-70 lbs.
28"

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 23, 2016, 01:25:36 pm
Hi all!  I will also be participating in this trade.  While I was thinking about doing something like this next year (after a few more bows under the belt) and even though I haven't been super active in posting, I really want to do something for this site as I've learned so much from all the great bowyers here!  I also want to be part of the solution to the tarnish that's built up on the bow swap.  This site has such a great community, it needs something like this to help restore some faith.

With that said:

Right Hand
40-50 lbs
30-32 inches (yes, I do have a 31" draw... I'm newer to bow building but I've been practicing with "traditional" archery equipment for a while now)

While I would intend to hunt whitetail with this bow (and would appreciate a bow that's not 6' long!), I do know a longer draw length does provide for challenges when it comes to limb length.  At the end of the day, a nice shooting bow is all I could ask for, regardless of length.

I'll start preparing materials this weekend.  I can't wait to build something for someone other than family member, it'll be fun!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 23, 2016, 01:34:33 pm
All of you are welcome here to what I believe will be the best bow trade ever. I love your attitude!!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on January 23, 2016, 03:12:17 pm
Had to sleep on this one but sure I m in.....45-50# I shoot lefty 26" draw would be happy with any style make or model-Hammertime
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Danzn Bar on January 23, 2016, 03:23:28 pm
Wow Fred your doing a bang up job!!! This looks like it's going to be a good one.....
DBar
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: JW_Halverson on January 23, 2016, 03:42:00 pm
Why not a 6' longbow, Ty?  It's not like there are any trees in North Dakota for you to run afoul!  Bwaaahahaha! (I get to poke fun if ND, it's my home state.)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on January 23, 2016, 03:43:06 pm
Must be all that schwag....
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 23, 2016, 04:30:42 pm
Damned Fred, ya got to know the hat makes the man, right...mad bomber >:D I like your secrete to being comfortable while workin on your bows too.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 23, 2016, 04:44:30 pm
Got a hat like that this Christmas from the nieces. Man, the ear loppers are boss. Wish I'd had it last winter. Only problem is I can't hear much through them, like the neighbor yelling at her 11 untrained dogs all day.

Not.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 23, 2016, 04:59:25 pm
Why not a 6' longbow, Ty?  It's not like there are any trees in North Dakota for you to run afoul!  Bwaaahahaha! (I get to poke fun if ND, it's my home state.)

:P The lack of trees also means finding good bow woods from local sources is a challenge.  Most people put in poplar and cottonwoods for their shelter belts (we're too far north for osage to survive)... Supposedly there are hackberry trees throughout the eastern river edges (where I live), but I haven't gone looking yet.  It sounds like a fun challenge, though!

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on January 23, 2016, 05:12:50 pm
Here s a hickory curve I have been working on(http://i1221.photobucket.com/albums/dd464/jeffreyakolste/photo%209_zpskseqpdqz.jpg)....One of a variety of canidates
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 23, 2016, 05:16:21 pm
I dug through my stash last night and pulled a this piece of wood out of my pile. 

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/66F8E957-718E-4C9D-A11B-01F5BFF03B55_zpshx6asxqv.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/66F8E957-718E-4C9D-A11B-01F5BFF03B55_zpshx6asxqv.jpg.html)

I started reducing it down to bow dimensions. 

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/EED96827-6DCE-4461-ACAC-0DCCB2FA8224_zpscpw2vwyp.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/EED96827-6DCE-4461-ACAC-0DCCB2FA8224_zpscpw2vwyp.jpg.html)

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/796DE688-F68F-4C9A-B544-71A665D228D7_zpsw2dgnu7f.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/796DE688-F68F-4C9A-B544-71A665D228D7_zpsw2dgnu7f.jpg.html)

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/47FEA251-8037-4583-8E0C-3CCED9DEDC0E_zps9efvmhmp.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/47FEA251-8037-4583-8E0C-3CCED9DEDC0E_zps9efvmhmp.jpg.html)

This is a wood I haven't seen bows of on this site so I will see how it bends.  I also have a piece of elm, black locust and ironwood roughed out for plans b, c, and d.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 23, 2016, 05:21:19 pm
What kind of wood is it, swampman?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: willie on January 23, 2016, 05:27:12 pm
I got a couple staves of alder that look just like that.....
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 23, 2016, 05:51:38 pm
Hammer, thats a fine looker right there
Swampman you guys are leaving me in the dust....looks like everybody is off to a good start

all of you guys are serious aint ya? better get my butt in gear
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 23, 2016, 06:13:27 pm
My guess is beech.

 I have an "art bow" in progress with a beech stave. The wood was a better bow wood than I would have thought. It ranks with the other top white woods.  The plan was to shape the limbs like snakes swallowing the handle. The airbrush the color on both sides. I may put that into the mix of potential candidates. I have a rock elm stave that I'm making into a mollie as my #1 for the trade. My plan B will be an American hornbeam that I haven't picked a style for quite yet. I have a yew sapling/branch that needs to be a bendy handle which I may also choose depending on my guy's draw.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 23, 2016, 06:25:37 pm
I was wondering about using beech. The deer won't eat it, and it's overgrowing most other trees.

Lots of low branches and knots, but I think I have a few nearby saplings with fairly clear trunks. Maybe I'll cut a few tomorrow just to check it out once it's dry. Looking forward to reading about your experience with the bow, Dakota.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 23, 2016, 06:27:59 pm
PlanB, that stave is birch.  I have heard it can make a serviceable bow.  I cut it in 2007 from my Grandfathers land on the day he passed away.  I haven't been inspired to work on that piece of wood until I was digging through my pile of wood last night.  I hope there is some good mojo in that piece of wood.  I am leaving it long for now and not touching the handle ( in case I get someone with a 31 inch draw).  If that happens it may be a 68 inch bendy handle bow. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 23, 2016, 06:55:12 pm
Swampman I built a black birch bow this year, with over 1800 arrows through it so far. It's kept 1/2" reflex.

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/NewBirch28.jpg)

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 23, 2016, 07:24:37 pm
PlanB, that sounds very encouraging.  So far the wood is very nice to work with.  I got some more work done this afternoon with a rasp.  It is not bending yet.

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/B6BF58B1-0B4E-4C20-A2AC-138A81FDC864_zpsrg4gmwce.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/B6BF58B1-0B4E-4C20-A2AC-138A81FDC864_zpsrg4gmwce.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 23, 2016, 08:24:47 pm
I'm in
LH
45-55#
25-27" draw
I'm excited and eager to get started.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 23, 2016, 08:33:59 pm
good deal gutshot....Fred's got some computer access issues that will be resolved by tomorrow but you are for sure welcome sir....
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 23, 2016, 09:17:20 pm
Real high stiffness wood swampman, my limbs finished out at 3/8" x 2" mid-limb on a 64" ttt for 40# @ 28", if that helps.

(that was de-crowned -- ie. board bow)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 23, 2016, 09:37:39 pm
Thanks PlanB.  I am planning 2 inches wide for the majority of the limb.  The length will depend on the draw length of the person I get.  I may work on getting a couple other staves roughed out just to keep my options open. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hedgehog on January 23, 2016, 10:07:58 pm
Well, I havn't spoken much at all on here, But I been lurkin! This whole trade thing is a cool Idea. I have been carving out bows since 198something. Most have been Osage with a couple Vine Maple, Black Locust and board bows when I lived on the Canadian border and had no decent wood to work. As much as I would love to participate I am going to have to pass. I moved back to Kansas and do not have any seasoned Hedge/ Osage. Love the community of brothers here and I am really looking forward to meeting a few of you at some gatherings this summer. I will certainly continue lurking and drooling over the selfbow works of art. Larry
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on January 23, 2016, 10:20:51 pm
Well, I havn't spoken much at all on here, But I been lurkin! This whole trade thing is a cool Idea. I have been carving out bows since 198something. Most have been Osage with a couple Vine Maple, Black Locust and board bows when I lived on the Canadian border and had no decent wood to work. As much as I would love to participate I am going to have to pass. I moved back to Kansas and do not have any seasoned Hedge/ Osage. Love the community of brothers here and I am really looking forward to meeting a few of you at some gatherings this summer. I will certainly continue lurking and drooling over the selfbow works of art. Larry

Hey Larry, I bet someone here would help you with a seasoned stave......come on and join the fun.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 23, 2016, 10:40:02 pm
Heres where im at...I have 4 hickory staves that Ive roughly layed out...nothing much in stone yet.  I have found that when I reduce a stave I have the best luck laying the stave out from the belly side and starting about 2 inches wide.  Once I have the back profile roughed out to about 2 inches I then reduce the belly to a heavy uniform thickness  leaving room to still bring the stave to floor tiller.  I then once again reduce the limb width a little more now that I have a clearer picture of the belly.  I am amazed how some of you guys are able to lay bows out from the back...it never really works out for me so I opt to do it from the belly side with better success.  The stave I have reduced has a heavy deflex kink in one of the limbs so it will be interesting to see how that plays out.

(http://i.imgur.com/Opg1qOQ.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/E23nUsQ.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/akLpcgv.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/YPJrPF1.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/JVIE4eY.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 23, 2016, 11:25:42 pm
Lookin good guys. Computer problems seem to be fixed except the email server is going to be down for awhile. Half eye will take care of your questions if this server goes south on me tomorrow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: kid bow on January 23, 2016, 11:47:37 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/RK37sFA.jpg) (http://imgur.com/RK37sFA)
(http://i.imgur.com/o9AcOy8.jpg) (http://imgur.com/o9AcOy8)

not the best quality photo but Monday and teusday when I'm off of work ( finally!!!!) ill split up this osage orange and see what I can do for a stave. or maybe ill use the hackberry stave and sinew back it a  little bit.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 24, 2016, 12:44:28 am
Some nice staves being shown here. I'm glad to see you all showing enthusiasm.

kid bow, I have some hackberry that I spliced together from billets. I've never finished it but really like the feel of that wood.

If any if you guys are "needing a stave to work for the trade"  I've found some donated that you can have but you would be required to pay the shipping.

I also have some blanks that aren't tillered out that I would let go same terms.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 24, 2016, 03:06:36 am
Well, there's good news and bad news.
I will be taking a trip to Kansas sooner than I expected since my oldest sister died early yesterday and there will be a service down home. She struggled a lot through life with her own worst enemy but it was still sad and sudden. Don't know if any of you remember one of my first posts "Sisters Broken Bow", but it was hers. I don't need any condolences or such, I just feel fortunate to have what I do and I appreciate you all here.

Well, I havn't spoken much at all on here, But I been lurkin! This whole trade thing is a cool Idea. I have been carving out bows since 198something. Most have been Osage with a couple Vine Maple, Black Locust and board bows when I lived on the Canadian border and had no decent wood to work. As much as I would love to participate I am going to have to pass. I moved back to Kansas and do not have any seasoned Hedge/ Osage. Love the community of brothers here and I am really looking forward to meeting a few of you at some gatherings this summer. I will certainly continue lurking and drooling over the selfbow works of art. Larry
It would be a privilege to bring you a stave or even 2 for this trade if you could be so persuaded?

Not sure exactly when yet but I'll be between Lawrence and Fort Scott for a couple of days soon.
Let me know Larry.

You know, last time I entered this trade my dog died.

I just emailed Sleek hours before I found out about my sister and mentioned taking a springtime trip to Kansas with a bison hide for him and then I could ask the current owner of my Grandpas old farm there about cutting some osage for a tribute bow. For Christmas I sent my sister a photo from old negatives I found of her on my Grandpas motorcycle at the farm when she was about 6 years old. Now, in a way, I'll be lead back there by her and visiting where we were first born and raised with her ashes to spread. Interesting how things happen if you pay attention. It's beyond me, that's for sure.

Oh yeah, almost forgot...


Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 24, 2016, 06:39:24 am
Fred, Hedgehog or anybody else that wants in but got no wood I'll be happy to give you some dried Ironwood (HHB) and if you dont mind the saw will even cut it down to near bow size.....you cover shipping and the wood is yours....
rich

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 24, 2016, 08:37:12 am
Count me in. :)
Right hand, 45-55#, 26-28"
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on January 24, 2016, 08:54:56 am
I signed up a while back, but just noticed I never posted my stats. So here they are.

Right handed
40-60#
Draw- 24-28"


Tattoo Dave
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 24, 2016, 09:16:51 am
I've got Black locus and Osage staves dried out just can't get to them for blizzard we got here in Ky. But I do have 1 BL stave in the basement I just found. I'm gonna get started on it. Post pics later when I figure out how to do it again. It keeps saying the pic is to big.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 24, 2016, 09:21:16 am
Just a thanks to you, then, DuBois for generosity. The rest is unspoken by request, but there for all, I'm sure.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 24, 2016, 09:26:54 am
Hey Turtle & Gutshot glad to have ya join in fellas and welcome...

At it again Marco?  good on ya man
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on January 24, 2016, 09:47:15 am
Returning home is a wonderful thing dubois. For both of you.  Let me know when you are going to be in kansas. I will do everything i can to meet you up there. I am only 15 min away from the border.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 24, 2016, 09:53:59 am
I've been working the last couple days and will be off Monday and Tuesday. I'll get back on things then and this coming weekend.   I've got mt-13 epoxy for the sleeves but does it require heat to cure?  What is the best to use that doesn't require heat. I don't have a hotbox to put the staves in. Or do y'all have any other suggestions for the sleeves?  Thanks Tim

P.S.  I got the sleeves from Carson at Echo archery so their brass and steel.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 24, 2016, 10:00:16 am
Tim, MT 13 requires no heat. Nothing better for metal to wood bonding of sleeves. 24 hrs and you're good to go.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 24, 2016, 10:01:57 am
Thank you Sir! Thank what I was hoping to hear!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 24, 2016, 10:05:48 am
 ::)  I'm warning you all to be careful about that Sir ****  ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 24, 2016, 10:15:41 am
If anybody has trouble posting pictures email them to aaron.hollenbeck@gmail.com  with your username and I'll get them right up....I use imgur to upload pictures if anybody needs a walkthru on how to resize and upload pictures I'd be happy to help them.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 24, 2016, 11:48:20 am
::)I'm warning you all to be careful about that Sir ****

Hooah! Sir! Won't let it happen again sir.   ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 24, 2016, 01:05:41 pm
 ;D Do you guys realize we started this less than 48 hrs ago?

Here's some interesting stats:

We have 18 participants so far

As a percentage of participation vs hits, we beat the other two trades combined ;)

I'd like to see a few more pics of what everyone is going to be working on.

Also like to know either by a post or a PM if anyone doesn't have the proper tools they need to get started.

The list of participants will come out shortly and there are only a couple of entrants that  are not involved as much as I'd like. That does concern me. In the long run it's the only stipulation that really counts if we're to have 100% success rate with this trade.

One question at the moment for all of you: Who's ready to start laying out their profile on their stave or bow blank?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 24, 2016, 01:20:15 pm
I'm definitelt ready. Stave is picked, Sinew shredded, just need specs to pick out out my shape. I can't fully decide between bendy handle for compactness or a stiff handle to show off more of the beautiful ERC heartwood. I'm thinking a stiff handle. But it will be a mollegabet. Any idea of how much snake skin sheds will help as a moisture barrier when glued on with TB3? I know a full snake skin helps but I have a pair of ball pythons and would like to include their sheds on the bow when finished.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on January 24, 2016, 01:38:23 pm
It sounds like this is going well so far. Fred, I've got one stave at floor tiller, one bending to about 16" and one more roughed out. All bendy handles, cause those are the best ;)

Tattoo Dave
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 24, 2016, 01:42:05 pm
Fellas,
    got me some ironwood cut down to near size so it can have a couple days to come up to temp and get rid of any ice.....cut out for a couple of Penobscot.....
    While waiting on the wood, I'm going to be making an eastern type quiver in the long fringe style. The skin is fawn hide that was tanned long ago (cant remember if brain or acid), plan to have the quiver faded color, with Iconography, and twisted raw-hide strap. Think it will turn out well, but wont look like one of the plains style.
    Here's some pics
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 24, 2016, 01:44:50 pm
forgot toi say that the quiver is for the trade "incentive" system. Fred if ya get a chance let me know to send it to you or wait for ya to draw a name.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 24, 2016, 02:00:04 pm
My profiles are already done on two of my liklies. I've got a couple mor staves hhb that i got from half eye.  I need to know if they are seasoned. But likely he had them a while before I got them.  I need to put a curl on my scrapers and I'm ready to go!  Just got to get the hang of it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 24, 2016, 02:11:31 pm
This guys English is a bit too perfect for this old country boy but an an excellent example on how to finish off a scraper in case anyone besides myself has ever had that problem.

https://search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?p=sharpening+cabinet+scrapers&ei=UTF-8&hspart=mozilla&hsimp=yhs-002
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 24, 2016, 02:36:16 pm
I will be getting at it shortly.  Just needed to take care of a few honey-do things!

Pics will, of course, be in shortly as well.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on January 24, 2016, 02:50:06 pm
Oh man, this group is pumped.  This should be fun.  Glad we already have 18 signed up........hope we get 30.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hedgehog on January 24, 2016, 02:59:09 pm
That would be awesome Fred. Where in Nebraska are you located. I could possibly take a drive to pick up a stave.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: JW_Halverson on January 24, 2016, 03:14:46 pm
I favor the open trade, because as it has been said enough times in the past, this trade typifies the best qualities of this community. 

To that end, I am offering up some Black Hills Gold as a trade "sweetener".  One pint of raw, unfiltered honey from my beehives and a big lump of beeswax.  Just shoot me a p.m. telling me where to send it and when.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on January 24, 2016, 03:26:42 pm
My house and now.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hedgehog on January 24, 2016, 03:28:54 pm
Thanks for the offer to help. I just sent a message to, DuBois. I expect him to contact me about a meeting place soon to do some trading. I have many Osage staves but they are just too green. It is awesome to finally be in a group of like minded folks. Thanks for helping a brother out.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 24, 2016, 03:33:04 pm
 8) Thanks JW. You're a good man!!!
Hey guys how about we do a drawing right after picking names from the hat for the winner on this one. Everybody can use beeswax and honey.

hedgehog, I'm in central Nebraska about 40 miles Northwest of Grand Island.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 24, 2016, 03:34:26 pm
Just an update, I am working on the bow and taking pics, but I won't be able to post any pics until later. Rest assured that they will be uploaded later!

 :D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 24, 2016, 04:00:13 pm
Hey Timothy R.....That HHB is ready to work, sir. Cant say it's aged but it has been split for a year.

Sounds good Fred on the drawing
rich

PS: Fred, what about we see if we can get a few more new bowyers involved...maybe you fellas know some other guys who are committed and want to make a trade?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 24, 2016, 04:10:44 pm
I favor the open trade, because as it has been said enough times in the past, this trade typifies the best qualities of this community. 

To that end, I am offering up some Black Hills Gold as a trade "sweetener".  One pint of raw, unfiltered honey from my beehives and a big lump of beeswax.  Just shoot me a p.m. telling me where to send it and when.


Oh boy!  I have experienced SD gold before.  That is some wonderful stuff.

I have 4 staves reduced down.  One is floor tillerred.  Although the one that is floor tillerred is plan d.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 24, 2016, 04:18:53 pm
I just finished up night shifts this morning and start 12hr days tomorrow.  So I'm not going to get any staves dug out untill at least Thursday. On a side note I think I might get my brother talked into joining the trade also.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 24, 2016, 04:19:21 pm
Rich, I'm all for getting some of the newer guys involved. That's what this one is all about.
What do you other guys think.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 24, 2016, 04:22:35 pm
turtle, we can wait until Thursday. I won't have the drawing until everyone has posted a pic of their stave or bow blank. Thursday is the 28th and we didn't plan on drawing until the 1st day of the month. That still gives us over 6 months to get our act together.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: JW_Halverson on January 24, 2016, 04:27:12 pm
Rich, I'm all for getting some of the newer guys involved. That's what this one is all about.
What do you other guys think.

In the past, the trade has stood for inclusivity, with few exceptions.  You are the Trade Runner, your rules, though.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on January 24, 2016, 04:40:26 pm
Here a piece of ERC I have been working on...good up to brace height...ready for sinew-Hammertime(http://i1221.photobucket.com/albums/dd464/jeffreyakolste/43874c88-4122-45d4-8260-5664e422b703_zpslryoffmg.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 24, 2016, 04:48:44 pm
Son !!!!! that's a fancy stick right there Mr. Hammer
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 24, 2016, 05:02:49 pm
Wow!! That is a gorgeous chunk of wood. Looks like some of you guys are ready to roll,
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: JW_Halverson on January 24, 2016, 05:10:55 pm
Oh Lordy, Hamster...that ERC looks sweeeeet!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 24, 2016, 05:20:01 pm
I swear I can smell that ERC from here!! You are getting busy Mr. Hammer!

Here's front runner so far after some workin it down and heat sessions.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on January 24, 2016, 05:33:18 pm
yeah I really like it, light as a feather and easy to work. Just hope it holds up-Hammertime
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 24, 2016, 05:38:40 pm
final profile on #1.

And...another osage I started just prior to joining trade so it is in the running also.

I made it to the MIL's garage and got these 2 out of the rafters. I had been saving them for something and not sure that one of them won't become #1 before its over.

Kansas Mulberry  ;) and a monster ___?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 24, 2016, 05:54:46 pm
Sweet lookin ERC!  Everything looks awesome so fare!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 24, 2016, 06:28:37 pm
Got this one down to 1 3/4 "wide and the tips narrowed down to 3/4" next up I'll taper the belly down until I get some bend going.  I have a knot on the side of the stave that I left wide in case it does something funny when I start reducing the belly.  The knot heads in towards the center of the stave at an angle.
(http://i.imgur.com/HfpSgwN.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/QpMr6om.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 24, 2016, 06:36:30 pm
I remembered I had a sweet set of vinemaple billets from Bryce Ott hidden inside. Been saving these for a special occasion. Will still dig some osage  out of my shed for backups when I get the chance.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/20160124_180947.jpg)
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/20160124_181014.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 24, 2016, 06:41:29 pm
Man you guys are SMOKIN..... 8) 8) 8)

Turtle, maybe ya could use a big ol chunk of ironwood to convince your brother? Hell man the way all you fellas are gettin after it I'm way behind and by the time my wood thaws you all are gonna be workin on your second ones.....damned >:D >:D >:D >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 24, 2016, 06:43:26 pm
Heh, guess I'll be starting sooner even than I thought....just broke my new red maple Meare Heath bow tillering, which was the project I wanted to complete first. Now it's complete. :laugh:

re  stock -- I alreaady posted a pic of the elm stave I have for this trade bow, but I also have backups of two dry black birch staves, so I'm set to go. I would like to see who I've picked cause that will give me a better idea what I want to build for them -- the hard part is deciding what bow next!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Weylin on January 24, 2016, 06:50:54 pm
Heh, guess I'll be starting sooner even than I thought....just broke my new red maple Meare Heath bow tillering, which was the project I wanted to complete first. Now it's complete. :laugh:

re  stock -- I alreaady posted a pic of the elm stave I have for this trade bow, but I also have backups of two dry black birch staves, so I'm set to go. I would like to see who I've picked cause that will give me a better idea what I want to build for them -- the hard part is deciding what bow next!

Well, looks like you are on to PlanB... Sorry. I'll show myself out.  ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 24, 2016, 06:54:16 pm
Plan B,
     sorry about your red maple man....if it will help you out at all, I have some hard maple staves ready to work.....not many maybe 4-5 but you are welcome to them.
rich
Weylin, you a BAD man >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 24, 2016, 06:54:48 pm
 :laugh: :laugh: no prob Weylin. It was a good break.... from tillering.  :laugh: :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 24, 2016, 06:56:31 pm
I've got a little pile of sinew stripped out and some more pieces ready to be pounded. And here's the stave I'll be playing with and the workshop I'll do my carving. I just gotta put the clamp back in the bed.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on January 24, 2016, 06:57:16 pm
I'm pretty sure that meare heath bow that broke was started before this trade got started, correct?

Plan B, I was hoping that bow would make it, breaks happen to all of us though.

Rich you shouldn't be worried about the rest of us...I'm pretty sure you could make a bow in you sleep at this point. ;)

Tattoo Dave
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 24, 2016, 06:58:23 pm
Half Eye thanks kindly brother, but I'm all set that way.! Also been eying some HHB trees I've held off of, but seeing your hhb molly from awhile back has made me get an itch for a little winter chainsaw work.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 24, 2016, 07:00:31 pm
Man you guys are SMOKIN..... 8) 8) 8)

Turtle, maybe ya could use a big ol chunk of ironwood to convince your brother? Hell man the way all you fellas are gettin after it I'm way behind and by the time my wood thaws you all are gonna be workin on your second ones.....damned >:D >:D >:D >:D
rich
I would be afraid of ruining a good piece of hhb. He's the little feller on the left in this pic. Stands at 6'5".
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/misc/Pappyandbackup.jpeg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 24, 2016, 07:02:01 pm
I'm pretty sure that meare heath bow that broke was started before this trade got started, correct?

Plan B, I was hoping that bow would make it, breaks happen to all of us though.

Tattoo Dave

Yep, that's the one. Break was interesting though, and I'll write it up tomorrow when I stop crying. :laugh: :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 24, 2016, 07:03:18 pm
That's a pretty intimidating bunch you're hanging with.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 24, 2016, 07:10:08 pm
I think we are going to need a bigger boat......(Jaws)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 24, 2016, 07:13:45 pm
Ok, i would like to join the fun if yall will have me. A couple things, been havin trouble postin pics for a long while, like my past 4 bows. Lookin for a different pic poster app thing😄. And (b) i'm outta osage, have a bunch of hackberry which i have not worked before, but confident i could get a good bow from. So now its up to you guys to decide to take me.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 24, 2016, 07:28:50 pm
Hackberry is good bow wood just like Old Milwaukee is good beer.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 24, 2016, 08:02:10 pm
hey stix,
       send the old man a pm please....and dont forget to send Fred your info.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 24, 2016, 08:03:18 pm
Stix I can post pics for you and I can show u how to use imgur which is what I use....I'm sure Fred will still bring you on.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 24, 2016, 08:17:18 pm
Here's the hackberry i will b workin. My specs are, 45-55# @ 26-28". Any style would be awesome
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 24, 2016, 08:18:44 pm
Awesome, finally found a pic app that works😄
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 24, 2016, 09:50:21 pm
Alright I finally have some pics to put up. This first one is the staves I will be working/ choosing from top to bottom we have:  HHB, Rock Elm, Spalted Hazel, and the beech art bow I mentioned before with the snake limbs.
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/staves%204%20bow%20trade_zpswuocbbb5.jpg)

I'm kinda leaning toward the spalted hazel. The biggest reason being that the wood itself is almost a one of a kind, and gorgeous to boot. When I asked about the wood, no one had seen anything like it before. I was warned that spalted wood may be an issue, but it was confined to the center of the stave. I made a stiff handle and kept the spalting out of the working areas and ended up with a good looking nice shooting bow in the 55# range.
Here's that bow and the sister stave from the first pic.
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/spalted%20hazel%20stave%20amp%20bow_zps6bg5tlzv.jpg)
Here's  better shots of the coloration on the stave and the close to finished bow.
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/hazel%20heartwood2_zpsbxmp2t36.jpg)
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/spalted%20hazel%20bow%20handle_zpsn9xkikyl.jpg)

I'll have to let the wood dictate what kind of bow it wants to be, but the plan is to keep it simple until I'm sure the wood will co-operate. My #2 will be a mollie from the HHB, which is a build I'm comfortable and confident with.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 24, 2016, 09:54:08 pm
I remember that wood. Amazing color!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 24, 2016, 10:07:25 pm
Gorgeous color on that wood kid!! I got one of the limbs to floor tiller on the first hickory stave I'm working.  I'm having trouble with imgur uploading photos now that I said I could do it!!  Ain't technology grand?!  I think I will get the bow to a solid even floor tiller maybe even low brace and get started on another one.  I cut this wood last year about this time and it has been in the garage so I may weigh the blanks and monitor them closely for weight loss now that I Wil be keeping them inside.  Hopefully I'll have some pics up later.  Everybody seems to be making great headway.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 24, 2016, 10:29:20 pm
While waiting to find out who I get, I thought maybe I should have a stave ready to go that would make a nice bendy handle bow.  I started cleaning the back up on this piece of hhb. 

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/2E2FDF72-9F16-42BD-971A-147B46068826_zpsnsjbj6h1.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/2E2FDF72-9F16-42BD-971A-147B46068826_zpsnsjbj6h1.jpg.html)

I am seeing some awesome pieces of wood posted so far.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on January 24, 2016, 10:40:35 pm
It sounds tempting, but before committing, can someone clarify a little?  Maybe I missed it in the post, but how much time is there to complete one, that is, when is the ship date?  Also, is it usually just a bow plus a few arrows or do you include quivers, cases, etc.?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 24, 2016, 10:46:50 pm
Wow, all of these nice staves! I have 2 billets of ash that I will tackle in the near future, but for now...

Here's my humble offering to the mix:

(http://i.imgur.com/5zTL0hq.jpg)

This will be a bamboo backed osage bow.  I made decent progress today getting the bamboo thinned (it was about 1/2 inch thick to begin with)... I still need to do a little more work (tapering the thickness mainly), but so far so good!

(http://i.imgur.com/IOoKe4z.jpg)


(http://i.imgur.com/E8vi04J.jpg)

Here's the splice for the osage.  I'll need to clean the cuts a tish more to make them fit tightly, but soon enough it'll be one piece of bamboo and osage!

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 24, 2016, 10:54:02 pm
Hey folks!
If you all willing to let a novice bow builder in I'd like to give it a go this year. I bit intimidating I must say, it's not like I can build bows like you guys but I'm no quitter :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 24, 2016, 11:02:56 pm
I believe the ship date was/is the end of August. This is an open invite trade, as long as you give it your all, no one will be upset. I'd advise to have had at least a couple of successful bows to your credit. Those first couple bows can be plenty hard enough without added pressures of deadlines and knowing it's ending up in another bowyers hands. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 24, 2016, 11:52:50 pm
Ok I'm in.
26"-28"  with "regular" bows. Open to shortys with shorter draw.
40-60#
Right handed
I'd be very happy with any style bow!

I'll be working on these. In case one fail I got a backup.
Twisty Lilac and an Ash sapling.
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8238.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8238.jpg.html)
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8239.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8239.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jeffp51 on January 25, 2016, 12:04:36 am
Ok, I have been hesitating, but I would like to be in.  I am getting pretty confident about making a good bow if I have a good stave to work with--which is my problem at the moment.  I have a couple of staves, one or two of which look pretty good--but I also have standing commitments for for two of them.--I have to finish one for my son, since the bow I was making him for Christmas broke in the tillering. Half Eye Fred, both of you have offered to help the stave-poor. Can we work something out?

My stats:
50-55#
29" draw
Right Handed
I like to shoot from a rest
open for any style
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 25, 2016, 12:31:12 am
I dug some more staves out. I think I'm set for staves.  I have three Osage blanks and and a few billets one set is red Osage. And three hhb and one ERC stave.  I'm excited about this trade. Ready to get going again.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on January 25, 2016, 12:53:49 am
If that is spalted as you say, get ready for heart ache. Spalting is a sign of fungal rot. Dont use it, its not safe. It makes good handles and tips though.


Alright I finally have some pics to put up. This first one is the staves I will be working/ choosing from top to bottom we have:  HHB, Rock Elm, Spalted Hazel, and the beech art bow I mentioned before with the snake limbs.
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/staves%204%20bow%20trade_zpswuocbbb5.jpg)

I'm kinda leaning toward the spalted hazel. The biggest reason being that the wood itself is almost a one of a kind, and gorgeous to boot. When I asked about the wood, no one had seen anything like it before. I was warned that spalted wood may be an issue, but it was confined to the center of the stave. I made a stiff handle and kept the spalting out of the working areas and ended up with a good looking nice shooting bow in the 55# range.
Here's that bow and the sister stave from the first pic.
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/spalted%20hazel%20stave%20amp%20bow_zpskprvbxfh.jpg)
Here's  better shots of the coloration on the stave and the close to finished bow.
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/hazel%20heartwood2_zpsbxmp2t36.jpg)
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/spalted%20hazel%20bow%20handle_zpsn9xkikyl.jpg)

I'll have to let the wood dictate what kind of bow it wants to be, but the plan is to keep it simple until I'm sure the wood will co-operate. My #2 will be a mollie from the HHB, which is a build I'm comfortable and confident with.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 25, 2016, 06:24:59 am
Jeffp51,
     I have HHB (ironwood), some hard maple, and I believe a stick or two of Ash (high crown) if you cover the shipping.....and I have the length you want....you can have the wood.

I am real glad to see you fellas join up.....you are not "allowed" folks you are most "welcome". Remember that we got a nice bunch here so feel free to seek advice, material or what ever......and have some fun with this.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 25, 2016, 06:30:42 am
Alright, let me do this right this time. Bow specs are RH - 45-55# @ 26-28" and any style bow would be awesome. I'm will only ship in the U.S. , but willing to chip in some $ to help anyone with shipping.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 25, 2016, 06:48:47 am
Hey Loope,
      The trade is for a bow.....nothing else...if ya saw that quiver in my post I'm making that for Fred to use in the monthly draw we are doing.....you might win it but sure do not need to make one, or arrows for that matter........man if ya want to make a bow and get a bow then sign up....just make sure you want to do it and make a commitment to get it done.....lots of good people already signed up so there is plenty of assistance available if you want it.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 25, 2016, 09:50:29 am
Hey fellas,
     Was talking with Fred and thought some things could stand to be re-iterated. So bare with me here.
    1. for the real new guys....if you follow the trade directions, through this thing you will be about guaranteed to make a bow you can be proud of.
     2. By posting progress pics and narrative you will be just about making a "how-to" or build along and in so doing if problems look like they are gonna raise they ugly head we can all help each other through these steps.....with help and support I dont see how you can fail.
    3. Just because some of the more experienced seem to be ahead of you, dont sweat the small stuff cause it will get easier for you too, hell by this time next year you will be expected to help out the new guys too 8)
    4. Fred and his running of this great trade are designed so that you cant fail.....so be committed, stay committed, and if ya need help .....say so

As a way of making this a better learning experience you older hands will also help by regularly posting your progress. Ya never know whats going to be an inspiration, or problem solver or whatever to any bow builders with less experience than you.

With the people we have, this can be the best trade ever. Do not worry about dealines, how your bow compares etc etc  you will be investing a piece of your life into this so as long as you are giving it your best shot. Every one of these bows will be a proud addition to anybodys collection

A long time ago a certain fine gentleman sent me a small bendy osage bow, might have been his first.....anyway that bow killed me a nice fat doe (matter of fact went clean through) and I posted pictures ....the bow looks like a toy propped up on the hangin deer. He wasn't sure about the bow, but I am....took it to the woods, shot hell out of it,  and everytime I look at it it all good and so are the memories. Would not trade that bow or Freds time for anything.

This is going to be the best fellas....so lets get ready to rumble 8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 25, 2016, 10:34:06 am
I've started a BLACK LOCUS with some twist and bend in it. Nothing a little or a lot of heat want take care of. My daughter asked me if this was ginning to be her new bow and I told her about the trade and she said it had to have snake skins, cause every body loves snake skins. She also said she is going to make the string for this trade bow so she can be part of the trade. That comes from a 12yr old girl. I love it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 25, 2016, 10:42:25 am
Man Oh Man!
There's some cool lookin sticks flyin around in here!
Really great to see the way this is taking off!

Ok I'm in.
26"-28"  with "regular" bows. Open to shortys with shorter draw.
40-60#
Right handed
I'd be very happy with any style bow!

I'll be working on these. In case one fail I got a backup.
Twisty Lilac and an Ash sapling.
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8238.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8238.jpg.html)
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8239.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8239.jpg.html)

Hey J.
Hows that lilac work with heat and bending?
Nobody took the bait on my pic earlier but it was a monster lilac an old fella let me cut from his front yard. I may have to go help him clean up his yard again this year  ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 25, 2016, 10:49:43 am
Gutshot,  That young lady has some serious game right there.....maybe you ought to put her name in (I'd love to build that bow)....seriously maybe you could email me some stats?
rousseau.rd@att.net
rich

Mr. DuBois, you got that right sir.....if that young lady would like a bow maybe you would have a couple small buffalo horn tips around if you want to kick in some "bling"?
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 25, 2016, 10:54:50 am
Thanks about the comments on my daughter she loves to hunt and shoot bows. But I can't put her name in the trade I don't think she can make a bow to send out lol. Oh ya she did shoot her first deer this year and I was more fired up about that kill than any I've ever took
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ryan C on January 25, 2016, 11:07:29 am
Can I still join?

45-55#
Right handed
26"-28"
Any style including a shorter draw would be great.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 25, 2016, 11:20:17 am
You're in Ryan and thanks for joining. I'm sitting here at home working up a spreadsheet and saw your message. You forgot to give me your zip code.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 25, 2016, 11:26:38 am
Gutshot, 
        I had a drawing for this month's most helpfull, and she won. So she gets her choice of what kind of bow she wants......she doesn't have to make a bow.....hell she made need to make a string for "her" new bow.
      The offer stands and I'd be proud to make it
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 25, 2016, 11:37:37 am
Half Eye, thanks and I'm sure when she finds out she will be in the garage crafting something up in return. That's just how she is. Thanks again
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 25, 2016, 11:38:39 am
Turtle talked me into it, I'm in
45# - 55#
RH
Don't care what stlye, will love it regardless.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 25, 2016, 11:44:26 am
Hey Otter,
Good to see ya here.

Gutshot
Neat deal with your daughter being involved. She's gonna be one happy campoer with that H.E. bow.

I'm gonna have so many bows roughed out soon I won't be done til next years trade  ::) ;D

Here's the lilac at 80" and awaiting some specs. Might be more than I can chew on this one but we'll see.


Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 25, 2016, 11:51:22 am
That looks awesome , really nice and snaky... I have no doubt it will come out nicely... It will be one sweet stick lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 25, 2016, 12:30:07 pm
Profile of top limb tapered
(http://i.imgur.com/zo01Mjf.jpg)
Knot near tip
(http://i.imgur.com/zvceWKA.jpg)
Knot near fade
(http://i.imgur.com/UPmomzF.jpg)

Knot near the tip should go away the one near the fade will hopefully go away during tillering...depends on what I need for draw weight I suppose.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on January 25, 2016, 12:30:30 pm
Dakota Kid. I didnt read closely enough to see where you stated you removed all the spalting damage. That is probably one of thw sweetest most aesthetically pleasing bows i have seen in a long time. I love it. Any chance of a full draw? If you have any more of that wood, perhaps a trade could be worked out?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 25, 2016, 01:32:43 pm
Hey guys I just finished a spreadsheet and have everyone's info organized. Only missing a couple of emails (Rich  ;D) and 1 phone #.

Latest count is 23 not including myself as back up.

I really appreciate all of your involvement and especially the pics of which we're only missing a few.
Once these all get posted we'll move onto the next stage stave/ bow layout for the new guys that aren't there yet.
Some of you have already passed this stage and won't need to re-post. I don't figure it will take long to complete this stage and then we'll move onto removing wood and floor tillering for those who haven't done this before.

As we progress through each step making sure no one is left behind I figure we will be into long string tillering by the 2nd month with everyone still on board and a few of you possibly finished.

I don't want any of you new guys at this stage trying to jump ahead of the rest of us. The experienced bowyers will be guiding you the remainder of the way through this process.

Make sure you take pics and ask questions through every stage and we'll make sure you send a bow on to your recipient that you can be proud of. In fact I want you to like the bow you built so much that you cry when have to send it on. We call that tears of joy.

All the old timers here have a message box!!! If you have any questions don't hesitate to PM someone for help. And my PM box is there also. If any of you have any suggestions I will listen.

When this first started I wanted to do a match up for bowyers with similar experience and  tattoo dave suggested that it should be a drawing just like the old original trades. Everyone seemed to agree with Dave's suggestion so guess what? He probably saved the trade. Thanks Dave.

And I can't begin to tell you how many suggestions half eye brought to my attention but without him this trade might be going nowhere.

So let's get started and have some fun!!! >>>-----> Fred

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 25, 2016, 01:44:53 pm
Oh, and by the way. No bows will be shipped out until we're all finished with our project. If we keep this organized we should be finished inside of 4 months.  ;)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PEARL DRUMS/PEARLY/PD/DRUMS on January 25, 2016, 01:56:35 pm
Even though I'm an insider, cool kid, pro, a-hole or whatever else "somebody" has labeled me. I'd be glad to offer advice if I'm asked. Always have and always will. You don't make the top 10 poster list by not helping people every chance you get, unless you just run your mouth all day... :) And I do that sometimes to.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 25, 2016, 02:13:43 pm
Hey PD, I've always appreciated your advice. You've helped me countless number of times so I'm always interested in listening. If you have any suggestions for me drop me a PM. I'll listen and respond.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 25, 2016, 02:17:05 pm
Fred Arnold, I pm you ... Did you get it?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Blaflair2 on January 25, 2016, 02:23:17 pm
RH 50-60lbs
27-29" draw

Thanks for running it
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on January 25, 2016, 02:30:42 pm
Geez, I'd better get busy.  You "eager beavers" are going to leave me behind.  Here are two hickory staves I'm considering.  Probably go with the one on the left.  The one on the right would work well if I cut it in half, flipped it end for end and spliced the handle together.....might do that too.  I'll wait and see who I draw and what their specs are.


(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Hickory%20Staves_zpszpmzzy0g.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Hickory%20Staves_zpszpmzzy0g.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 25, 2016, 02:45:52 pm
Dang Drew,  good lookin lumber right there.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on January 25, 2016, 03:19:22 pm
Dang Drew,  good lookin lumber right there.
rich

The one on the right has a "dip" about mid way that might be a pain.....that's why I was thinking of cutting that stave in half and splicing the handle.....solve that problem ;-)  This is some shagbark hickory salvaged from a road widening project.....thank you DOT!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: wizardgoat on January 25, 2016, 03:46:36 pm
Thanks Fred for keeping this going
Some great bows will come out of this no doubt
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 25, 2016, 04:34:37 pm
I figure if might as well show everyone the face behind the coon. And my apprentice for the trade  cabinetbowguy. For those that don't know me I'm the blonde beard.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 25, 2016, 05:03:09 pm
Well I can't wait any longer with all this wood flying around, so this afternoon I grabbed one of my black birch staves, shaved it down some, marked it, chopped and rasped, and got a bow going. It's got a good amount of reflex in the stave, but two of the bows I did already started out with more.

Man you got to work hard around here not to fall behind!

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBBirch1.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 25, 2016, 05:18:22 pm
That's one heck of a plan b man...can't wait to see more.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 25, 2016, 05:25:59 pm
Well guys we're almost full up. Couple more days and I'll draw your victim and send you all an email with the vital information and stats.

I'm pretty excited about this years trade!!

I know I already said that I wasn't going to be involved in the trade but  if you guys will have me I'd sure like to join in. Take a vote and let me know what you think.

Thank you all very very much.
Fred
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on January 25, 2016, 05:34:51 pm
Are board bows allowed? I just got two staves from DuBois, But guess what? I already have two people that want me to make them a bow! Go figure!  Lol
If someone here has a stave, I'd be willing to buy it. I think this would be a really cool to participate in..... I can always wait until next year's trade if need be.

Also... I saw that Half Eye said "We are just trading bows", but I want to be sure...  No arrows, or anything? JUST the bow?(and string of course)

I will PM you in just a minute, Fred.  :D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on January 25, 2016, 05:47:05 pm
Fred, my vote is a big YES.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 25, 2016, 05:51:59 pm
Wow this thing is taking off!  I have been debating back and forth as I have lots going on, but...Fred and others have inspired me to jump in.  Fred count me in if it is not too late.  (just have to finish a few FG bows before I can start  :o)

40-50#
27-29" draw
Any style.
Shoot RH
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 25, 2016, 06:03:00 pm
Asking for a vote if Fred can participate, uhhhhhhhh, let me think.................. ::)

YESSSSSSS!!!!! :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:


Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 25, 2016, 06:05:27 pm
Thanks ajooter!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on January 25, 2016, 06:12:01 pm
lots of great looking sticks out there! Of course your in Fred and a huge thank you! Currently shredding sinew for my ERC-Hammertime
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 25, 2016, 06:34:53 pm
Well this is filling up a little faster than I anticipated. I think we're about done!! I've got a few people who committed but haven't shown any activity as of yet so we may have room for just a few more.

I think I'll shut it down shortly and then let the games begin!!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 25, 2016, 06:37:46 pm
I vote Fred in!!!  Thanks for all your work already.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 25, 2016, 06:40:00 pm
Definitely a yes Fred!   And David I have that stave if you need it know. I don't have the funds to ship till Wednesday after next but like I said in the pm it's yours. If you want to handle shipping we can just forgo the hides.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 25, 2016, 06:58:24 pm
Sweet Jesus Fred......now look what ya went and done   >:D >:D >:D  Man this is some kinda good here  8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 25, 2016, 07:01:38 pm
I expected you couldn't stay out of this Fred of course we all want you in!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 25, 2016, 07:03:24 pm
Okay guys. I'm shutting it down. I may have a few late comers that I'll allow in as backup yet this evening but then it's time for the fat lady to sing.

I'm excited to be part of this trade. What a great bunch of guys. I'm just sorry we didn't have any ladies join us.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 25, 2016, 07:04:48 pm
If you want to shave some wood Fred, I say go for it!

Oh, and as for a picture of what we look like, here's one from Christmas (about the best one that I could find without digging deep!).

(http://i.imgur.com/nTYDMT3.jpg)

As for progress pics on the bow, I will be working on jigs and forms this week.  If you guys want pictures of those, I will oblige.  Otherwise, it'll probably be next weekend when I get to the glue-up.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 25, 2016, 07:14:44 pm
Hey Otter,
Good to see ya here.

Gutshot
Neat deal with your daughter being involved. She's gonna be one happy campoer with that H.E. bow.

I'm gonna have so many bows roughed out soon I won't be done til next years trade  ::) ;D

Here's the lilac at 80" and awaiting some specs. Might be more than I can chew on this one but we'll see.
That is a nice lilac! How many stave you got going? I'd be really interested in seeing anything you come up with especially if you go ahead with the lilac.  Is that a big check in it?
I haven't tried bending it yet but I think I'll steam the clean side but I'm not sure if I should maybe go dry on the side with the scar and knot.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 25, 2016, 07:22:32 pm
How do you guys think I should straighten this one, dry or steam? Does the wood swell with steam? I'm afraid the scar could open up if the wood moves too much.

(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8236.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8236.jpg.html)
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8230.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8230.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 25, 2016, 07:28:54 pm
I went digging through pictures of me and found the best one I could find.

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2015-08/0D7FFFD6-CE38-4C84-BB02-402F4BB181B4_zpsndjm7qi7.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2015-08/0D7FFFD6-CE38-4C84-BB02-402F4BB181B4_zpsndjm7qi7.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 25, 2016, 07:35:28 pm
Swampman:
Ha! That's what I look like at work when I save kids from lead.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 25, 2016, 07:38:59 pm
I was painting some vintage metal cabinets for our kitchen with some nasty epoxy paint.  I had to capture the moment with a selfie. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 25, 2016, 07:39:35 pm
Ok here's me.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 25, 2016, 07:39:59 pm
J, think I'd steam that, it might not make it either way but I believe steam is your best bet. I am probably the only guy on the site that uses steam only.....so you may wish to see if one of the other guys chimes in.

Damn swampman we could recognize that mug anywhere 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 25, 2016, 07:40:27 pm
OOp!
Here we go.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 25, 2016, 07:43:29 pm
jandersson, I've got a few of those on my shop rack. I'm waiting for more experience but what the heck if you've got a backup go for it. We'll help you out. If it works that could make a fine character bow.

How wide is it at the knot below and if you eliminate the knot how much do you have left" Also how wide at the limb at the crevice?

I agree with half eye. With that type of crevice dry heat would probably crack it. You may want to steam it first and take the twist out. Then see what it will take for alignment.

I can't say for sure but it looks like you should take the twist out at the knot.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 25, 2016, 07:44:26 pm
Marco, I knew right off you was lying in that first picture cause thats way to good lookin to be you. Glad ya fessed up sir  >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 25, 2016, 07:54:51 pm
sleek,

The dark coloration runs the length of the stave like heartwood. On the finished bow, I removed all but a few traces of it along the limb bellies. Where it remained it left some nice "flames" in the fades and runs the length of the handle. The only other piece with the same color out of the 8 stave I cut is the one I'm building for the trade. I know how it formed, so there may be some more lurking in the hazel grave where I cut from. The original tree had a "Y" right near the ground. The other branch had died and fallen leaving a big hollow knot hole. Over time it filled with organics which then turned to soil. There was actually a small maple sprout growing out of it last time I walked by. The fungus in that soil entered the stave at that "y and ran up the center. Only the first 1/2 foot of the stave had a rotten center. The rest of the way up was that wonderful chocolate colored stain. I'll be up near that patch of hazel every day this week. I'll keep my eyes peeled for a similar situation in another tree. If I find one, I'll be glad to set up a trade. Let's just hope I can find a straight one.

I'll try to get a full write up on that bow posted in it's own thread in the next couple days. I had intended to do so anyway seeing how it's probably one of the prettiest bows I've made thus far.

Thanks for your interest.   
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 25, 2016, 08:03:10 pm
Jandersson - that is one challenging looking stave!  I would also suggest steam - probably going to take several sessions!  :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 25, 2016, 08:03:48 pm
Half eye, Fred:
What you think of putting a clamp across the limb where the scar is just to keep it from moving to much?
The limb is about 2 1/4 across the knot and 1" over the scar. It kind of a Mollegabeth design and I put the knot on the fade to make it less of a problem i guess but I agree with you Fred about get the twist out where the knot is.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 25, 2016, 08:07:51 pm
Jandersson,

With a crack like that I's be tempted to clean it out and fill it with a powdered antler and hide glue paste. You could probably even do it before attempting to heat correct. The heat should just warm up the glue allowing for some movement. Sorry I have no tips on steam bending. I dry heat correct for the most part.

If you want to experiment Simson fumes his bows with ammonia and says they get quite bendy while the ammonia is still in the wood. It may change the color but it supposedly make the wood like a wet noodle.

Oh and I say go ahead and join Fred, but you better not end up with the sweetest looking bow. :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 25, 2016, 08:08:25 pm
Hey JA, how long has that lilac been dried? Just curious if that would make a dif on the heating.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 25, 2016, 08:09:46 pm
Fred -

I am not sure what I will build - kinda thinking I might want to wait for my name to decide - if that is ok.  :-\  Have several options - hedge, mulberry, hackberry, ironwood, ERC, ash, hickory.  Also maybe thinking about a trilam if that is primitive enough.  Pics to come soon!

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 25, 2016, 08:10:43 pm
The TBB also mentions using temporary sinew wraps while over flexing highly reflexed staves until they are broken in. You'd have to use something other than sinew because of the heat but wrapping in spectra line might work to hold it together.   
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 25, 2016, 08:10:58 pm
Welcome on board Fred!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 25, 2016, 08:14:25 pm
JA, I say stick the end of that sucker in a boiling pot for an hour and then clamp and bend the snot out o it. If it breaks just remember, I am often not right  ::)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 25, 2016, 08:15:38 pm
Well, this wasn't supposed to be any more than a quick photo to check tiller at partial draw with this week's Meare Heath bow. But it's one of the few recent pics of me at all. The bow was tillered more, shot 25 arrows through it just short of full draw, and while final tillering it broke just at full draw and 52 lbs. So it's also the only pic of the bow intact and working, too.

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/MHTillering.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 25, 2016, 08:21:26 pm
jandersson, can you post a pic of the belly side from the knot to the tip? And DuBois might have the right idea with that boiling water. It may also make it easier to clean out any rot in that crevice but I still would like to see the belly profile.

Mitch, no problem. We should have names by tomorrow evening.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on January 25, 2016, 08:30:15 pm
I guess I'm in!

RH
40-60lb
25-27 (maybe up to about 29 if my dad decides to shoot it)

Once I find a stave, I'll post a few pictures! Can't wait to see all of the bows traded! :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 25, 2016, 08:38:46 pm
Well guys we're almost full up. Couple more days and I'll draw your victim and send you all an email with the vital information and stats.

I'm pretty excited about this years trade!!

I know I already said that I wasn't going to be involved in the trade but  if you guys will have me I'd sure like to join in. Take a vote and let me know what you think.

Thank you all very very much.
Fred
I vote yes most certainly!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 25, 2016, 08:42:03 pm
Here's me my wife and the kiddos last week when we got our first snow. It was gone by the end of the day. Today was a nice 60 degrees.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 25, 2016, 08:43:32 pm
Waiting on a few more replies. I've had 1 back out. Is 28-30 big enough or do you guys want more?

Great family pic TR.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 25, 2016, 08:52:06 pm
Fred - I guess its ok you want to be in and make a bow.   :laugh:  I would love to get a bow from "Munson Creek"!  I vote your in.

Here is a pic of my ugly mug in my small shop "tinkering" around - which I do almost every evening.

I also ran out to the storage garage and snapped a few photos of my stash of some staves - all dry and ready to go as soon as I bring one in and warm it up!

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 25, 2016, 08:54:24 pm
Mitch I'm embarrassed  :-[ I'm not posting a picture of my shop after that one popped up.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 25, 2016, 08:58:14 pm
Nice looking bow too PlanB - to bad she broke!

60 in Oklahoma!  We just broke the freezing mark for the first time in quite a while - nice family picture!

DuBois - I kinda like the first pic - but I am a dog guy.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 25, 2016, 09:00:43 pm
I probably had just cleaned it before that pic.   :laugh:  I was helping a youngster make his first bow - a hackberry pyramid.  We had to take a few pics.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 25, 2016, 09:02:26 pm
Whoa! Thats the cleanest most organised shop i've ever seen. Nice. Well i'm not gonna officially start til thursday or friday. Gotta completely finish my current bow first. ( cant start another til one is finished).
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on January 25, 2016, 09:21:08 pm
If not too late, would love to get in.

29 to 31"
Right hand
50-60 pound
any style

I am going out to sort through some staves that I have had drying, looking through some red bud, hickory, or white oak.  Will pick out a couple good ones and post some pics.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 25, 2016, 09:39:11 pm
Every body else seems to be throwing there mug shots off so here is Me and my girl with her first deer
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 25, 2016, 09:42:35 pm
Jandersson - that is one challenging looking stave!  I would also suggest steam - probably going to take several sessions!  :laugh:
I figured the more challenging the more I'll learn. I hear ya, go slow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 25, 2016, 09:57:31 pm
Can't believe the turn out fellas this should be a great time!!  I got my lower limb tapered and a piece of zebrawood glued on the handle.  I rounded both limbs tips down in preparation for cutting strings nocks.  I ended up cutting a nock in the lower limb and I quit there.  I'll try and get pics of the progress up soon.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 25, 2016, 09:58:58 pm
Gutshot - she looks mighty happy.  My daughter and I rifle hunt together too.  I look forward to it each year and they are always a few of the best days of the year - good times.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: dylanholderman on January 25, 2016, 10:02:37 pm
i'm in  ;D
LH
50-70# draw weight
28-30" draw length
any style i'm not real particular  :)

i'll have a pic of my stave(s) up shortly my phone doesn't want to upload it :-\
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: dylanholderman on January 25, 2016, 10:07:39 pm
here we go
from left to right. a short character osage stave, honeysuckle >:D, and half a snaky hophornbeam sapling 
(http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w411/dylanholderman/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/98701318-1EFF-47DE-B226-D44B86DCE023.jpg) (http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/dylanholderman/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/98701318-1EFF-47DE-B226-D44B86DCE023.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 25, 2016, 10:18:37 pm
Members list is up on the front page. Might? be a few additions.
Drawing Tomorrow
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 25, 2016, 10:31:41 pm
That osage has a preformed arrow shelf. It just screams center shot.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on January 25, 2016, 10:56:50 pm
Here is my entry, and its backups just in case.

Left to right:  red bud (sapwood & cambium showing), white oak, red bud (down to heartwood), dogwood, and hickory

I am going to try the middle stave first... red bud
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on January 25, 2016, 10:58:08 pm
Ooops, hit post instead of attach...

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 25, 2016, 11:08:39 pm
I'm not familiar with red bud. It's got a nice color, kinda like well seasoned BL. How does it perform?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 25, 2016, 11:09:57 pm
Loope I really like the looks of that stave.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 25, 2016, 11:17:20 pm
I picture it with a nice set of copperhead skins, just enough Sssss to make it work.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 25, 2016, 11:22:18 pm
Dakota Kid:I like the wrapping Idea, much better than using a clamp which I was thinking about doing. Can I use sawdust instead of powdered antler?
DuBois: I roughed out the bow right after I cut it about two years ago and been sitting in my cold basement ever since.
            I'm leaning towards wrapping it and steam/boil it, can't decide...maybe it won't make a difference which I use.
Fred: Here's the belly of that area. The grain in the lever is a bit funny, I think I had to get a big bad check out of there :)
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8242_1.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8242_1.jpg.html)
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8240_1.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8240_1.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on January 25, 2016, 11:25:49 pm
Yes, I love the looks of that red bud.  The color and shape just grabbed my attention.

I needed to cut the tree down, and knew that red bud is related to locust, so it should make a good bow, but was surprised at the color and that the sapwood is so thin.  On a tree roughly 8 or 9 inch diameter, the sapwood is probably only 3/8 inch thick.  It is beautiful wood I think.

I haven't used any red bud yet, other than cutting some small pieces from another log to use for overlay material.  It seems to work nicely.

Next step is getting down to one growth ring.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 25, 2016, 11:34:30 pm
mwosborn:
I could drop my peanut butter sandwich upside down on your work table and have no issues with finishing that sandwich.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jeffp51 on January 25, 2016, 11:36:28 pm
Here are a couple of staves I am thinking about.  One is a White oak floor tillered stave I got in the Christmas trade.  It has already been through a few hands, so it might be a nice community project to get to a new bowyer.  The other is an elm stave from a neighbor's tree.  I haven't had much luck with this siberian elm so far, but this one is a different tree, and feels stronger than the others I have played with so far, and the stave is also cleaner.

the other picture is from last year's trade, and shows off my best bow so far, and my best side.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 25, 2016, 11:51:46 pm
jandersson,

The antler will be a stronger patch. I prefer the powdered antler in most cases where taking stress is more important than the fill matching the wood color. If you don't have access to powdered antler, sawdust would be a suitable substitute, I wonder about bone meal, but have never used it so I can't make a recommendation. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 26, 2016, 12:04:08 am
Dakota Kid,
Epoxy? Or is saying that like swearing in church in this neck of the woods?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 26, 2016, 12:25:56 am
Most epoxy won't be very flexible. Plus that stave's too pretty for epoxy. Sawdust or antler and hide glue or TB3 would be my choice.

It's not exactly swearing like mentioning FG, but it's close. :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 26, 2016, 12:46:38 am
I don't like the grain runoff towards the tips especially with that much twist. I'm hoping some of the more experienced members here jump in to give their opinions. Maybe hammertime, turtle, or one of the others guys will give their opinion.

It might be a good idea to post all of the pics in a new topic under the bows section. There are a lot of guys over there with vast experience with character staves that might not be checking on what we're doing here.

That's what I'd do before I tackled it.

Pearl Drums said he would help. You might PM him and get his opinion.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on January 26, 2016, 04:57:21 am
Hope I sneaked in under the wire. Here are my stats: anything under 45# at 26 to 28" draw although I don't mind short bow and short draw, I'm a lefty and have no preference as to type or style, whatever my partner wants to make is fine by me.  This should be fun.

Not much of my stash is seasoned fully but (https://stuckinthemudsite.files.wordpress.com/2016/01/image2.jpg)

left to right, holly, split yew stave (mostly sap wood but might make nice take-down), blackthorn and hazel - the hazel is really lovely so thats most likely candidate at the moment

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 26, 2016, 06:56:36 am
Mr. Anderson,
        Looking at the picture of the belly side of your stave I believe that you can not successfully bend that limb laterally. I took the liberty of marking one of your pics to point out a grain sworel....it runs perpendicular to the knot on the bows back. Even on pristine wood you shouldn't try that bend because of the grain at that point.......
      Having said that I went back to your original picture where you are looking down the long axis and it sure does look like if you put a string from tip to tip it would be damned near center of the grip, and if thats so then you could steam to remove some propeller twist in the lever....and if a small amount of string alignment is needed then go to side string knocks......
      I cant see or touch your stave but to me I dont think you need a whole lot of movement. Just something to consider.
rich 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 26, 2016, 07:33:18 am
I agree Rich. If you leave the entire area stiff for levers and take out the twist you may have a good chance of making it work. IMO you should follow the grain as close as possible on the entire tip end. That's why I wanted to know how long it was.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 26, 2016, 07:48:03 am
A little tweak at the handle can bring the tips right into alignment as well
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PatM on January 26, 2016, 07:50:10 am
Most epoxy won't be very flexible. Plus that stave's too pretty for epoxy. Sawdust or antler and hide glue or TB3 would be my choice.

It's not exactly swearing like mentioning FG, but it's close. :laugh:
Plenty of flexible types of Epoxy are available. Modern glue is modern glue. Epoxy is older than TB3 that's for sure.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 26, 2016, 07:58:38 am
Started the process of making dome raw hide. Never have to much materials. Might even back my trade bow then lay some snake skins down on it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 26, 2016, 08:12:53 am
My wife calls me a lazy communicator and I think I've been that, I gotta think about what I'm saying with all these new terms. That half eye is pretty sharp, the string alignment is 1/4" from spot on. I think I'm good on the lateral plane as long as I get some propeller twist out as you say. I was afraid steaming the twist out could crack open the crevice but I like Dakota kid idea of gluing and wrapping to prevent that from happening.

Fred: I started a thread about it a week or two ago but didn't have much luck on the specifics of that area. I might just pm Pearl. (EDIT)I was a little to eager roughing it out a year or two ago or I tried to remove a check I don't remember but I've learnt since then. Yeah keeping it stiff is the plan!

Dakota Kid: Ok, I'm going hide glue keeping it natural :) Just gotta make some.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 26, 2016, 08:27:15 am
Mr. Andersson, first off sorry about miss-spelling your name before. Before you get carried away with the prop twist....consider this. If you have a lever that does not bend and you shape it to a circle cross-section.....there is no prop twist. Propeller twist is the most offensive with a broad flat limb, on a skinny lever I have never had a problem.......between the levers cross section, and the normal string knock you will get a straight, even draw.......Levers can have different sections....square, oval, circular, even octagonal.
rich

Gutshot.....sweet .....you would not have snitched some young lady's deer hide would ya? >:D >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 26, 2016, 08:47:15 am
Half eye
           That's one of the few I have left that's mine. Lauren's  is next. She has requested a Rug with the hair left on for her room. So we are gonna get it fleshed and pickled before we ran that joker out, all while trying to get 3 bows made. There's just not enough time in the days any more. Lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 26, 2016, 08:54:35 am
Chopping the belly down to the lines....

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowChopping.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 26, 2016, 08:55:22 am
Deer rugs look great, but the hair is hollow and very brittle.... That's why even tho they are warm because of the hollow hair they didn't make good jackets because the hair always breaks off... Good luck
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 26, 2016, 08:58:05 am
Yes sir !!!!! I got the same time crunch as you EXCEPT that I have to factor in my "old man" nappy time as well.....do not get between an old man and his lazy-boy. ::)

Dont know how much the young lady gets on the site with you, would you like the progress pics posted up here on her award bow?
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 26, 2016, 09:08:27 am
Otter, I have made a few rugs and haven't had a problem yet! But I could on this one. Hopefully not since it was her first deer.

Half Eye if you want to post on here that would be great so every body can see your fine bow work!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 26, 2016, 09:22:30 am
That's great and it will come out just fine for her I'm sure... Congratulations to your daughter for first deer!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 26, 2016, 09:24:53 am
Rasping to a bevel......

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBellyBevel.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on January 26, 2016, 09:53:22 am
I'd like to be in!  Here are my particulars:
      Shortish selfbow prefered, I hunt in thick stuff and gnarly brush, but I'm really not picky and would love whatever I got.
      RH
      Draw weight 45#-55#
      26-28" draw
      I will ship anywhere in the US

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 26, 2016, 10:16:26 am
Hey Plan B, man you are a machine !!!! 8) 8) 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 26, 2016, 11:36:51 am
Rich, I'm enjoying this bow more than any others I've built. I really like how it's going, and don't want to stop. I like the proportions and the wood is really nice to work with.

I flattened the belly bevel off. Where the bow blank is now .....

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowBlankSide.jpg)

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowBlankBack.jpg)

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 26, 2016, 11:41:24 am
Man this build thread is a lot of reading. I have to check it every few hrs to keep up with it so I don't get to far behind. I'm liking all the pics of the staves I just have one ?  There is a pic of a Honeysuckle stave. Our honeysuckle in Kentucky is a bush with no trunk big enough to make a bow. Just wondering if it's the same honeysuckle that Ive grown up seeing. Keep up the great work everybody!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Aaron H on January 26, 2016, 11:48:54 am
Now this is coming along very nicely, keep up the good work fellas
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 26, 2016, 12:24:15 pm
Man I'm lagging behind. I've had a few honey does but I'm back to it today as soon as my wife gets home so I don't leave the kiddos along. I'll have some progress pics posted today for sure. I was hoping to get the sleeves glued up today on the mulberry and chase a few more rings on the other Osage and draw out the hhb.

Loope: let me know how that red bud works out. I have access to red bud and wasn't sure how it would work. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 26, 2016, 12:39:18 pm
Man B that came around fast....do you work out of a vice or right off your table?

Here are some progress pics of the handle lam....limb taper...tip rounding...and lower temp nock complete
(http://i.imgur.com/42j4XNr.jpg?2)(http://i.imgur.com/WUgEwV2.jpg?2)(http://i.imgur.com/t2B9YJo.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/249zeSc.jpg)(http://i.imgur.com/UqRkX2h.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/DVyNx4Q.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/MgQPH35.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/rDa0dFP.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/mUXMWWR.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 26, 2016, 12:56:01 pm
I'm waiting for the drawing before I pick my work. Man sure wish that guy would hurry it up a little bit!!  >:D  My work station is much neater than my shop and they're both unorganized.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: lebhuntfish on January 26, 2016, 01:02:30 pm
Man everything is looking really great guys! Keep up the good work!
Patrick
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Blaflair2 on January 26, 2016, 01:05:59 pm
Hey Fred, that stave in the center is terrible. Send to me for proper disposal.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 26, 2016, 01:09:58 pm
Most of you guys have 2 or more staves in the mix. I'm going to the barn tonight and find a couple of more to chase a ring on. Unless it's ok to maybe use one I'm close to tillering out for a back up!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 26, 2016, 01:12:47 pm
Gutshot, whats the difference you made/making both of 'em. Dont make it harder than has to be 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 26, 2016, 01:25:36 pm
Blaflair2,
the one in the middle is just waiting around for warmer weather. I do all of my stave work outdoors and I traded a bow to be made out of that osage for some wool coats that I gave my sons for Christmas. monkeyball has given me time to build it. I usually have 4 or 5 going at once.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 26, 2016, 01:31:00 pm
Gutshot,

I would say having a back-up ready to go wouldn't be a bad idea, but I wouldn't spend too terribly much time getting a back-up ready.  Maybe just pick out a stave you'd like to work on and if you get to a point where you're waiting on something for your primary bow (like if you're bending the tips or getting tiller fatigue), that would be a good point to work on bow #2.

Just my $.02.  :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 26, 2016, 01:31:44 pm
Mr. Andersson, first off sorry about miss-spelling your name before. Before you get carried away with the prop twist....consider this. If you have a lever that does not bend and you shape it to a circle cross-section.....there is no prop twist. Propeller twist is the most offensive with a broad flat limb, on a skinny lever I have never had a problem.......between the levers cross section, and the normal string knock you will get a straight, even draw.......Levers can have different sections....square, oval, circular, even octagonal.
rich

Gutshot.....sweet .....you would not have snitched some young lady's deer hide would ya? >:D >:D
rich

It's alright, everybody is dropping my double s, even the department of homeland security :)
And about the twists that is a good point! I'm learning a lot of new things everyday now.
Thank you Sir!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Blaflair2 on January 26, 2016, 01:40:02 pm
Haven't picked up the draw knife since hunting season. I've been out chasing tail. Whitetail. I got a few things going ATM. We'll see what make it. Wish I had more wood ready. But I'll be good.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 26, 2016, 02:13:25 pm
Most of you guys have 2 or more staves in the mix. I'm going to the barn tonight and find a couple of more to chase a ring on. Unless it's ok to maybe use one I'm close to tillering out for a back up!

Man, just give most of these guys a reason to go pulling out all those staves they been eyeballin for a year or 2 and this is what happens. I already told my wife it's this guy named Fred's fault I have all this wood and splinters everywhere  >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 26, 2016, 02:16:37 pm
Just an FYI: I am gonna be on the road Thursday or Friday am and won't be around computer much for a few days. I will take a camera and a couple of works in progress to scrape on a little.
I can see it will take a few hours just to catch up on reading once I get back.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 26, 2016, 02:39:47 pm
Ajooter, that's looking great!!!
Uhhhh, I'm just working off the porch standing on the steps.....no table, no clamp.... :laugh: :laugh:

Fred, that's a beautifule workspace, and a lot of pretty gold on the floor...  :P drool.....

Well while my wife is gone I moved the whole operation indoors for a short time....steaming in deflex ......

(btw....thx Pearl Drums for the steaming method postings, thx Gordon for stave layout working build alongs)

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowSteaming.jpg)

Clamped:

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowClamped.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 26, 2016, 03:40:14 pm
Oh baby...you will be able to stretch the draw on that one need be.  How long is the stave right now?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 26, 2016, 03:54:44 pm
aj, 68" right now. Don't know who we're going to get until tomorrow, and so holding off on, length, weight .... bendy handle or not, too.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on January 26, 2016, 04:19:15 pm
wow, took a minute to read through the thread.  I got to get my mitts on some wood!  I have one Osage stave that is drying, and I have a couple sticks of Ipe and some boo.  I'm going hunting tomorrow, going to collect some staves if I can find any, and then get them floor tillered and drying ASAP.  I might also be able to make a couple bows out of that Osage, I will take some pictures this evening for some opinions from the group.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 26, 2016, 04:47:37 pm
Mine is just shy of 68"...top limb should give me no problems.  Bottom limb will be tricky to tiller that kink into a nice arc.  Will probably get to a short brace then give it a good heat treat.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: pincushin on January 26, 2016, 05:18:02 pm
Hey just wondering when the draw will be :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 26, 2016, 05:24:58 pm
Said it was tomorrow and we would get are names email to us with all specs
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 26, 2016, 05:35:49 pm
I been working on the quiver, having finished cutting the long fringe, Got a real good start on a young lady's award bow, and got my victims trade bow started.....like you waiting on a name.

The young ladys bow is going to be 30#@24" with some wiggle room for growth....I want it to have good speed but also a smooth draw and no excessive early weight. I decided on an American Flatbow, crank the ears back....and possibly defexing the limbs at the fades....maybe if needed to ease the draw. The bow right now is just under 60" ttt, the stave is hard maple that was trying to go "birdseye" if it had lived.....pics attached

Got the victims two bows shped, and steamed to form the shapes and correct a slight limb "squirrel. pics attached....there is the possiblity of remaking the victims depending on the necessary specs
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 26, 2016, 05:36:27 pm
one more
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 26, 2016, 05:42:22 pm
Both are lookin great rich...your victim is going to get twofer deal I see!  Coulsnt wait to make another Penobscot now that ya got a handle on em ay?!
Once I get the first stave semi tamed I have another I will start on much narrower stave with a high crown...only 60".  May try a bendy handle Lil hickory.  I need to order another goat hide so I have some rawhide.  Might have to get a little extra creative with the decor on this one  ;)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 26, 2016, 05:47:48 pm
ya aj....they shoot so darned fast it's hard not want and share.......plus it's a little different hope the victim dont mind.....but hey I*'m off the chain anyway >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 26, 2016, 06:00:34 pm
I'm sure they won't mind....you going to make an artificial sinew string again?  Or try some different materials?

He'll I know I wouldnt!!# 8)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 26, 2016, 06:04:26 pm
Looking good half eye!! :) :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 26, 2016, 06:24:00 pm
Those bows are looking pretty awesome Half Eye. I told her yesterday she was pumped up about the bow!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: cabinetbowguy on January 26, 2016, 06:30:12 pm
Ok i got my lams picked out... core wood choice westren red cedar ,chery, popular  ?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 26, 2016, 06:38:25 pm
Thank you guys.
AJ....going to use some primo Linen of the strings ( thanks to my good bud Don Burchett)

Thanks B

Gutshot: lets just hope I manage to get it right. I'll see if I can locate some skins for it....with the color plan I'll try to find some dark ones.....banded water snake or Moccasin to contrast with the color selection.

Thanks again fellas
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 26, 2016, 06:43:55 pm
I had to run to the city this afternoon to pick up some much needed supplies. Just returned 15 minutes ago. At the moment we have 32 entrants. I'm going to draw names after I sit down for a bite.
We have just a few guys that haven't posted pics yet that are holding us up.

I'll draw all of the names and then send out the list this evening.

If you don't receive your guys name  tonight then it's probably because either you or your guy hasn't posted the pics I requested. Some have contacted me and told me they would be delayed and I have no problem with that. I can wait.

Gentlemen all, My thanks to you,
Fred
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 26, 2016, 06:51:08 pm
After a long 12 hrs of work today. Now the fun begins. Decided to steam the locus limb to get the twist out.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 26, 2016, 07:37:22 pm
Man oh man - you guys are getting it done!  Lots of good progress and we don't even have names yet! :o  Can't wait to get started - planning on this coming weekend.  Need to decide what to make and then start laying it out.

Fred - your work bench looks great!  Don't know why you would be embarrassed!   :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 26, 2016, 07:45:59 pm
Jeesh!!
Don't even have our names yet and I already feel like I'm a month behind. I have to put in one more 12hr day at work then I will have 4 days off to get shavings a flying. Im so pumped I can hardly wait.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: cabinetbowguy on January 26, 2016, 08:00:58 pm
Well its between chery and westren red cedar for the hickory backed tri lam with osage belly

Jason
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Blaflair2 on January 26, 2016, 08:03:00 pm
Man rich I hope ya get my name. Your short little bendy handle bows are right up my alley! I'll try and get some picks up of what I got kicking around.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 26, 2016, 08:12:56 pm
Cabinet,  fine lookin wood right there, sounds like your planning a screamer 8)

Blaflair2....cant say who I drew....till the Leprechauns speak....then I think the chips will really be flying.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DavidV on January 26, 2016, 08:15:29 pm
I'd go with some edge grain cherry.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 26, 2016, 09:14:29 pm
Woohoo.  I got my victim.  Thanks Fred.  Now I can narrow down my options and get started for real.

Mike
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on January 26, 2016, 09:16:35 pm
Fred said he was going to ban me from the forum if I didn't post a picture...

I'm kidding.

Here's me, and my shave horse in the background.... Also a short stave that I'm trying to make a bow from...

(http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l62/krzyjon123/Mobile%20Uploads/20160126_164528_zpsgm1jls31.jpg) (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/krzyjon123/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160126_164528_zpsgm1jls31.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on January 26, 2016, 09:20:25 pm
Little bit younger than i thought.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on January 26, 2016, 09:21:37 pm
Little bit younger than i thought.

 ;D   ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 26, 2016, 09:23:39 pm
Hey guys this is our youngest bowyer and we're all going to help him get it right. I've got a stave going out to David tomorrow and he'll post pics when it arrives. David's got the tools and the ambition and I'm glad to welcome him aboard. His dad tells me that he's enthused and a pretty good young man.  8)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on January 26, 2016, 09:26:30 pm
Hey guys this is our youngest bowyer and we're all going to help him get it right. I've got a stave going out to David tomorrow and he'll post pics when it arrives. David's got the tools and the ambition and I'm glad to welcome him aboard. His dad tells me that he's enthused and a pretty good young man.  8)

That is fantastic.  What a golden opportunity for him.........and all of us.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on January 26, 2016, 09:30:26 pm
Glad to meet you. Sure wish I had this hobbie as a kid. Id be a different man now.  We are all willing to help, so dont be afeared to holler.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 26, 2016, 09:38:54 pm
Hey David! Glad to have you on board :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 26, 2016, 09:45:28 pm
Hey David,
       Welcome sir, I know a little about you.....and my money is on you bud.....I hope I'm the lucky dog to get that bow !!!!!!
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hunterbob on January 26, 2016, 09:46:31 pm
Hey David . You can do it. Show some of these old farts how to make a killer bow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 26, 2016, 09:47:50 pm
Glad to meet you. Sure wish I had this hobbie as a kid. Id be a different man now.  We are all willing to help, so dont be afeared to holler.

Same here sleek....but I'm glad I found this hobby when I did...made sobriety much more tolerable and possible.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 26, 2016, 09:52:35 pm
Just checked my pms and what do ya know....I got me a fella to make a bow for.  :D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on January 26, 2016, 09:53:48 pm
Hey David . You can do it. Show some of these old farts how to make a killer bow.
I'm going to try! Hahaha
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on January 26, 2016, 10:03:33 pm
Glad to meet you. Sure wish I had this hobbie as a kid. Id be a different man now.  We are all willing to help, so dont be afeared to holler.

Same here sleek....but I'm glad I found this hobby when I did...made sobriety much more tolerable and possible.

I have not had any luck with cutting wood and drinking. Pat seen me ruin a real nice stave doing dumb stuff like that.  And if you are always makin bows, then you never got time to drink.  Good on you for your sucess. I know its not easy.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 26, 2016, 10:08:18 pm
Man , i cant wait. After my last failure cant wait to get back on the horse.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 26, 2016, 10:11:04 pm
Stix,
     ya better get it right cause if ya dont me or Fred will keep sendin wood till ya do....it would not be pretty.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 26, 2016, 10:13:55 pm
stix, you just keep posting pictures. We won't let you ruin it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 26, 2016, 10:18:31 pm
David, you've got us all fighting over your next bow -- good to have a lot of customers! :laugh: :laugh:

I got my victim tonight, and now I know what to do with some wood! :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on January 26, 2016, 10:21:15 pm
Here's a pic of me, and a pic of the stave I'm probably going to be working with.  Yall think I can get  two bendy handle bows from that?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on January 26, 2016, 10:23:26 pm
David, you've got us all fighting over your next bow -- good to have a lot of customers! :laugh: :laugh:

I got my victim tonight, and now I know what to do with some wood! :)

Hahahahaha.
I have my "victim"....  ;)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 26, 2016, 10:25:47 pm
Just noticed I had a pm from Fred too.  Guess I better get started on ******'s bow! >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 26, 2016, 10:30:24 pm
David, the force is strong in this one😉
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 26, 2016, 10:31:31 pm
Wow I got my pm too. Way to go David glad to see a young man get involved. I hope you got my name.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 26, 2016, 10:32:08 pm
Alright, I figured out plan a now that I have my victim.  I am going with my black locust.  I cut it down to 62 inches.  Now I need to even the width of the limbs up.  I have a good ring chased already.  After evening up the limbs I will be glueing on tip overlays. 

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/9C924882-88E3-44E5-8171-8CE715E4BC84_zpsde2fp1kh.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/9C924882-88E3-44E5-8171-8CE715E4BC84_zpsde2fp1kh.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 26, 2016, 10:33:25 pm
Sidmand,
        I dont believe any of my woodland bendys are more than 1-1/8" wide, and especially using that yeller stuff you probably wont need to go more than 1" wide (finished dimension)

Holy Cow David, these guys are already a bad influence on you what with that "victim"  secret answer and all  >:D

rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 26, 2016, 10:34:51 pm
Half eye, i hope my hackberry works out, if not i will pm u on some of the hhb. I've only worked osage so fingers crossed.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ryan C on January 26, 2016, 10:36:54 pm
(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm165/jreefer454/B3955E54-B4CE-4EA3-AC07-7042DABA59E9_zpsb9oxvaez.jpg) (http://s296.photobucket.com/user/jreefer454/media/B3955E54-B4CE-4EA3-AC07-7042DABA59E9_zpsb9oxvaez.jpg.html)(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm165/jreefer454/CDFFA9FB-6D7C-4BD1-93C8-7ECFAD1FB9CB_zpsahauaddb.jpg) (http://s296.photobucket.com/user/jreefer454/media/CDFFA9FB-6D7C-4BD1-93C8-7ECFAD1FB9CB_zpsahauaddb.jpg.html)

Picked out a stave of black locust me and a friend cut 3 years ago. Got a ring chased. Check out that hump over the knot.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ryan C on January 26, 2016, 10:39:04 pm
Oh th picture showing the knot is before I got the ring chased that's why you can see part of another ring.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on January 26, 2016, 10:43:19 pm
I figured I would post my mugshot as well.  Met some of you guys at the classic at Pappy's place, so this picture seemed appropriate.  This was three years ago and bow #1 for me, a proud moment and a sense of accomplishment.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 26, 2016, 11:01:23 pm
Well if everyone else is putting up their head shot, I might as well too. This was a couple years ago, but I seem to age like yew, slow.
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/MikeFirstCatch_zpsdaa7a22d.jpg)

Just a little catfish I caught while perch fishing. I actually thought it was a snag. I was trying to break the line when he started shaking his head. I was in 60' of water and it took 45 minutes to get him up to the boat. He was released after the photo and hit my friends rig as soon as he got back to the bottom. He must have been worn out cause my buddy had him landed in less than 10 minutes. I know the southern guys are wondering why I wouldn't keep a catfish. Well, on lake Erie, you don't eat bottom feeders unless you want to glow in the dark.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jeffp51 on January 26, 2016, 11:03:01 pm
Still waiting on a name. Why does it feel like Christmas eve again?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 26, 2016, 11:22:45 pm
Nice looking chunk of BL Ryan - ought to make a bow! ;D

That is one big catfish D. Kid!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 26, 2016, 11:37:21 pm
Got my shop cleaned out had mulberry shavings all over. Couldn't even walk.  Got my HHB designed out. But I will be using a band saw for the hhb. Save my shoulders. I'll probably use the mulberry for a takedown but I'll keep this hhb for a back up its 68"
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 26, 2016, 11:41:48 pm
It's 11:25 pm here in Ky. Been up since 4am got to get up again at 4am for another 12 hr shift. Should be asleep but since I got my name 100 different ideas has been going through my head on what to do. This will be a sleepless night I'm sure
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jeffp51 on January 27, 2016, 12:22:52 am
I have to say, Fred is efficient.  I have my name now and I am doing my research. . .
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 27, 2016, 12:51:55 am
Nothing to exciting. Sometimes I don't mind being in the kitchen.
Half eye saved me from straightening the twist out on one of the limbs. The other one still needed a little to save me some headache later.

(http://i.imgur.com/KANGxtt.jpg)

 (http://i.imgur.com/bX5eJwE.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 27, 2016, 01:03:59 am
If you didn't receive your guys name  tonight then it's probably because either you or your guy hasn't posted the pics I requested. Some have contacted me and told me they would be delayed and I have no problem with that. I can wait.

I'm done for the evening and will pick up tomorrow where we've left off.

If anyone is in dire straights for wood or any other items please get in touch with half eye or myself.

I've been pretty swamped tonight and may have made some commitments that I failed to write down. For those of you that contacted me earlier you might want to remind me again in the morning.

Fred
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 04:42:53 am
good morning 3 hrs of sleep and ready to put another 12 in. Gonna make a pile of shavings tonight when I get home. Can't wait.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 27, 2016, 07:29:50 am
Damned Gutshot, that kind of schedule is why old guys like me are all grey, bent, and grumpy >:D Hope you dont have to make a habit of that many hours EVRY day.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 07:43:11 am
That's the life of a factory maintenance man. We average around 6 12 hr days a week. It gets old. But what can I say I'm living where I grew up and raising a Family in this small town. I guess I will be old and bauld not gray one of these days too. Lol.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 27, 2016, 07:48:28 am
Judging by that pic of you and your daughter....and her take on things....ya doin good brother.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 27, 2016, 07:55:35 am
Damn fine group of folks in this trade!!

Hey David E. Good to see you here buddy  ;)

(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm165/jreefer454/B3955E54-B4CE-4EA3-AC07-7042DABA59E9_zpsb9oxvaez.jpg) (http://s296.photobucket.com/user/jreefer454/media/B3955E54-B4CE-4EA3-AC07-7042DABA59E9_zpsb9oxvaez.jpg.html)(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm165/jreefer454/CDFFA9FB-6D7C-4BD1-93C8-7ECFAD1FB9CB_zpsahauaddb.jpg) (http://s296.photobucket.com/user/jreefer454/media/CDFFA9FB-6D7C-4BD1-93C8-7ECFAD1FB9CB_zpsahauaddb.jpg.html)

Picked out a stave of black locust me and a friend cut 3 years ago. Got a ring chased. Check out that hump over the knot.

I have yet to make a BL bow except for the little one for my 4 yo boy. That is a sweet straight piece you got there.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 07:58:30 am
Damn fine group of folks in this trade!!

Hey David E. Good to see you here buddy  ;)

(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm165/jreefer454/B3955E54-B4CE-4EA3-AC07-7042DABA59E9_zpsb9oxvaez.jpg) (http://s296.photobucket.com/user/jreefer454/media/B3955E54-B4CE-4EA3-AC07-7042DABA59E9_zpsb9oxvaez.jpg.html)(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm165/jreefer454/CDFFA9FB-6D7C-4BD1-93C8-7ECFAD1FB9CB_zpsahauaddb.jpg) (http://s296.photobucket.com/user/jreefer454/media/CDFFA9FB-6D7C-4BD1-93C8-7ECFAD1FB9CB_zpsahauaddb.jpg.html)

Picked out a stave of black locust me and a friend cut 3 years ago. Got a ring chased. Check out that hump over the knot.

I have yet to make a BL bow except for the little one for my 4 yo boy. That is a sweet straight piece you got there.
Yes it is straight does it have any pin knots I can't tell
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on January 27, 2016, 07:59:10 am
J Anderson, I gotta know. How's that lilac move for ya? Steam work good so far?

You have one mighty clean kitchen with nice cookware by the way. You sure you're allowed in there?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 27, 2016, 08:21:01 am
(http://i.imgur.com/4YrwlNq.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/0VqIM69.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/HlMqgjB.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/up9Pp2c.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/P2BfRWT.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/FrJeUxQ.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/zZPYXIq.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/kLnoNMj.jpg?1)

Got the second temporary nock done on the top limb....hand tillered the top limb using my bench vice....switched gears to another stave after getting my man's info...started roughing down another piece of hickory...got the rough front profile done and the first side taper layed out.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: kid bow on January 27, 2016, 08:37:51 am
well my draw knife bas busted on me (literally in two pieces.)  so I ordered a new one and it will be here this Friday. the old one I sent to a friend of mine who is a blacksmith here locally for the Kentucky derby horses. hopefully she is able to mend the two parts back together. that was my grandfathers draw knife from 1925. hope everyone is doing good on there trades.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 27, 2016, 09:03:58 am
Wake up and barely got a cup of coffee and there's pages to read here!

Very pretty stave Sidmand!

Swampman, that's lookin like a nice bow already, Somebody is going to be a happy archer!

Ryan, makin a lot o shavings on that BL!

Nice lookin bow Loope. My first one ended up a kid's bow, but didn't start out that way. ::)

Dakota, I wish I'd caught that one! Always wanted to catch a big catfish. All we've got here is bull pout. Nice fish!

Timothy mulberry and HHB by hand at the same time -- I have a hard enough time chopping and scraping down just this one bow. When I get arm weary I take a pic and then sit down on the computer and post here. But reading all this stuff gets me back outside on the porch scraping again pretty quick. One thing to read about bows, another makin' them!

"But what can I say I'm living where I grew up and raising a Family in this small town," Gutshot, you have your priorities right!  I would be very proud to own a bow that you fit into that kind of tough schedule if that's how the cards play out.

jandersson, that is really shaping up nice, and the pic of the bow soup looks real familiar!

Fred, I just want to thank you for all this hard work and what must have been a really long evening. We're doing the fun work, you're the man making that all possible, and working smoothly. So one more thanks to you, and I hope you get to do some scraping and shaping, instead of just spreadsheet data entry and emailing soon!

Quickly shaping up ajooter. You're probably going to have a bow to shoot in a day or two, the rate you're going. :)

Kid, real sorry to hear about the drawknife since it was a family heirloom, Even if it can't be mended, you could always turn it into another bow tool, like a custom scraper, with some thought. Here's hoping the blacksmith can weld it back good as old!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 27, 2016, 09:08:06 am
J Anderson, I gotta know. How's that lilac move for ya? Steam work good so far?

You have one mighty clean kitchen with nice cookware by the way. You sure you're allowed in there?

DuBois:
Still in clamps. I'll let you know tonight when I get home from work. Are you working on yours?
And she was asleep :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 27, 2016, 09:21:27 am
Hey guys,

One of my staves has some violations on the back. It's the rock elm. Can I get away without a backing on a violated elm? It has interlocking grain but not as locked as HHB, which I've left un-backed after removing wood.

I'd throw some rawhide on it, but don't have any at the moment. I can use linen if the consensus is to back it. In fact I could airbrush the linen first. I may go that way just to try something new. I can do a mean snakeskin with my airbrush. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 27, 2016, 09:26:20 am
Hey kid...I'm ordering a whole goat skin that I'm going to cut strips out of.  Let me know what you need and I send it your way.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 27, 2016, 09:37:33 am
Looks like you guys got up earlier than I did this morning huh?
I've been going over my list and am finishing it up this morning. Have to run to the post office to get a package off. If you don't receive a PM with your victim this morning make sure to PM me. I've already caught a couple I missed. I've only got another 6 to send out (I think).
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 27, 2016, 09:38:50 am
I'll let you know if I need it. Thanks my friend. The more I think about painting the linen with a snakeskin I may have to give it a try. I'll see if I can find a pic of one of the guns I painted.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Blaflair2 on January 27, 2016, 09:47:13 am
When we get our name? And when is the deadline.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 09:51:15 am
Ok please tell me how to post pictures on here I'm about ready to pull my hair out lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on January 27, 2016, 09:55:27 am
Ok please tell me how to post pictures on here I'm about ready to pull my hair out lol

I use photobucket. Just upload the pictures there, and use the link for forums to post here. Just copy and paste it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 09:57:58 am
I'll try
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 27, 2016, 10:02:47 am
When we get our name? And when is the deadline.

From what I've ready, if you didn't receive a name, then either you or the person who you drew hasn't participated enough (namely, posting a piece of wood that will be the trade bow)... unless Fred is still catching the ones who slipped through the cracks.  I'm sure he will get it done soon!  The deadline is officially the middle of August for the ship date, but there has been mention of no bows being shipped out until every maker has completed a bow.

Well, seeing all the progress so far is quite something!  I will definitely try to sneak in some time to at least get the osage and bamboo roughly shaped.  Now that I have my trade's stats, I know where to go.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 27, 2016, 10:05:12 am
Otter, I'm too old to know about all these "smart" gizmos but if you have paint on you computer I can tell you how to resize whatever ya want........by the way, when I first came on, had the same trouble and to this day I cant put pics on a PM got to that with email.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 27, 2016, 10:07:31 am
Ok please tell me how to post pictures on here I'm about ready to pull my hair out lol

If photobucket doesn't work for you, have you tried imgur?  That's what I've been using and works well.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 10:22:48 am
well my draw knife bas busted on me (literally in two pieces.)  so I ordered a new one and it will be here this Friday. the old one I sent to a friend of mine who is a blacksmith here locally for the Kentucky derby horses. hopefully she is able to mend the two parts back together. that was my grandfathers draw knife from 1925. hope everyone is doing good on there trades.
Man a hate to here that about your draw knife. Those passed down items from the family means everything. If that lady can't fix it shoot me a PM my uncle is a black smith here in KY he might be able to
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Blaflair2 on January 27, 2016, 10:24:17 am
I haven't posted a picture so I don't get a name?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 10:28:42 am
Ok please tell me how to post pictures on here I'm about ready to pull my hair out lol
[/quote
I can tell you if your using a iPhone but the other ways I can't get it to work for me
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 27, 2016, 10:35:19 am
Blaflair2:
Like for Ty_in_nd imgur work well for me to, you don't have to sign up or in. but i guess i don't know why it don't work for you.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: kid bow on January 27, 2016, 10:43:08 am
well my draw knife bas busted on me (literally in two pieces.)  so I ordered a new one and it will be here this Friday. the old one I sent to a friend of mine who is a blacksmith here locally for the Kentucky derby horses. hopefully she is able to mend the two parts back together. that was my grandfathers draw knife from 1925. hope everyone is doing good on there trades.
Man a hate to here that about your draw knife. Those passed down items from the family means everything. If that lady can't fix it shoot me a PM my uncle is a black smith here in KY he might be able to

Yea I was pretty bummed out. She said she can do it it's just going to take time she's kept very busy.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 11:07:06 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160127_082722362_zpscvgljf5k.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160127_082722362_zpscvgljf5k.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 11:09:40 am
Ok I dug out three stave's on left is hhb and two nice Osage... Which one do you all think I should whittle on lol?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 11:10:33 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160127_082836070_zpsq06yqrkz.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160127_082836070_zpsq06yqrkz.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 11:12:11 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160127_082901686_HDR_zpscpxf9zua.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160127_082901686_HDR_zpscpxf9zua.jpg.html). 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 11:13:21 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160127_082851814_zpsofekfqc4.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160127_082851814_zpsofekfqc4.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 11:15:25 am
I'm leading onto the middle Osage stave or the hhb
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 27, 2016, 11:16:36 am
Otter, they all look tasty. I'm sure anyone will work just fine. I'm jumpin on my hackberry today. Will have pics up later.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 27, 2016, 11:18:22 am
Otter,  looks like ya got them osage pretty much skinned? round here I got to get the bark off the ironwood , either green or dead standing otherwise it is a fight to the bitter end!!!! 8) 8) 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 27, 2016, 11:21:13 am
Sorry guys, I'm running a little late and need to get a pkg to the post office. Thought I was almost done and then found out I had 2 guys building bows for Otter  :laugh:
I'll get this straightened out when I get back and get the last 3 or 4 taken care of.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 11:22:20 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160127_082919019_zpsei5ftdx3.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160127_082919019_zpsei5ftdx3.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 11:26:52 am
im going with the middle stave ... ill keep you updated... and two bows for me lol... how lucky can I get
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 11:33:10 am
Otter,  looks like ya got them osage pretty much skinned? round here I got to get the bark off the ironwood , either green or dead standing otherwise it is a fight to the bitter end!!!! 8) 8) 8)
rich
half eye the one on left is hhb  and one in center does still have bark on it but it peels off easy, jon the right is all ready debarked and I used tb3 to seal it and ends... by leaving the bark on i have had better luvk with it not cracking on the back.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 11:34:27 am
im going with the middle stave ... ill keep you updated... and two bows for me lol... how lucky can I get
Man ! Otter you the luckiest guy on here 2 bows sweet! Lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 27, 2016, 11:34:49 am
based on his size ....he probably needs two.....one for each hand. >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 11:37:07 am
hhb was already skined... me and my brother gifted the other half to del the cat at the classic two years ago, del made a nice Cherokee style bow with it last year.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 11:39:48 am
im just a little guy...  :o lol >:D >:D >:D
Title: Attaching and linking photos
Post by: PlanB on January 27, 2016, 11:40:25 am
To post pics here (where the pic is stored by PA on its website, do this:

1.) Hit "Reply" to open a reply, just like you normally would. Wrte whatever you want to be in front of the pic.

2.) Hit the little blue arrow button that says, "Attachments and other options." It's located to the left just below the main text area, where you've been typing your reply. It will open up a few more entry areas. You will be adding your photo (s) as an attachment. Here's how:

3.) Hit the bue button that says "Browse". A window will open up on your computer (or phone). Use that window to find the photo file on your computer that you want to attach to your message.

4.) Now select that photo file, and the window should close. Bingo, you've just attached a photo file!

Notes:

1.) Photos must be reduced in size to about 600 pixels wide, to fit the file size requirements and to fit well in the  forum column width. You can reduce the photo size with  simple photo editor like MTPaint (free for download) or Photoshop, or via any online photo reducer.

2.) You can also upload photos to a free photo hosting service, like Photobucket, and then just put a link to that photo in your message, rather than attaching a photo to your message. The advantage of that is that the forum doesn't have to store photos, which takes lots of storage room. ( It also seems that this forum deletes old photos to save space -- I notice older threads often have photos missing ("deleted by administrator" )).

To link a photo, copy the photo's URL address to your clipboard from the free photo hosting company and paste that address where you want the photo in your message.

Then highlight the address in your message (ie. select it) and click the photo button (first button in the second row of edit buttons, above -- located under the B Bold button.

That will put /img tags around your photo's address, letting the forum software know that the address is an image, not just an ordinary link.

Some photo hosting sites have a means of inserting those /img tags without you having to do it via the photo button. You should be able to see the tags surrounding your pasted photo address.

Hope this helps!

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 11:42:56 am
I need to print that  planB
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 11:45:26 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20140820_194219_354_zps8okgaxcp.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20140820_194219_354_zps8okgaxcp.jpg.html).   Here's a mug shot of me
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 11:59:04 am
Gosh Otter how much did that large mouth weight.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 27, 2016, 12:03:41 pm
Nice fish, Otter!

I was trying to find a picture with me and a nice walleye (20 inches, my personal best) I caught last summer to post, but I gave up and posted a pic of me with my other best catch.  ;)

It's good to see the full explanation for how to post pics (especially the size limits).  The reason I went with imgur is because the site generates a /img link that you can copy/paste.  However, it looks like you figured it out!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 12:14:46 pm
gutshot, ty_in_ND, Thanks this creekchub weight in a little over 7lbs... ive caught two that size now... largest walleye I caught was 26 inches didnt have a scale then so I dont know what it weighted.. also caught a 53 1/2 pound shovelhead
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Blaflair2 on January 27, 2016, 12:35:05 pm
I got a couple things in the works and a few blanks made out.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 12:51:44 pm
Nice just don't be in that shop barefooted man might get a splinter. Lol I guess if a mans shop isn't covered up with stuff then a man would be doing nothing.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Urufu_Shinjiro on January 27, 2016, 01:08:07 pm
Lol, don't let the fire marshal see that!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 27, 2016, 01:10:23 pm
Never heard of wood flooring?  :laugh:

Nice bass!!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 27, 2016, 01:34:42 pm
I need to know who hasn't been contacted with their recipients name and bow specs.

I lost my first database sheet on my word processor and had to start over about halfway through the signups.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Blaflair2 on January 27, 2016, 01:51:10 pm
Well it makes good coushioning for my feet.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: cabinetbowguy on January 27, 2016, 01:57:31 pm
Laminations  cut and sanded now to taper the core and shape the handle
Jason
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: cabinetbowguy on January 27, 2016, 02:01:13 pm
The laminations
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 27, 2016, 03:01:08 pm
I got a rough front profile roughed out on a decent chunk of eastern red cedar. Next I just need to reduce the sapwood some. The first stave was too pristine and felt like the only design fitting for it would be a maple backed EWB. So this now will have a couple of knot. I didn't get as much done as id hoped since it took me a while to lay down some yucca fibers on an osage molle for a different project. I wish I had remembered my rubber straps when I layed it down and made it looks better and tighter. Oh well, I'll just fill in the gaps once the first layer dries.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 03:06:32 pm
Quote from: Fred Arnold link=topic=55778.msg760485#msg760485 date= :laugh:
Sorry guys, I'm running a little late and need to get a pkg to the post office. Thought I was almost done and then found out I had 2 guys building bows for Otter. :laugh:
I'll get this straightened out when I get back and get the last 3 or 4 taken care of.

That's OK Fred, I forgive you...  >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 27, 2016, 03:13:40 pm
I've still got a mess. trying to fit 2 senders to 3 recipients. Have a lot of backtracking to do, hope I didn't dump the wrong PM's  :( Got in such a big hurry that I made myself more work) I'll bet none of other guys have done that Huh!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 04:25:48 pm
I've still got a mess. trying to fit 2 senders to 3 recipients. Have a lot of backtracking to do, hope I didn't dump the wrong PM's  :( Got in such a big hurry that I made myself more work) I'll bet none of other guys have done that Huh!!
Your doing a fine job Fred! Keep up the good work
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 27, 2016, 04:32:50 pm
Did you remember to give yourself a recipient? I could see myself doing that.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 27, 2016, 04:47:36 pm
Yup and I'm the only one who knows who's got'm I think? I got it all straightened out and am going to take a nap.  ;D

The traffic slowed a little since you guys got your names and I figure you now had to get off your computers at work and catch up because you're behind.  :laugh:

Hope none of got in any trouble with your bosses including you fellas with the neglected honey do lists.

I'm going to work on that sinew backed bow and my victims stave this weekend. Outside where I work best since the  weather is suppose to improve. Well at least the sun is suppose to shine.

You guys are doing a fantastic job. I love your attitude....
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 04:50:16 pm
When I counted all the names on front page I only counted 31... Takening that there is 32 and missing a name ... But I feel your doing a great job... I know I couldn't do it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 27, 2016, 04:58:44 pm
I've still got a mess. trying to fit 2 senders to 3 recipients. Have a lot of backtracking to do, hope I didn't dump the wrong PM's  :( Got in such a big hurry that I made myself more work) I'll bet none of other guys have done that Huh!!
Your doing a fine job Fred! Keep up the good work

+1. Thank you for your time!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 27, 2016, 05:33:34 pm
Fred, i think you've been doin a great job. That nap is well deserved.anyone got any advise on a hackberry layout? My blank is 64" long and currently 1 5/8" at widest til mid limb. Thinkin from there taper to 1/2" tips. Lookin to get 55#. Oh, got my victim's info. So let the games begin \m/
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Blaflair2 on January 27, 2016, 07:59:11 pm
I have a hackberry laid out with a huge knarly knot in the fade. Maybe I'll try and tiller it out. We'll see. I wanna do a lam glue up but it's too cold ATM. So we'll see where we end up. Maybe he'll get two?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 08:30:49 pm
It's nice to set back and let the young ones work on a bow for somebody else
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 09:07:46 pm
I'm sorry to inform the futer owner of the trade bow that my girl and I are making. She just said she will make a hot pink and lime green string for the bow. Now don't fret about the colors she calls it watermelon. I know all of us like watermelon now don't we.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on January 27, 2016, 09:11:36 pm
Gutshot, good to see the kids getting involved. My youngest daughter loves helping out. I hope it stays that way. Anyway, let her know, I'd be honered to have a watermelon string made by her.

Tattoo Dave
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 27, 2016, 09:13:49 pm
well hell yes, side note to dad....dont mess with the tweeners and their pink, could get hurt at the next get together, ever been surrounded by a bunch of girls? >:D >:D >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 09:18:30 pm
well hell yes, side note to dad....dont mess with the tweeners and their pink, could get hurt at the next get together, ever been surrounded by a bunch of girls? >:D >:D >:D
It's not pretty at all
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 27, 2016, 09:21:30 pm
Yes the watermelon string would be her signature touch and I to would love would love it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 09:22:17 pm
Gutshot, good to see the kids getting involved. My youngest daughter loves helping out. I hope it stays that way. Anyway, let her know, I'd be honered to have a watermelon string made by her.

Tattoo Dave
Hay I got one and she made her older brother a pink and blue. So who knows who will get one. I'm afraid to take it off my bow. Can't stand to hurt their fillings
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 27, 2016, 09:23:50 pm
I say give her some paints and let her have fun with it to match the string. I'd be proud to show off a watermelon bow.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 27, 2016, 09:24:48 pm
Here is a photo of me without the personal protective gear.  Thought I would let you see my face.  I look a lot better when my wife is in the picture.  She is the good looking one.

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2015-08/5C128620-2E49-4811-AC38-77DF478FD0BC_zpspyecihfr.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2015-08/5C128620-2E49-4811-AC38-77DF478FD0BC_zpspyecihfr.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 09:51:02 pm
Guys I've got to get some much needed sleep so I'm leaving the bow work for tomorrow night. I've got it shaped and starting to bend
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 27, 2016, 09:55:21 pm
My photos look short and fat. I've got to learn to use photo bucket or imgur
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 27, 2016, 10:29:56 pm
Well, I got a second bamboo slat ready to go, just in case. Also laid out plans for a planing jig that will be able to make both parallel and tapered boards (mainly so I can taper the bamboo).

I hope to have my osage glued by the weekend so I can rough shape it.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on January 27, 2016, 11:04:39 pm
I almost made a pink string for my brother's bow this Christmas to poke at him a little, but decided to go with more traditional color.  If only I had realized I could call it watermelon... he would have gotten a pink string!  In all seriousness, I would be honored to receive a watermelon string or even a pink string from your daughter if I happen to be the lucky guy!

Just came in from scraping on the red bud stave.  Trying to get the back down to one ring.  I've got about 2 feet clean.  Found a couple clusters of pin knots I hadn't seen before.  Once I get the stave clean, I will layout the bow and hopefully the knots won't be a problem. I am probably slower than most, probably takes me 4 or 5 hours to get a stave down to a single ring.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 27, 2016, 11:09:52 pm
Wow - I am out of town one evening and when I return I am 5 pages behind on the trade thread!  Lots of activity here - I love it.  Fred you are doing a great job.

Ok - I think I am going to start 2 bows.  Thinking of a hickory backed trilam and hackberry selfbow.  We will see how it goes.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 28, 2016, 04:01:01 am
Cock a doodle doo. That's my rooster outside saying get up its 3:45 And tell your trade buddies good morning from KY.  Waiting on the black brew to get done and gonna head to work. Let's see the to do list includes going to work BOO! Coming home tonight work on a bow and raw hide YAA!  Hope to see lots of chatter on here today it makes the day go by quicker.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hunterbob on January 28, 2016, 06:51:50 am
I am in the scoundrel trade but I am up and at it already this morning. Well sitting here drinking coffee. Wife at work my day off. Bows to make.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on January 28, 2016, 08:55:08 am
Accidentally got a day to work from home - lots of cancelled appointments- no-one said to work on what, so been roughing out and heat-straightening a hazel lever-arm bow  >:D never made one before so this'uns for practice before the main event, unless it turns out really well, that is.   ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 28, 2016, 09:16:29 am
What a great thread to follow and be involved in....I'm jealous of you lucky dogs home from work today.  Tomorrow the stave press is coming to work with me tho!  >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on January 28, 2016, 09:55:56 am
Well, hunting season is now over for me - no luck this year, at least not on deer.  BUT, I did find a whole bunch of bows growing in the woods, I just need to go pluck em :)

I'm going to try to split my stave in two, but I wanted to check first:  Would it be a safer bet to bandsaw that guy apart, or could I kerf it down the center with a fairly thin blade and then split it?  I know with a bandsaw I can get it even, but I'm not sure what (if anything) that would do to the staves integrity.  I'm worried that if I split it, the split would wander off and I'd lose my backup plan.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: bubbles on January 28, 2016, 10:01:16 am
What kind of wood is it? I have had bad luck splitting elm without Kerfing it first.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 28, 2016, 10:02:15 am
Good morning Fred, at what point of the build do we need not to show no more pics of the bow we are building. I really don't want my person to see the finished bow on here unless you want them posted. Now I'm no where near even close to being finished. Heck not even got a tiller string put on it. I was just here at work thinking so I thought I would ask before I forget.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 28, 2016, 10:11:29 am
Sidman,
      If you have enough saw, cutting will not hurt your stave one lick....do it all the time with red and white elm and Ironwood. If you use the kerf and split you wont be gaining anything but a lot of work ;)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on January 28, 2016, 10:14:47 am
bubbles - it's Osage

half eye - that's what worries me a bit too.  I'm not sure I have enough saw.  All I have is a saw I need to get from my Dad, it's a table top band saw.  It might be a bit to light in the poop to cut that stave.  I will try to get it from him and take some pictures.  If I have to do the kerf thing, your absolutely right, it will be a boat load of work.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 28, 2016, 10:26:14 am
Sidman,
       When I split my Ironwood I make my kerf with the chainsaw....about 1" deep maybe more, drive the wedges to get it split, then cut the intertangled grain with the chainsaw....dont hit a wedge with the saw >:D ya dont want to know how I know that, even more than once,too
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 28, 2016, 10:40:56 am
I like splitting osage and have never cut a kerf except for elm. I've split out 4 full osage trunks and ended up with 26 staves.

Gutshot, I'd like to see pictures from everyone through each building stage the reason being that way I'll know who's not keeping up and who needs help. Besides if those pics are available for all of us to critique the chances are the newer bowyers have a better chance of getting all of our knowledge and advice. That should be a tremendous opportunity for them to send out a bow they can be proud of.

Since no one knows who's building for them the surprise will come when the package arrives on the doorstep.

I'm planning on showing my work through every stage and hope everyone else does also. I did a little heat straightening last night indoors on the bw and will finish with 1 more session outdoors today on the caul.

I think? that showing the process will help us all learn something but if anyone doesn't wish to I will allow them to email me a pic instead of posting it here. I just want assurance that no one is falling behind.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 28, 2016, 11:53:14 am
Hey fellas,
      need to catch up on what I've been up to (besides no good >:D) I wanted to prep some staves for members that I promised some to. Now have all those done. (check out the shop pic....cut just a couple,eh?)
     Got my victim, and dont want to give anything way but had to rough a 3rd set of bows to accommodate his specs.
     Got up to no good on a matter that cant be discussed at this time, and even dragged some otherwise nice guys into it too, my bad >:D
    The quiver is nearly finished, pics in a couple days
Have the award bow waiting for some bling to arrive....if it's OK I'll wait to post it till it's done.

I think I'm mostly caught up so tomorrow I'm going to be chuckling while hackin and slashin on my victims bows. I will post regular pics of that.

Finally, I got a "face shot" to put up....sorry Fred it took so long....so here are the pics
rich
     
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 28, 2016, 11:53:57 am
the rest
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 28, 2016, 11:58:01 am
Cock a doodle doo. That's my rooster outside saying get up its 3:45 And tell your trade buddies good morning from KY.  Waiting on the black brew to get done and gonna head to work. Let's see the to do list includes going to work BOO! Coming home tonight work on a bow and raw hide YAA!  Hope to see lots of chatter on here today it makes the day go by quicker.

I wish the rooster next door only did that at daybreak. It cock a doodle doos all day and night. I may use the new bow when its done just to shut it up. Lol!! ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 28, 2016, 12:03:26 pm
Cock a doodle doo. That's my rooster outside saying get up its 3:45 And tell your trade buddies good morning from KY.  Waiting on the black brew to get done and gonna head to work. Let's see the to do list includes going to work BOO! Coming home tonight work on a bow and raw hide YAA!  Hope to see lots of chatter on here today it makes the day go by quicker.

I wish the rooster next door only did that at daybreak. It cock a doodle doos all day and night. I may use the new bow when its done just to shut it up. Lol!! ;D
I'm coming close to craming a beer up this ones but and throwing it on the smoker for supper this weekend. Just can't tell the kids till we're done eating it
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 28, 2016, 12:04:41 pm
Half eye, don't let that Avalanche fall on you going in and out of the shop. Lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: kid bow on January 28, 2016, 12:21:39 pm
got my draw knife I ordered in the mail. I found a stave of hackberry to use instead of the osage orange. I don't think its even done curing yet so no point in giving someone a half ass bow. this hackberry was cut on valentines day of last year so it should be good to go. thinking of naming it cupids bow and painting it pink >:) lol we will see how many splinters I get from it before I decide to do so.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: rps3 on January 28, 2016, 12:42:34 pm
Gutshot, i just made this string last night for a hackberry I am finishing up. Not pink and green, but neon green and orange...pretty close, but no watermelon.
(http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q556/longbow60/0128161153_zps6wzf5rdk.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: cabinetbowguy on January 28, 2016, 01:07:24 pm
Clamped and now dry trilam hickory  backed
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 28, 2016, 01:20:29 pm
Hey kid  ;)

Here's a thin ringed osage w/ some red cut 2 yrs ago that I'm going to use for my trade bow 61" and 1 1/2" thick at the narrowest part in the handle area. I like working with wider shallow limbs and might rawhide back this one because I'm leaving some sapwood intact.

And just finished my session on the black walnut so I should be able to tiller it out close and then start the sinew.

Mail Lady "Pam" just knocked on the shop door and gave me a big surprise. I purchased 3 Yew staves from Canada and I'm really anxious to open the package. Gota Go!!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 28, 2016, 01:41:33 pm
Gutshot, i just made this string last night for a hackberry I am finishing up. Not pink and green, but neon green and orange...pretty close, but no watermelon.
(http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q556/longbow60/0128161153_zps6wzf5rdk.jpg)
That's cool I will get a pic of the watermelon string tonight on here it's lime green and hot pink. This might start a trend every body might make some sort of a pink string
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 28, 2016, 01:57:37 pm
Alright boys, do i steam or dry heat this twist out? It runs into the handle. Oh , and here's my ugly mug.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 28, 2016, 01:59:35 pm
Don't know why my mugshot is so small, but that's prolly a good thing.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 28, 2016, 02:04:04 pm
Got a lil more done on the ERC molle. Got it pretty well floor tillered and and just glued on some walnut overlays. Next to sand, brace it, then sinew. I havnt made an ERC bow before and this stuff is easy to work except that the heart wood likes to tear out bad. It takes a surprising amount of wood to make these guys stiff. I can't wait to see what the sinew does to it.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 28, 2016, 02:16:47 pm
Hey Mo I bet that shops smelling good. That stave is coming around nicely too.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 28, 2016, 02:44:51 pm
It does make it smell awesome. I feel like I'm going to have to play wth ERC more often.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Onebowonder on January 28, 2016, 03:03:41 pm
Alright boys, do i steam or dry heat this twist out? It runs into the handle. Oh , and here's my ugly mug.

Perhaps I'm not following closely enough, ...but please tell us the specs (length/width/desired draw weight), degrees/amount of twist you want to remove, and wood type you are working with in order to get a better answer.

From your picture - it appears to be a white wood, most of which respond very well to steam or boiling.  If you have the rig to do it, steam the entire limb that you need to move.  Leave it in the steam a good deal past the time you might instinctively expect it to need to take.  You want the heat to evenly penetrate into the full thickness of the wood that you need to move and going too long in the steam will not likely hurt anything.  Have your clamps and bending caul etc. all setup and adjusted to near fit prior to taking the bow out of the steam.  Depending upon the wood type it will have a varied propensity to recover it's original bend.  Ash and Honey locust for example do not seem to know how to keep the new shape you induce with heat or steam.  If you are making the correction primarily in the handle area, which is often a good idea, you might keep the heat gun handy to persuade the new shape to hold once you get it to move.  I'm told you only need to leave it in the caul until the wood is cool, but I generally always leave it over night, ...just in case.  then you'll want to let the wood re-stabilize for humidity before stressing it or you may immediately pull out the correction you induced.

Hope this helps...

OneBow
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 28, 2016, 03:10:40 pm
Hey guys,
I just got back from the lumberyard and saw some wood that looks just like what you got right there but they call it Aromatic cedar or Tennessee Cedar. Is that the same thing as ERC?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 28, 2016, 03:17:39 pm
Onebow, the wood is hackberry. 64" long, 1 5/8" til mid limb taper to 1/2" at tips. Lookin for 55#
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Onebowonder on January 28, 2016, 03:18:21 pm
Kyle - Does the area I circled here concern you for this bow?  -  OneBow
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on January 28, 2016, 03:22:14 pm
Hey guys,
I just got back from the lumberyard and saw some wood that looks just like what you got right there but they call it Aromatic cedar or Tennessee Cedar. Is that the same thing as ERC?
I am 95% sure it is.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 28, 2016, 03:33:54 pm
Otter came over today and we pulled the band saw out of the stave shed and put Iit and our outside bow vise into my shop. Got my billets roughed out and Otter chased a ring on a osage stave. I stole the belly split off of his stave and chased a ring on it while he was laying out his profile. It will be my plan b. We took time to eat and write this so back to the shop we go.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160128_102407949_HDR_1.jpg)
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160128_120032192_1.jpg)
I left a lot of width around this knot.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160128_120046277.jpg)
Otters stave is the one on the left.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160128_135210464.jpg)
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160128_135509321.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 28, 2016, 03:36:47 pm
David. Oklahoma has some ERC growing east of olkmulgee. I go there and visit some friends there and it's on there ranch along with lots of Osage. They call it bodark there. You should be able to find some growing around OKC. They told me they hate the cedar
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Onebowonder on January 28, 2016, 03:46:24 pm
Onebow, the wood is hackberry. 64" long, 1 5/8" til mid limb taper to 1/2" at tips. Lookin for 55#

Well, hackberry is not a wood I have done much with, but I do know that it responds to dry heat quite well.  So, you could do either one you wish probably.  I'd still prefer to use steam or boiling, but heat should do well also.  If the wood is still green or not very seasoned, then I'd be even more inclined toward steam.

I did not mention before - but you likely already know - you have to bend beyond the point that you want to end up with especially on the white woods.  So, if you want 20 degrees of twist taken out, you might untwist the wood to beyond the point you need it to go, to say 30 degrees, or 10 degrees over.  If it doesn't immediately give back the right amount after working the limb some, you'll have to adjust it back a bit.

Hackberry also responds well to heat treating the belly.  So after you get your twist out, you can likely set the change you made pretty effectively by heat treating the belly while it's in the caul.

OneBow
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Badger on January 28, 2016, 03:46:53 pm
Alright boys, do i steam or dry heat this twist out? It runs into the handle. Oh , and here's my ugly mug.

  I would only worry about the twist as it relates the the string lining up with the handle, in other words brace the bow and see how the string intersect your arrow pass. If it doesn't need to move much I would use dry heat, if it has to move much more than 1" I would steam.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 28, 2016, 04:48:10 pm
I got some temp nocks on and a long string off another bow and shot 30 arrows. Might do a little more heating -- the stave has some character which I'm not sure I want to take out completely. Looks like I'll make weight. Shoots nice so far, and it's a very light bow  in the hand -- a little over 15 oz. on the scale on 63" overall. I need to make a new string tonight and do some more looking and shooting.

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBow3.jpg)

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBow1.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 28, 2016, 04:52:26 pm
Damned fellas, all of you guys are smokin......I better get my butt in the saddle, hey the old guy aint used to being behind 8) 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 28, 2016, 05:49:12 pm
Locus loves the heat
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 28, 2016, 06:04:28 pm
Onebowonder, is that in the center of your working limb? If it is there might be a couple alternatives. I looked at your other pics and see where it's located. I wouldn't leave it as is and IMO you should be able to find a way to stabilize it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 28, 2016, 06:06:33 pm
 I picked out the Osage that was debarked, I split the stave middle ways and made two stave's, this was already from a belly split. Turtle went a head and took the belly split from this stave.   
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160128_113807282_zpsnyrdqygc.jpg)[/U

 (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160128_113807282_zpsnyrdqygc.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 28, 2016, 06:09:56 pm
 I then chased a growth ring and made the stave 67" long, my stave is on the left, sister stave to mine in middle and vine Mable billets are turtles.     (http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/PART95145400854552595IMG952016012895135210464_zpsuic9oclm.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/PART95145400854552595IMG952016012895135210464_zpsuic9oclm.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 28, 2016, 06:12:47 pm
I made a guide to make a paramid limbs.   (http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160128_151221644_zpszhnk1n6l.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160128_151221644_zpszhnk1n6l.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 28, 2016, 06:17:12 pm
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160128_151808577_zpses9e7kyb.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160128_151808577_zpses9e7kyb.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Onebowonder on January 28, 2016, 06:19:12 pm
Onebowonder, is that in the center of your working limb? If it is there might be a couple alternatives. I looked at your other pics and see where it's located. I wouldn't leave it as is and IMO you should be able to find a way to stabilize it.

That's actually Mo_Coon's bow there Fred.  It looks like it is in the middle of his Molly's limb.  Much of it may come off as the tillering goes on.  I'm just concerned that the grain may sworl too much around those two knots to be made stable enough, ...but he has a better view of it than we do.  ERC is notorious for issues with the grain causing excitement!  ( I almost typed EXCRIMENT there which would also be true oddly enough!  >:D :o ::) ) He does plan to sinew back it, which will help a lot of issues out as well.

OneBow
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 28, 2016, 06:20:19 pm
I drew my center line and marked out my handle and fades then drew my limbs out.  (http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160128_160324675_HDR_zpsw9b6f7o5.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160128_160324675_HDR_zpsw9b6f7o5.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 28, 2016, 06:21:21 pm
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160128_155830733_zpsmhvbda2t.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160128_155830733_zpsmhvbda2t.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 28, 2016, 06:27:36 pm
I then took it to the band saw and cut out my lines.  (http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160128_164043342_HDR_zps7azd01sx.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160128_164043342_HDR_zps7azd01sx.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 28, 2016, 06:32:43 pm
I have to rasp out around my lines then cut out my thickness tomorrow... On the handle and fades at center of handle I made it 1 1/4".....over 2" to 1" then 2" over to 1 1/2" wide at fade then its 1 1/2" to 1/2" at the tips.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 28, 2016, 06:39:24 pm
Thanks Onebowonder, glad somebody is around here watching  :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 28, 2016, 06:42:47 pm
 Otter, I love the looks of that stave as is. I couldn't bring myself to take the snake out.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 28, 2016, 06:54:37 pm
Just about forgot. Here's the watermelon string
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 28, 2016, 06:57:34 pm
That spot doesn't concern me at all. It's pretty small and at the beginning of the lever. Right after the fade. More than likely most of that will disappear and what doesn't will get filled with powdered deer antler. A few other knota worry me more. But that's what backups are for.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 28, 2016, 07:02:07 pm
Otter, I love the looks of that stave as is. I couldn't bring myself to take the snake out.

Yeah I like it to, I traced my line folwing the grain and keep the snake as much as I could
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 28, 2016, 07:08:11 pm
Dang otter, hope ya got my name....all of you fellas bows is eye candy

Gutshot, hope she likes makin strings....them are nice
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: JW_Halverson on January 28, 2016, 07:12:21 pm
Otter, I love the looks of that stave as is. I couldn't bring myself to take the snake out.

Yeah I like it to, I traced my line folwing the grain and keep the snake as much as I could

It otter work just fine!
   ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 28, 2016, 07:16:18 pm
Just as long as I don't Otter it up lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 28, 2016, 07:17:34 pm
Otter, I love the looks of that stave as is. I couldn't bring myself to take the snake out.

Fred, if you look close at Otters picture with the paper you will see he is folding the paper over at each one of the horizontal lines. Then he held the center line of the paper on the center line of the stave and marked the width a t that point. When done you conect the dots f ollowing the grain. That gives you the width taper of the paper following the snaky centerline. The last picture he posted shows the profile already cut out following the snaky center line.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ryan C on January 28, 2016, 07:28:12 pm
(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm165/jreefer454/4D09D2B8-B4ED-4021-ADE6-8536767ABEE2_zpskd7phid0.jpg) (http://s296.photobucket.com/user/jreefer454/media/4D09D2B8-B4ED-4021-ADE6-8536767ABEE2_zpskd7phid0.jpg.html)will rough this out on the bandsaw Saturday hopefully.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: dylanholderman on January 28, 2016, 07:35:35 pm
man its hard keeping up with you guys! ::) ;D


That osage has a preformed arrow shelf. It just screams center shot.

sadly that wobble isn't anywhere near the handle, and its only 58" long


last night i got the honeysuckle and the osage roughed out and bending slightly on a floor tiller, more pics soon ;)

this is my side profile by the way :-X
any advice on this one would be help full.
(http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w411/dylanholderman/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/AF7E58DF-267F-4D61-88F3-2D32838E211D_1.jpg) (http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/dylanholderman/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/AF7E58DF-267F-4D61-88F3-2D32838E211D_1.jpg.html)

(http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w411/dylanholderman/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/47084FD6-4F82-4D2B-A6E6-F29F2F8F21B7.jpg) (http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/dylanholderman/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/47084FD6-4F82-4D2B-A6E6-F29F2F8F21B7.jpg.html)

and the honeysuckle, much nicer looking.
(http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w411/dylanholderman/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/F44C4BB0-CA56-4B01-91D7-686D3EE0C708.jpg) (http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/dylanholderman/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/F44C4BB0-CA56-4B01-91D7-686D3EE0C708.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: dylanholderman on January 28, 2016, 07:40:32 pm
gutshot thats a pretty cool looking string :) i think i'll have to try making one myself(is it a endless loop style string?)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 28, 2016, 07:43:30 pm
Otter and Turtle, you guys are cookin!

Half eye, where are you getting all that snow? Still haven't plowed once yet this year in Vermont! Not thaat I'm complaining........ but it's weird!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 28, 2016, 07:48:11 pm
Nice lookin caul and blank, gutshot!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 28, 2016, 07:49:55 pm
PlanB,
     Northern Lower MI......about where the tip of you ring finger is.....we get system snow and lake effect both. If I'm lucky on normal winters snowblow once a day....here lately twice a day.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 28, 2016, 07:50:03 pm
I'm going to work on a hhb stave tomorrow some for back up plan just in case I have a miss hap  :o
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 28, 2016, 07:54:44 pm
Hey guys I just went back to page 20 to look over what's been shown so far and see if we left any questions unanswered and there's a lot of nice staves and work being done here. Awesome

Dylan I think I'd clamp it to a caul or even a 2 x 4 and heat some of the dippety doos out of it. It will make it much easier to align and tiller.

And half eye, I've seen you whip out bows so fast that if you started when we did we'd never catch up with you
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 28, 2016, 08:00:18 pm
Man your crushing B....I was wondering how much you were going to deflex it and then reflex your tips.  I have started a second stave after getting my guy and I'm thinking of doing the same.  The stave is 64"....I may go a little heavier on the deflex reflex.  Have you made bows with more deflex then what you put in this one?

Coming along nicely otter....I've only worked one osage and it was quite a pleasure.  I like you pyramid layout.  It can be hard to layout a pyramid profile on a bow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 28, 2016, 08:08:56 pm
Man your crushing B....I was wondering how much you were going to deflex it and then reflex your tips.  I have started a second stave after getting my guy and I'm thinking of doing the same.  The stave is 64"....I may go a little heavier on the deflex reflex.  Have you made bows with more deflex then what you put in this one?

Coming along nicely otter....I've only worked one osage and it was quite a pleasure.  I like you pyramid layout.  It can be hard to layout a pyramid profile on a bow.
Where you at on the map ajooter ? I've only made six successful bows so far  :o  and five of them were Osage.. I'm in Ohio and there's plenty of it... I made one bow out of hhb given to me at the classic in Tennessee couple years ago ... At that said I pray this will be lucky number 7 and my best one lol.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 28, 2016, 08:20:39 pm
Ajooter, I had wanted more deflex, but I don't think I steamed it long enough -- went 45 minutes. Next time an hour. But then black birch is an unknown anyway as far as steaming goes -- I'm just learning what it can and can't do with it.

This is the first BB stave bow I've done,.Before, I did a board bow and a sapling bow with it. It runs clear if the tree is any size -- it must drop branches very early in the woods. It's a very dense high stiffness wood, so you have to tiller down thin if the limbs are whitewood width.

Birch is supposed to make a good bow for cold weather, and I've shot my other bb bows this winter without problems. It makes a light bow that seems to hold its shape well and I think it's a pretty fast wood. It rings noticeably when you tap it with a knuckle. My elm bow doesn't do that as much.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 28, 2016, 08:24:12 pm
I'm in albany ny...I got my stave from sidewinder when he was sending them out.  I had a friend going to Missouri every year to hunt bUT I think that's over for now.  I would like get my hands on some hhb...I know where there's a stash  ;).

I walloped my hand with a hammer today so I'm going to take a day or two off.  I'm gonna post some progress aND pics tonight with a couple ?s.

I did some work in Elyria oh a couple years ago....biggest deer I've ever seen with my own eyes that's for sure!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 28, 2016, 08:27:03 pm
Ajooter if you're in Albany, you're not very far from me. I'm in the SE corner of VT.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 28, 2016, 08:27:43 pm
You guys are flyin!  :o   Some nice looking bows coming along - hackberry, ERC, osage, hickory .... lots of different kinds of wood.  I love it.

Figured I better get my butt in gear and at least pick out some stuff!  :-[

Going to start on two and see where it goes...

First one is hackberry cut in 2011.  Have it roughed out and just starting to work it down.  1 3/4" parallel limbs to just about mid-limb and then tapered to 1/2" at tips.  Looking at 66" ntn.  Plan on heating a little bit of reflex into it before tillering.

Second one is new for me.  Going to try a trilam bow - hickory backed - hard maple belly and core.  Want to make a form of some kind that I can use to put in a bit of deflex out of the handle and the some mild reflex to tips.  Thinking 66" on this one also and similar limb profile as #1.  Need to make a jig so that I can grind the lams down to correct thickness.  Lots to do!!!

Do you think the grain looks ok on the hickory backing?



Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: kid bow on January 28, 2016, 08:30:39 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/kvCqoGb.jpg) (http://imgur.com/kvCqoGb)

(http://i.imgur.com/OfWleOQ.jpg) (http://imgur.com/OfWleOQ)

(http://i.imgur.com/vTvTvE6.jpg) (http://imgur.com/vTvTvE6)


(http://i.imgur.com/HSDmnVi.jpg) (http://imgur.com/HSDmnVi)



this little stave was taken down due to a knot that would  have literally destroyed the bow. so I think I'm going to sinew back this
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 28, 2016, 08:33:47 pm
Ok, where's everybody from? I'm in Lambertville, Michigan. Sittin on top of Toledo, Ohio. Right on the border.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 28, 2016, 08:34:39 pm
Kid Bow, your workbench is shaped just like mine!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: kid bow on January 28, 2016, 08:40:28 pm
Kid Bow, your workbench is shaped just like mine!
haha funny how that happens isn't it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 28, 2016, 08:41:01 pm
South eastern Ohio.  About twenty miles up the Muskingum river from the Ohio river.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 28, 2016, 08:48:27 pm
gutshot thats a pretty cool looking string :) i think i'll have to try making one myself(is it a endless loop style string?)

I don't even know what a endless loop string is.  I just make strings and so does my little girl. It might be a endless loop. Lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 28, 2016, 08:54:58 pm
MW...that hick grain is gorgeous

Stix, I'm in between Traverse City and Harbor Springs.(northwest lower)....we are the hill-billies not the millionaires >:D

Plan B, you should make a screamer, I made real decent bows from yellow birch and black is a bunch tougher.

Kid Bow, ya gonna need a real big rat-trap for the critter that left them chips....never mind he done left a real fine draw knife behind 8) 8) 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 28, 2016, 09:02:03 pm
I'm from Pulaski co Kentucky South east portion. We are known for Lake Cumberland. You Ohio guys know where that is don't ya?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 28, 2016, 09:04:39 pm
Half eye, i'd rather hang with the hillbillies than the millionaires anyday, got an idea where your at. I hunt around Mio, not real far from ya. I've hunted around u to Turtle, in Rio Grande.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jeffp51 on January 28, 2016, 09:20:04 pm
Ok, where's everybody from? I'm in Lambertville, Michigan. Sittin on top of Toledo, Ohio. Right on the border.
I am living in Pleasant grove, Utah--just south of Salt Lake City.  I grew up in southern Utah and have lived in Cincinnati Ohio, East Germany (mostly Berlin), Columbia Missouri, and San Angelo Texas.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 28, 2016, 09:27:09 pm
Got my vine maple billets ready to cut the splice. Glued a sacrificial ply board and a paper template to each one with school glue.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/20160128_204535.jpg)

Will cut them out on the bandsaw tomorrow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on January 28, 2016, 09:41:13 pm
I'm in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma! ;)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 28, 2016, 09:42:38 pm
turtle, I like that. I haven't seen or tried  plywood used before. Now I see how to keep my splices from turning on me.

I'm just west of Elba, NE. Population 215?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 28, 2016, 09:46:44 pm
I'm from southeastern Ohio and neighbor to Turtle where brothers... I tell everyone he's my big brother.. Lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 28, 2016, 09:55:24 pm
It's great fun to see all these updates, it makes me wanna call in sick tomorrow so I can work on mine!
Great work folks!

I've got 4" of natural reflex in my piece. Is that to much to start with? I have a vague memory of reading somewhere you could get into trouble starting with that much reflex but I don't remember why.
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8229.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8229.jpg.html)

J
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 28, 2016, 10:27:41 pm
I am from Albion, NE.  About a 100 miles northwest of Omaha.

Half eye - I though the hickory board looked good when I bought it too.  We will see!

Turtle - I have never made a bow with billets before - I am learning from you!!!

Andersson - that baby has some serious reflex.  From my experience that much reflex makes them a little trickery to get to brace.  Once you get there and get a good tiller, it should really zip an arrow!

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on January 28, 2016, 10:33:54 pm
It's great fun to see all these updates, it makes me wanna call in sick tomorrow so I can work on mine!
Great work folks!

I've got 4" of natural reflex in my piece. Is that to much to start with? I have a vague memory of reading somewhere you could get into trouble starting with that much reflex but I don't remember why.
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8229.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8229.jpg.html)

J

How long and wide is that osage? Whats it rings look like? I been wanting a piece very close to that for a bit. Might trade ya for another bit that you may like better?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 28, 2016, 10:35:06 pm
I live in Wabasha, MN.  If any of you have seen the Grumpy Old Men movie, that is where the movie took place.  It is in SE MN along the Mississippi. 

I took the profile of the BL down to my lines and glued on Black Walnut top overlays tonight.  I found and area of concern on the back and decided to back it with rawhide.  Anyone have experience putting rawhide over a small raised knot? 

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/FEA5DCA5-7AFB-4BAB-A9FD-75210245F40F_zpsdaockavs.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/FEA5DCA5-7AFB-4BAB-A9FD-75210245F40F_zpsdaockavs.jpg.html)

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/DE6CB901-48FB-4BCC-9C40-298DDA9A49AE_zpshmovbdto.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/DE6CB901-48FB-4BCC-9C40-298DDA9A49AE_zpshmovbdto.jpg.html)

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 28, 2016, 10:41:28 pm
Works fine buddy....make sure you soak it long enough so it's nice and pliable.  Clay Hayes does a nice demo on YouTube.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 28, 2016, 10:44:16 pm
Guys I just got off work and I'm officially on vacation for 7 days.  I'm from Wilson Oklahoma about 100 miles south of okc Oklahoma.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 28, 2016, 10:48:11 pm
Columbia Heights/Minneapolis MN here!
Swampman: Good to see a fellow Minnesotan! :)
Sleek: Lilac baby, lilac.  ;) Still want it?
mwosborn: Nothing worse then tricky to brace? Well then, good to go!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on January 28, 2016, 10:55:47 pm
I'm gonna be MIA for the next couple days. We finally have fishable ice on the bay(Erie PA) with rain coming Sunday. I have about 36 hours of perch fishing in my future before the ice isn't safe. I throw up some pics of my catch on Sunday. Snuck out for a  3 hour scouting trip earlier and caught 12 keepers so the bite is good.

I have two of my staves roughed out and will posts pics of those as well. But first... I have to fill the freezer while I can.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 28, 2016, 10:56:18 pm
Swampman, If you have some thin superglue, I'd put a drop on it, if it soaks completely in add another drop and so forth continuing until it will absorb no more. Don't add too fast or any more than you need to or it will just run where you don't want or need it.

I actually let my first drop dry and sand lightly over it. If it's not filled then the sawdust will settle into the crevice, leave it there and add another small drop, repeat the process as necessary. In the end just lightly sand it in to feather out smoothly. You should be good to go.

I've actually done the same thing with wood glue and sawdust mixed together to fill any crevices but like to at least soak the pin drops with a drop of superglue.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 28, 2016, 10:57:43 pm
The second stave I was working on had a large knot on the side of the limb that I end up losing in the final layout of the bow.  I'm questioning the grain swirls that were left behind and wondering if they will hold up.  Also the side profile is very different due to the knot removal as seen in the pictures. 

Also I would like to deflex the handle and add some reflex to the tips.  There is a knot about 7" down from one of the tips directly centered in the limb.  I'm wondering how it will affect the limb being reflexed? If it will pose a problem.

Knot
(http://i.imgur.com/FrJeUxQ.jpg?1)
Former knot location grain swirl
(http://i.imgur.com/nV7vhfu.jpg?1)
Side taper 1
(http://i.imgur.com/X70JT5R.jpg?1)
Side taper 2
(http://i.imgur.com/345WEJN.jpg?1)
Knot near limb tip
(http://i.imgur.com/Xop429o.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 28, 2016, 11:18:19 pm
I am from Albion, NE.  About a 100 miles northwest of Omaha.

Half eye - I though the hickory board looked good when I bought it too.  We will see!

Turtle - I have never made a bow with billets before - I am learning from you!!!

Andersson - that baby has some serious reflex.  From my experience that much reflex makes them a little trickery to get to brace.  Once you get there and get a good tiller, it should really zip an arrow!


I spliced half of two different failed bows together once, but this is my first time working with actual billets. Im just hoping I don't screw it up. ???
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on January 29, 2016, 12:20:25 am
Swampman, If you have some thin superglue, I'd put a drop on it, if it soaks completely in add another drop and so forth continuing until it will absorb no more. Don't add too fast or any more than you need to or it will just run where you don't want or need it.

I actually let my first drop dry and sand lightly over it. If it's not filled then the sawdust will settle into the crevice, leave it there and add another small drop, repeat the process as necessary. In the end just lightly sand it in to feather out smoothly. You should be good to go.

I've actually done the same thing with wood glue and sawdust mixed together to fill any crevices but like to at least soak the pin drops with a drop of superglue.



Thanks Fred.  That makes good sense.  I will try that.  The area of concern is actually on the back at the handle.  The grain dipped in so I was using my gooseneck scraper to follow the ring.  I dipped in a little to far.  It is in a non bending area so I should be good but I am going to add rawhide just to be safe.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 29, 2016, 04:36:51 am
I live in Wabasha, MN.  If any of you have seen the Grumpy Old Men movie, that is where the movie took place.  It is in SE MN along the Mississippi. 

I took the profile of the BL down to my lines and glued on Black Walnut top overlays tonight.  I found and area of concern on the back and decided to back it with rawhide.  Anyone have experience putting rawhide over a small raised knot? 

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/FEA5DCA5-7AFB-4BAB-A9FD-75210245F40F_zpsdaockavs.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/FEA5DCA5-7AFB-4BAB-A9FD-75210245F40F_zpsdaockavs.jpg.html)

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/DE6CB901-48FB-4BCC-9C40-298DDA9A49AE_zpshmovbdto.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/DE6CB901-48FB-4BCC-9C40-298DDA9A49AE_zpshmovbdto.jpg.html)
Those pin knots are agrivating. im also working with BL. Since your backing it could you just shave the pin knots off? What about it Half eye and Fred?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 29, 2016, 04:47:15 am
Good morning bow traders. The coffee is almost done brewing. Time to get after it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 29, 2016, 06:06:42 am
Hey guys can any of you teach me how to use the "quotes" without adding the photos back in? I'm computer illiterate and adding the same pics just seems to take up needed space.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 29, 2016, 06:25:53 am
Just delete the picture links in the quoted text and they won't show up fred.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 29, 2016, 06:34:40 am
Fred, I'm not for sure but believe if you right click and hold (pass over what ever you want to highlight) you can simply highlight what part you want to insert.......thats coming from a fella in the same spot as you.

Gutshot,  can you say how that knot runs, straight through, sloped etc.....anyways rawhide will probably keep it good.....if the knot is solid thats good too....the knot will not have compression issues so it may not collapse fromcompression

AJ, if that is ironwood (hhb) leave the whoopy-to-do will not effect anything....the knott in the centerlineof the bow wont matter either that pic where you went around it at the edge....I have sawn straight through knotts like that and just dressed like they were not there and had no permormance issues.....this is on/in Hop Hornbeam mind you. I know your a hatchet guy. Could you get a couple different angle's on that knot and please correct me on the wood.

I'm diggin out of an hr. or so and gettin after it.
rich

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 29, 2016, 07:42:38 am
It's actually hickory rich.  I'll try and get a different pic of it at another angle.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 29, 2016, 08:32:18 am
Hey guys can any of you teach me how to use the "quotes" without adding the photos back in? I'm computer illiterate and adding the same pics just seems to take up needed space.

Fred, ind the pics in your quoted message. They will have [img] tags around them. highlight them and then delete. Done.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 29, 2016, 10:08:26 am
Hey guys a couple of updates:

#1 My local phone company has been having problems with their email system. It was down last weekend and they still haven't got it fixed. I've been informed by them:

"Recently we had a planned maintenance to upgrade our mail server system
to a new server, things unfortunately didn't go as planned and we have
to reschedule the maintenance. As the amount of email we're hosting has
increased we are forced to extend the amount of downtime to ensure that
there are no omissions or errors in copying user's email to the new
system.

We will be performing this maintenance starting Friday, February 5th at
6pm and will be done before Monday February 8th at 7am. The purpose of
this upgrade is to address the recent "slowness" of the email system, in
particular the webmail portals. We are completely aware that there is
an issue and this upcoming maintenance will remedy the situation.

We thank you for your continued patience during these maintenance
windows as we strive to provide the best possible services."

Thank you!

#2  We've a few individuals who are not participating as they should. I've sent out a few PM's asking those individuals who are making bows for these guys to slow down a bit. We may have to do some shuffling on some names. No biggie. I'm not going to have a few slackers ruin this years trade for everybody else. I'm going to eliminate it early so we have less chance of surprises at the end.

You guys are doing a tremendous job. Keep it up and thanks again for participating.

Fred
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on January 29, 2016, 11:12:04 am

#2  We've a few individuals who are not participating as they should. I've sent out a few PM's asking those individuals who are making bows for these guys to slow down a bit. We may have to do some shuffling on some names. No biggie. I'm not going to have a few slackers ruin this years trade for everybody else. I'm going to eliminate it early so we have less chance of surprises at the end.

You guys are doing a tremendous job. Keep it up and thanks again for participating.

Fred

That's great management Fred......thank you for all your work to make this a huge success.

Drew
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on January 29, 2016, 11:34:48 am
I've got 2 sick girls at home today with what looks like a stomach bug.  With 6 kids plus me and the missus, if it is a stomach bug, I'm likely to be praying for the sweet release of death in the next day or so.  But, God willing, I'm going to split out that Osage stave this weekend, and hopefully come out with two good solid pieces for some half eye inspired semi-short bows, and maybe even a good belly split that I can back with boo.  Will post pics regarding that work when I can, yall cross your fingers that our whole family ain't hugging the porcelain all weekend.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PEARL DRUMS/PEARLY/PD/DRUMS on January 29, 2016, 11:39:47 am
Cut out the bad before it infects the whole bunch Fred. Good call muchacho'.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 29, 2016, 11:46:39 am
Sidmand, you're doing fine. You take care of those girls, they come first in my book. We're glad to have you. Get back to us when you can.
Fred
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 29, 2016, 12:01:07 pm
Little update here:  I got my splice for my osage in a good spot, but I'm a little doubtful about my glue of choice.  I was initially going to use TBIII, but as I want to make this as bombproof as possible.  I'm going to order some Smooth On, since it seems to be a pretty highly recommended and used epoxy for bowmaking.

I will still work on getting the bow rough shaped and the bamboo tapered over the next few days!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 29, 2016, 12:24:58 pm
Little update here:  I got my splice for my osage in a good spot, but I'm a little doubtful about my glue of choice.  I was initially going to use TBIII, but as I want to make this as bombproof as possible.  I'm going to order some Smooth On, since it seems to be a pretty highly recommended and used epoxy for bowmaking.

I use smooth on. A little goes a long way. And holds awesome!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 29, 2016, 12:34:27 pm
OK fellas,
     Just "in case" we are adding one new person to cover any difficulties. Wont be any changes in who got who.......look for the new postings picture, pics of staves work progress etc etc This is without doubt the best damned trade to date.....so thanks to all of you. Whole lot of "firsts" going on here and personally I wish to thank all of you people for the great attitudes and hard work.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: pincushin on January 29, 2016, 01:54:12 pm
That sounds good, Rich  :)  :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 29, 2016, 02:28:33 pm
What do y'all think about mulberry billets?  These have been drying with the bark on for 9 month. You think that's long enough I don't have a moisture meter. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 29, 2016, 02:33:23 pm
What do y'all think about mulberry billets?  These have been drying with the bark on for 9 month. You think that's long enough I don't have a moisture meter.
I'd go ahead and work them down to floor tillering then keep them in your house or heat box for about three weeks and go and splice and tiller
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on January 29, 2016, 03:16:13 pm
anyone ever use the Harbor Freight moisture meters?  I'm going to try and pick one up this weekend to see where my stave is at - it's only around 15 bucks and I got a coupon somewhere for 20% off.  Anyone have one?  Are they worth it at all?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 29, 2016, 03:34:22 pm
anyone ever use the Harbor Freight moisture meters?  I'm going to try and pick one up this weekend to see where my stave is at - it's only around 15 bucks and I got a coupon somewhere for 20% off.  Anyone have one?  Are they worth it at all?

I don't have any experience with the HB moisture but do have a pin type meter I purchased years ago online. Only used it a couple of times. It shows surface moisture but doesn't tell you what's going on deeper in the wood. If I'm not
positive that the stave is dry I will take it to rough floor tiller and then keep it in the house for 2 or 3 weeks to let it stabilize. You can also weigh it every few days untill it stops losing weight.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 29, 2016, 03:35:37 pm
Yes Score bonus for me and the guy on the other end of this trade. There will be arrows made now for the bow I'm making. Found these in the bed of my truck today.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 29, 2016, 03:48:35 pm
turtle, I like that. I haven't seen or tried  plywood used before. Now I see how to keep my splices from turning on me.


Yeah.......... I need all the help I can when I try to make fine cuts.  :o
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: lebhuntfish on January 29, 2016, 04:07:34 pm

#2  We've a few individuals who are not participating as they should. I've sent out a few PM's asking those individuals who are making bows for these guys to slow down a bit. We may have to do some shuffling on some names. No biggie. I'm not going to have a few slackers ruin this years trade for everybody else. I'm going to eliminate it early so we have less chance of surprises at the end.

You guys are doing a tremendous job. Keep it up and thanks again for participating.

Fred

That's great management Fred......thank you for all your work to make this a huge success.

Drew

Way to go Fred!
Patrick
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on January 29, 2016, 04:19:00 pm
I don't have any experience with the HB moisture but do have a pin type meter I purchased years ago online. Only used it a couple of times. It shows surface moisture but doesn't tell you what's going on deeper in the wood. If I'm not
positive that the stave is dry I will take it to rough floor tiller and then keep it in the house for 2 or 3 weeks to let it stabilize. You can also weigh it every few days untill it stops losing weight.

Thanks for the info turtle!  That's what I was going to do first, but was thinking of getting the meter as a second/backup indicator.  If I can get it cheap I might still try it out, but when I split that wood this weekend I will just try to get them floor tillered and put them in my bedroom under the bed.  They aught to dry out the rest of the way in there fairly quickly and safely.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 29, 2016, 05:05:15 pm
I don't know if it would be better to ask this question here (since it is for the bow I'm building) or if I should make a new thread for it, but I'll try here 1st.

 I've been reading a bit of TTBB vol 4, gleaning information from it for the bow I'm going to build, when I got to Badger's chapter about the Mass Principle.  What he wrote makes sense to me and I'd like to build this bow using this principle as a guideline.  I have two questions that I didn't see addressed (maybe I missed it), but I'm sure someone around here might have the answers:

1) Does backing the bow change the end mass (if you do not perry reflex it; I did see you should reduce weight if perry reflexing)? Example: would a rawhide backed osage bow and an osage selfbow have the same weight if they were both built the same shape, length, draw weight, and draw length?

2) The formula says to add to the weight of the bow if there is "induced" reflex (but makes the distinction that if you perry reflex you should lower the weight).  Would flipping the tips before glue-up of a backed bow be considered an example of induced reflex?

Thanks!

(edit: 1st question to distinguish bewteen a backed bow that's left flat vs a backed bow that's perry reflexed)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Blaflair2 on January 29, 2016, 05:13:14 pm
I haven't been doing much work. Still pretty cold in the shop with no heat. I brought in my black locust recurve to get it to equalize and do some heat bending. Still not sure what direction I'm going for sure.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ranasp on January 29, 2016, 05:34:59 pm
Ok looks like some poor jerk is going to get my first attempt at a bow.  Literally just one week ago I got my hands on the bowmaker's bible vol 1 and 2, a draw knife, and an offer of some well cured black locust and ironwood from a guy who started making bows but dropped it due to family stuff and other hobbies intruding.  So I'm trying my hand at it, and everyone here can behold the comedy show this will likely end up being. 

As for me, I hate to ask for anything when the person I'm paired with will likely get a junky stick, but I'm a right hander shooting 43-55# at 28". 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 29, 2016, 05:38:58 pm
Keep a positive attitude, this is supposed to be fun, failure is an option, you have until August if the first doesn't work out, and show your work and ask questions. You'll produce something to be proud of. Remember Plan B.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 29, 2016, 05:48:56 pm
Welcome to you Ranasp!!!
Ok looks like some poor jerk is going to get my first attempt at a bow.  Literally just one week ago I got my hands on the bowmaker's bible vol 1 and 2, a draw knife, and an offer of some well cured black locust and ironwood from a guy who started making bows but dropped it due to family stuff and other hobbies intruding.  So I'm trying my hand at it, and everyone here can behold the comedy show this will likely end up being. 

As for me, I hate to ask for anything when the person I'm paired with will likely get a junky stick, but I'm a right hander shooting 43-55# at 28". 

8) I know at least 2 old retired guys that are going to help make sure you get it right. Isn't that right half eye?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 29, 2016, 06:56:59 pm
Absolutely.....failure is not an option. With this particular group of people aint no way ya do anything but good.   

And, welcome to the trade
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 29, 2016, 07:14:06 pm
Went ahead and did some dry heatin, so gonna see has that turns out. Figure if that dont work just gonna steam the whole thing. Also got another hackberry blank goin.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 29, 2016, 07:38:03 pm
Lookin good stix

The other day when I was steaming I was going to tell y'all that I had a steaming "thing" in the how to section....but decided to just take some pics and post them for anyone who may wish to use the stuff.

First off I never steam wood more than 5 minuets ((up to 3/4 thick) and never more than 10 min at one time. A couple things with that, when the bow comes out of the steam it is less than 5 seconds to complete the bend ....no not a misprint. I either make my bends by hand for myself and "multi bender for other folks bow. As soon as the wood comes out from under the tin foil....right to the jig and bent, right in front of the stove and your done.

The pot is a "pasta" cooker and I use it because it is oval in shape.

anyway here are the pics and if there's any ? please ask
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 29, 2016, 07:43:20 pm
Neat set up there Rich. Can you tell us what those other slots cut in the board are for?

Ty, I hate to admit it but I don't know anything about mass principle although I've seen some terrible results on a couple of my earlier bows from not understanding and paying attention to it. Possibly Badger or others with more knowledge will point you in the right direction.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 29, 2016, 07:47:28 pm
Half eye , is that recipe for white woods? I got whole rig for steamin, two 4" x 4' pipe with a 4" T in the middle. Steam the whole thing than rite to the caul. I've done osage and usually "cook" it for an hour or more. Any advise is greatly appreciated.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 29, 2016, 07:50:24 pm
1) Does backing the bow change the end mass (if you do not perry reflex it; I did see you should reduce weight if perry reflexing)? Example: would a rawhide backed osage bow and an osage selfbow have the same weight if they were both built the same shape, length, draw weight, and draw length?

I haven't tried to build using the mass principle but would assume that the rawhide backed bow would weigh more, because it only protects the bow and doesn't add to the performance like a wood or sinew backing does.  You would have to add the weight of the rawhide to your total mass.

2) The formula says to add to the weight of the bow if there is "induced" reflex (but makes the distinction that if you perry reflex you should lower the weight).  Would flipping the tips before glue-up of a backed bow be considered an example of induced reflex?

Im not familiar enough with the mass principle to give you a good answer. I would think that flipping the tips would be considered induced reflex .
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 29, 2016, 08:07:53 pm
Stix.....I've bent osage both ways lateral (snake) and recurves and whoop-de-doos. Never more than what I said. The reason for that is thats long enough to get the wood to 212 going longer just boils out the "good-stuff" from the wood.......most problems happen when there is a delay between "out of the steam to the actual bend" if it is more than about 15 seconds you are allready too late. They used to make wagon wheels up here and my bud has 4 "half-rims" for 48" wheels that are 3X6 bent in a half circle with no issues to the wood at all and they are more than 100 years old.....those are steamed but also shot with steam during the whole process.

Fred The slots and "rounds make 4 different radius type bends all the way from long (high slot on the left) to short static turns slot far to right.....the parrallel slots on top Is when I want to straighten snake.....I lign that up first wher I want to straighten and set the block on the floor below the stove.....out of the steam ...tip under the cupboard toe kick and edge bend in the slot.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 29, 2016, 09:04:31 pm

First off I never steam wood more than 5 minuets ((up to 3/4 thick) and never more than 10 min at one time. A couple things with that, when the bow comes out of the steam it is less than 5 seconds to complete the bend ....no not a misprint.

Well, that's a new one on me. Most every steaming wood source says 45 min. to an hour per inch. But if it works for you on your bows, I certainly believe you, and I'm going to try it that way next time. Can't argue with success! Thanks for the explanation.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 29, 2016, 09:19:43 pm
Lookin great stix.  I'm sure that's gonna be a sweet shooter.

Rich I'll be posting some similar pics shortly hopefully.

B....maybe we ought to get together and do some tillerng!

Way to stay on top of the trade Fred!!  Only way to keep it going smoothly.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 29, 2016, 09:20:38 pm
The wood block is just for leverage....cant remember what the post name was but I have pics in it where I took a couple inches (lateral) out of some osage and even showed the stove clock to prove the timing.

You put the bend in after 5 min of steam, do the bend, and hold it in place for maybe 2 minuets.....done  .....but if you feel the wood it will still be hot as all get out.
rich

PS if it will help, I'll redo the pics of a actual bend with the clock in the pics and how I do it.....I think I can sweet talk Mrs. into a few minuets of her time. One other thing....even if I steam in the evening, the bow is ready to work the next day with no issues. Did ya ever notice when you take the wood out after an hour how the wood looks bone dry? If ya bend it like I do the wood will be "wet" when bent and only needs to dry some.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on January 29, 2016, 09:26:44 pm
After steam i usually wait aboot 4 days before anymore work, after dry heat usually wait 2 days. Dont like to rush things. Patience , grasshopper.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on January 29, 2016, 10:48:15 pm
Ty, good questions.  I've read that chapter too and the mass principle makes sense to me.  I've been conscious of those principles with the bows I've built in the past year.  I'm certainly not qualified to answer your questions but why don't you PM Badger and ask him directly......keep us posted. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 29, 2016, 11:00:48 pm

PS if it will help, I'll redo the pics of a actual bend with the clock in the pics and how I do it.....I think I can sweet talk Mrs. into a few minuets of her time. One other thing....even if I steam in the evening, the bow is ready to work the next day with no issues. Did ya ever notice when you take the wood out after an hour how the wood looks bone dry? If ya bend it like I do the wood will be "wet" when bent and only needs to dry some.

Rich you don't have to prove it (to me at least), I've seen your work, and totally believe it. Just glad to know it can be done that way. :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on January 29, 2016, 11:39:53 pm
Rich, yes indeed, I'm glad to know of your success with your technique too.  I will try it.  I've had numerous conversations with other bowyers about the potential degrade of bow wood by excessively steaming or heating it.  I've steamed green staves for an hour + to bend the entire stave but also wonder how it's changing the wood.  A wagon wheel that remains fairly static and a bow that  must constantly bend are two different situations obviously.  Have you ever seen any scientific data on the property effects of steaming and heating wood?  That would be most interesting.  I work with hickory a good bit.  Have you had the same success with hickory using those very short steam times?

Thanks......Drew
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PatM on January 30, 2016, 12:09:47 am
You'll find that most studies show an increase of wood strength properties with steaming at typical temperatures for up to  an hour.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 30, 2016, 05:52:42 am
I've got to get around to reading these books. I have no idea what mass principle is or anything else. When I build a bow I just go with the flow. Yes I do heat and steam the bow to get unwanted flaws or to recurve the tips or to straighten enough to get the string in the correct spot. I guess my theory is just take what the wood gives you and go with it. Might be the wrong way but it's the Gutshot way. Oh well at least I'm learning a lot from everybody from the youngest to the oldest and that's why I joined up for this trade. Hey David let's see a pic of the best looking shave horse on this thread. The pic of you I could just barely see part of it. But dang it looked like a nice one. Well let's just all post a pick of our shave horses if you got one. I'll post mine tonight.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 06:27:09 am
Gutshot, sounds exactly like some ole dude I know ::)  Except for the "get the books part" dont know if it's a case of "too old" or "this works just fine".
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 30, 2016, 07:01:19 am
HALF EYE. WORKS JUST FINE SOUNDS GOOD TO ME.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on January 30, 2016, 08:44:38 am
My shave horse is just a kind of long 3-legged stool - two legs one end joined to the third by a piece of 3x2 - about 3 foot long - that I knocked up out of bits of scrap timber - I usually bolt an engineers vice onto one end and sit on a removable seat on the other for carving.  The seat has long lugs that sit each side of the cross-bar but when I am shaving down a length of timber, it goes onto the timber and my weight holds the timber in place giving me a 3 feet long legth of timber to plane, supported by the cross bar,  without a hold-down in the way.  I prefer the set up on my work bench as I have bolted a wooden 'anvil' to one of the legs - a piece of 4x4 pine extending to about the height of my solar plexus.  This anvil is placed so timber can be held in the bench-vice and supported by the anvil for work- its been so useful I almost never use the surface of the bench except for leaving tools on.  One day I'm going to replace it with a leg-vice..........

(https://stuckinthemudsite.files.wordpress.com/2016/01/image.jpeg)

getting ready to de-bark my hazel  bow
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 08:45:56 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_112315443_zpsygo1sxxt.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_112315443_zpsygo1sxxt.jpg.html)
Yesterday I worked on my trade bow I marked 5/8" to reduce limb thickness and cut it out on bandsaw
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 08:46:46 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_112333292_HDR_zpsnjhmb6hh.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_112333292_HDR_zpsnjhmb6hh.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 08:48:37 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_123025731_zpsf3zcaqze.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_123025731_zpsf3zcaqze.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 08:50:58 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_133856515_zpsk8jwrele.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_133856515_zpsk8jwrele.jpg.html)
I worked it to floor tillering ... Now ready to put in the form to dry heat
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 08:55:18 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_161112845_zpsi44fstuy.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_161112845_zpsi44fstuy.jpg.html)
I put Crisco on right limb and put heat to it and begin clamping it in
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 08:58:03 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180442903_zpsumnswrn7.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180442903_zpsumnswrn7.jpg.html)
After it set for a hour I took off the clamps and my heart sank
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:00:21 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180448622_zpsu6jnle5l.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180448622_zpsu6jnle5l.jpg.html)(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180448622_zpsu6jnle5l.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180448622_zpsu6jnle5l.jpg.html)
The heat caused cracks on the back ... I think due to to much moisture in wood
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:03:13 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180437589_HDR_zpssucb4otd.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180437589_HDR_zpssucb4otd.jpg.html)
And my rookie mistake of burning the back .... I'm going to put this in the house and let it dry for a month then try to raw hide back it but I'm also start a new bow out of hhb
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:04:58 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180316546_zps6eosfxby.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180316546_zps6eosfxby.jpg.html)(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180334282_zpstb9ptkcc.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180334282_zpstb9ptkcc.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:05:17 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180334282_zpstb9ptkcc.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160129_180334282_zpstb9ptkcc.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:07:53 am
I'm still upset with myself but know I'll learn from this I still have other options with more stave's to... I think I'll brought out a new Osage stave and put it in the house for a while and work on it as well later
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 30, 2016, 09:11:23 am
Stuckinthemud that wooden mallet thing in your pic is to cool what is it used for and what's the story behind it. I like old stuff like that.

Otter cool looking stave. Man I need a bandsaw I do every thing with nothing but hand tools. Makes it hard on the joints when your hatcheting bark and sap wood off not to mention getting the shape of the bow
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 09:13:18 am
Hey Otter,
      That Osage....could see the pic real clear but is the issue a check running up the middle of the limb?  If so that wont make much difference, I made bows for myself like that, super-glued the crak, clamped and they are still shooting today.....I know ya aint pleased from the bling point of view but with osage, ironwood, hard maple etc it should hurt performance. Assuming the check dont run off of the side.
     Would it be too much of a pain to take a couple more pics. If my old eyes didn't see right please disregard, sir.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:20:54 am
I'm uploading pictures now and no they never tore out to the side what I'm upset the most is where I burnd the back side in one place... It was at a kink area rookie mistake
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 30, 2016, 09:21:51 am
Had the same thing happen with a piece of osage and rich gave me the same advice....it's still together...I did rawhide back it as well.  Good luck man!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:23:38 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160130_090653428_zpsvivrv6r4.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160130_090653428_zpsvivrv6r4.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:24:22 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160130_090715606_zpsnyvdcv4z.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160130_090715606_zpsnyvdcv4z.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:25:04 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160130_090738750_zpswoyfyiid.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160130_090738750_zpswoyfyiid.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:25:37 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160130_090659976_zpsjwvowxnq.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160130_090659976_zpsjwvowxnq.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 30, 2016, 09:26:21 am
Yesterday I cut my splices.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160129_102424543.jpg)
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160129_102441127.jpg)

Then I worked on the fit. Its not perfect but it will do.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160129_110702330.jpg)
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160129_110654560.jpg)

Then I glued it up.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160129_113104917.jpg)
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160129_113026137.jpg)

While waiting on glue to dry I roughed out the osage stave.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160129_140313541.jpg)

While rasping around a whoopty doo a knot remnant decided to tear out.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160129_174845240.jpg)
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160129_174855977.jpg)

I flooded it with super glue and clamped it back in place. I don't have high hopes that it will survive but we will see.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:33:04 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160130_091841945_zps8hu3psoi.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160130_091841945_zps8hu3psoi.jpg.html)

Here's a better picture might have to zoom in
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 10:01:35 am
Otter, never have used dry heat so I sure cant give advice on that "wrap around" scorch mark, but dont really see tham lateral checks as a problem. Hell man, you in the shop with that Turtle guy, I heard from a concordia spy that Turtle makes screamin fast bows 8) 8)

Turtle, dont want to say the obvious but ya do know that Otter's eat Turtles.....right? He gets to lookin hungry keep an eye out >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 10:05:00 am
Lol ... I am hungry come to thinking about it  >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 30, 2016, 10:18:39 am
Otter, no problem on the cracks or the scorch marks. You didn't burn it bad enough to do any damage. As they age it adds character IMO. You can lightly sand a little bit of it out but in time the entire stave is going to darken and blend. I've had both problems in the past and the bows shoot fine. In fact here's one of my favorites.

And your splices are much cleaner than mine. I always have to steam and clamp mine overnight to get them to match up that good.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 10:31:00 am
Otter, no problem on the cracks or the scorch marks. You didn't burn it bad enough to do any damage. As they age it adds character IMO. You can lightly sand a little bit of it out but in time the entire stave is going to darken and blend. I've had both problems in the past and the bows shoot fine. In fact here's one of my favorites.

Its just worring me .... The first bow I ever tempted back in 2011 was Osage and I did the same thing then on one limb... I foor tillered it and  put the string on it and started tillering to get both limbs bending properly, I was flexing bow back and forth to about 24 inched orso and whammy it snaped right at the scorched spot ... It was in the middle like this one... So you dont think I need to raw hide back it? Up for all thoughts and knowledge!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 10:32:51 am
That is a sweet looking take down
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on January 30, 2016, 10:47:11 am
Perhaps you could consider sinew?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 30, 2016, 10:48:42 am
That is a sweet looking take down
No joke on that otter. Hey Fred come on down and teach me a thing or two on those take downs.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 30, 2016, 11:04:34 am
Turtle - looks like that splice fit like a glove.  Nicely done!  Have not used that epoxy before - is it a type you have used before and do get it locally?  The osage stave looks nice to - too bad for the tear out.  You guys are rockin.

Otter - IMO you just never know about scorching the back.  I have seen scorched backed bows that have shot 1000's of arrows, but I have also seen them pop a splinter right at the scorch.  I think the raw hide is a good idea.

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 30, 2016, 11:06:40 am
Turtle that's a sweet splice

I'm pretty darn jealous right now all you guys working on bows and I stuck at work for 2 more weeks without a day off. But keep it up cause it gets me through the day a lot better.

Fred I'm glad this build is going good. Your doing an awesome job with it.

Half Eye and everybody else. I love seeing your work and reading the help comments for everybody's ?'s
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 30, 2016, 11:10:24 am
I got the ERC molle to a good 4" bear last night. Now I've got it reverse braces an extra 1.5" ready go the sinew to go down. I didn't want to go any further than a good brace due to being ERC, I cut brough multiple grain layers. And I'm pretty sure I have what's left of a pitch pocket left on the back along most of the limb. So this one has me a little skittish to pull it without a backing. I'm still trying to figure out what to due about where I have that tensioner block (old string spool). I think I'll leave it and in a couple weeks once the original sinew is dry enough I'll plug in a patch of sinew to fill it in later. I could just build a wood jig that'll hold the limbs up while I pull the handle down but I'm already set up in a simpler fashion. Once she's all glued up I'll set it to the side and start on my other trade bow, the. Get plan B started.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 30, 2016, 11:12:23 am
That wasn't the first take down attempted but it was the first one that succeeded  :laugh:
Here is the first attempt which 12 years after starting I finally finished last year.
<a href="http://s190.photobucket.com/user/Bowferd/media/Fritz/DSC00089_zpsaanw82lr.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z314/Bowferd/Fritz/DSC00089_zpsaanw82lr.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo DSC00089_zpsaanw82lr.jpg"/></a>
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 11:13:36 am
I think Fred has done a awesome job as well... Thank you for all the comments and help... This is what makes this so special and educational for all no matter where your skill level is and helping to achieve what you thought was unachievable... Thanks yeah all, you all rock
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 30, 2016, 11:21:12 am
And this will be #4
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PatM on January 30, 2016, 11:22:25 am
T-88 is great bow building epoxy. Made by System Three.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 11:30:32 am
Those are nice ... Love the snakey one.... I made one take down bow for a lady from Alaska two years ago for hauling on a plane reason she use it in church teachings all over the world ... I made it really light poundage like a little kids bow but it turned out great.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 11:32:18 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20140902_121010_945_zpst17k44op.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20140902_121010_945_zpst17k44op.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 11:33:10 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20140903_190538_757_zpsvihk7gy1.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20140903_190538_757_zpsvihk7gy1.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 11:33:48 am
(http://i1276.photobucket.com/albums/y465/ebennett40/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20140903_190308_232_zpse9tuxpmx.jpg) (http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/ebennett40/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20140903_190308_232_zpse9tuxpmx.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: dylanholderman on January 30, 2016, 12:12:34 pm
I love all of the takedowns being posted, one has been on my list for a while :)

Got a little more work done on my Osage. Used the localized steam bending at the handle to bring the tips in line, went a little past straight we'll see how much of it holds O:)
(http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w411/dylanholderman/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/29A881A0-DC57-4B66-B419-7DFC2C0B98A7.jpg) (http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/dylanholderman/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-01/29A881A0-DC57-4B66-B419-7DFC2C0B98A7.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on January 30, 2016, 01:05:03 pm
Today's goal is to finish working the back down to a single ring and layout the bow.  I found it more difficult to do at night on my workbench, so I waited until I could get some natural light.  Looks like today is a good one for scraping a bow.  Once I get it cleaned up, will post some pictures.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 30, 2016, 01:13:26 pm
Man you guys are whipping them out. Everything I've seen looks promising. I realize a lot of you have busy schedules and the weekend is the only time you can really get to humpin. I'll bet we get to see lots of work the next couple days.

Weekends offer the best opportunity to post them up and ask for advice because so people are on board. Looking forward to seeing some more of your work.
Fred
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on January 30, 2016, 01:33:51 pm
Here are the 3 on am currently working on from top to bottom....Elm, ERC and hickory curve(http://i1221.photobucket.com/albums/dd464/jeffreyakolste/0ac3b971-4ffa-4b11-b840-c0a4dc77d01f_zpswogz1ibs.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 30, 2016, 01:35:51 pm
That elm has some crazy potential hammer.  Is that all natural reflex?!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 01:36:00 pm
Amen to that Fred.....

Damned Hammer you a busy man !!!!

I took some more pics regarding the steam.....had a rough our for a back-bow and it had about 2" of lateral misalignment so took the opportunity to show how I use the little block to fix that. The rough out is ironwood, 1-1/4 wide and 3/4 thick at time of steaming.

I lay the block down and measure it for the right distance up to the pencil marks I used to mark where the bend was.....5 min in the steam and wallah straight.....

Pictures of how it works and a before and after of the stick
rich 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 30, 2016, 01:41:56 pm
Pretty slick rich!  I'll be posting some progress pics pretty quick.  Hopefully have a string on one by the end of next week.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 30, 2016, 01:42:06 pm
Wow!!! I'm building myself a new jig. I've been using two trees out back that are real close together but that's the cat's pajamas  8)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 30, 2016, 01:48:22 pm
That's a pretty slick jig, Half eye!  When I get to working on a stave, I'll have to keep something like that in mind.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on January 30, 2016, 01:55:54 pm
ajooter....yes reaction wood I guess , cut in august...we will see how much is left after the tillering process-Hammertime
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on January 30, 2016, 02:05:34 pm
Stuckinthemud that wooden mallet thing in your pic is to cool what is it used for and what's the story behind it. I like old stuff like that.



The handle belonged to a lignum vitae carvers mallet I bought when I started carving 30 years ago but the head is a replacement I turned from oak a few years back when I wore out the lv head. Carvers mallets can't miss the chisel handle as the round surface will always catch the chisel so you can focus on the cutting edge in a way you just can't with a joiners mallet. Most carvers turn a variety of sizes and weights to suit the energy needed; fine delicate work needs a smaller mallet than roughing out some big lump of oak. Too light is no good for anything as you need to have enough oomph to move the chisel.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: burchett.donald on January 30, 2016, 02:07:31 pm
 Guy's this trade is OFF THE CHAIN ! I have never seen so much dust, shavings, steaming/heating, bending and most of all DETERMINATION...Keep the pictures and pages coming guy's.

                  Fred, you and Rich are doing a fantastic job and are to be commended...This is the kind of trade I like to see, one that promotes, motivates and supports the new guys...This is real PA spirit ;)

                                                                                                             Thanks guys, Don
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 30, 2016, 02:22:53 pm
I got a heavy layer of sinew on, more like 3 layers applied at the same go. and the first cloth wrapped heating. It pulled quite a bit of glue out. I'm going to let it set up then pull the cloth and see how it looks. I'll probably hit it one more time using long rubber bands to get a good compression. Then go from there. It was bending good and even strung up the correct direction, but doesn't seem as even when strung backward.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on January 30, 2016, 03:01:02 pm
I have worked the back on the red bud down to a single ring.  Here are some pictures of the pin knots I found while getting it to a ring, and some tear outs left over from an overly aggressive sapwood removal last year.  I might miss these when I layout the bow, but if not, should I go down one more ring to get under these tear outs?  Do you see any issues with the pin knots?  I was thinking to leave it a little wider around them.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on January 30, 2016, 03:01:42 pm
Here are the tear outs...
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 30, 2016, 03:13:56 pm
Otter, never have used dry heat so I sure cant give advice on that "wrap around" scorch mark, but dont really see tham lateral checks as a problem. Hell man, you in the shop with that Turtle guy, I heard from a concordia spy that Turtle makes screamin fast bows 8) 8)

Turtle, dont want to say the obvious but ya do know that Otter's eat Turtles.....right? He gets to lookin hungry keep an eye out >:D
rich

LOL....I made sure to feed him well the last couple days. Be carefull around that concordia spy. He's a shifty looking character.   ::)


Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 03:20:02 pm
"shifty fella" now thats funny right there
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 30, 2016, 03:26:21 pm
Turtle - looks like that splice fit like a glove.  Nicely done!  Have not used that epoxy before - is it a type you have used before and do get it locally?  The osage stave looks nice to - too bad for the tear out.  You guys are rockin.

Mitch



As PatM said its made by system 3 and ican get it at Woodcrafters for a little under 20 bucks. I used iton the last bow i spliced and it worked well.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 30, 2016, 03:28:00 pm
Loope, how wide is that stave?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 30, 2016, 03:34:57 pm
I like the look of that red bud stave loope!  I don't think those tear outs look too substantial.  You can always back it with rawhide if you want a little insurance.  Im ordering a whole goat raw skin today to cut some rawhide strips.  I would happy to pass them along to anybody who needs them.

This is the second stave I have been working on.  I continued thinning the limbs down and I think I got far enough thru that last knot that was giving me problems so that it is now fully contained in the limb.  I went with a Z shaped handle of sorts utilizing some of the natural features of the stave.  I have to clean up the front profile of the bottom limb a little further but then I should be ready to start getting the limbs to come around in my bench vise.  I find that I usually continue to refine the front profile at least 2-3 times as I reduce the belly to get closer to floor tiller.  I keep tracing a light centerline down the middle of the limb and measure out from each side in this case to 3/4" to get a limb width of 1.5".  This also help me follow the grain and keep everything centered within the limb.  Once I get the limbs bending evenly im going to do a light heat treatment and induce a little reflex into the stave.  I also wanted to try and flip the tips.

Hey rich....how much of recurve have you out into limbs with your steaming method?  I was thinking about trying a static curve.  Both limbs have been scraped down to one ring at the tips and id like to try it.  Do you steam a little longer for a more aggressive bend?

(http://i.imgur.com/8D7jof9.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/l1S2zkg.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/UC6SItp.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/tlEQNqF.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/7Edlhd4.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 30, 2016, 03:39:09 pm
Loope.       Those small tear outs are cosmetic only. Wont hurt it a bit, I usually just smooth them out some with sand paper and then ignore them. Try to keep the knots away from extreme edge if you can and they should be fine also.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 30, 2016, 04:03:01 pm
Loope, reason I asked the width was because of the knot and tear out next to the penny. If it's wide enough I would eliminate that knot in the layout.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 04:04:58 pm
AJ....that baby is lookin sweet right there....using the natural stave like you did in the grip is outstanding sir 8) 8)

My advice on the statics is to steam about 5 min and start your bend.....only bend untill you feel resistance, and stop.....put it back in for 5 and continue for round 2......you may need 3 go's but it should bend real well. Since you wont being letting the stick cool between bend attempts dont be surprised if some comes out inbetween the go's.....no worry.... look at it like "training" the wood to go that far...and  once you get it.... hold it for at least 3 minuets (thats a long time when your holding it) then let loose of it and you should be good to go on the other end.

How thich are your limbs for the first 6"?
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 04:15:32 pm
forgot to say about the static steam thing....when you bend on each "go" stop when the resisitance build but do hold for about a minuet to give the fibers a chance to "stretch some and the inside curve to compress some.......sorry, just realized I lost that bit in the shuffle ::) ::)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 04:34:44 pm
Mr Burchett,
       I didn't even see your post first off.....these guys are animals bud. Everybody is doing great work and a hell of a lot of it too. This old man cant hardly keep up 8) 8) 8)
      You are sure right about the trade, Fred had a vision and damned if he aint pullin it off. I'm real proud to be with this group.....except maybe Otter.....he's lookin at Turtle real funny like >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 30, 2016, 04:45:55 pm
Mr Burchett,,  Likewise and thank you for the compliment.
 I've been pretty damned fortunate to have had Rich sign on and the rest is due too a whole darned good bunch of people that just wanted to build bows, have fun, and help this thing work. And that  is somewhat bloody blind luck more than vision.
 But being the bashful sort that I am I'm blushing with pride.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on January 30, 2016, 04:53:47 pm
The red bud is pretty wide right now, approx 3 inches.  I think I can miss the big knots and maybe the small tearouts.  Thanks turtle for the advice on the tearouts.  However, it looks like the pin knots are going to be in the limb.  Are they small enough to almost ignore?  Treat like a knot and don't cut them, let the grain flow around them?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 30, 2016, 05:00:59 pm
Loope, the pic you just posted. If that knot runs straight down, no problem. If it angles into the belly closer to the center you may have to approach it differently. Can you post the belly shot?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 30, 2016, 05:10:37 pm
Sinew job is all done. I did about how PatM did in the walk through at the top of the page. And I think it turned out well. Except for the grooves from wrapping it's almost perfectly smooth. It'll take no filling and minimal sanding to get it smooth. Both heating sessions took a lot of glue and moisture out of the sinew. I can't wait to see how it looks in a month. I have a few things I'll need to correct with the stave when it's done drying. One lever has about 30 degrees of twist. So I'll popp off the overlay and reglue it on in the same plane as the limbs. And the string lies on the edge of the handle but ill just leave that. Now to finish up a couple I had started then begin another.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on January 30, 2016, 05:17:49 pm
Fred,

It is actually a cluster rather than a single large knot.  It looks like the largest angles in towards the middle, you can see the pin on the belly side.
I still need to try to layout the dimensions and see how much I can avoid.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 30, 2016, 05:27:31 pm
I like the look of that red bud stave loope!  I don't think those tear outs look too substantial.  You can always back it with rawhide if you want a little insurance.  Im ordering a whole goat raw skin today to cut some rawhide strips.  I would happy to pass them along to anybody who needs them.
Ajooter
(http://i.imgur.com/7Edlhd4.jpg?1)

This handle is off the chart. Great job on it
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 30, 2016, 05:29:14 pm
That is violated through at least a couple rings at the knot and it angles toward the center on the belly so it will need to remain in the pattern. You can use multiple methods to save it. My first choice would be to remove 2 more rings on the stave staying completely away from those knots (with the draw knife) and all the other knots too. You don't want anymore tear outs. If it's deep enough which it looks like it is you have plenty of wood to work with, ( but I don't have it in my hands to study the entire stave for other difficulties ).

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 05:38:51 pm
Damned coon-catcher, do you ever sleep man >:D The old guy is gettin wore out just thinkin about that.....maybe I need a nap ::) ::) ::) >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 30, 2016, 05:48:52 pm
I don't even remember what sleep is. And I feel like I'm barely keeping with with some of these guys. I don't know if I've ever seen this much progress this quickly.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 05:51:29 pm
I hear ya.....kinda scared to get off the thread for food (or anything else) come back and 2 pages behind.....aint it great 8)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 05:56:34 pm
Mr Burchett,
       I didn't even see your post first off.....these guys are animals bud. Everybody is doing great work and a hell of a lot of it too. This old man cant hardly keep up 8) 8) 8)
      You are sure right about the trade, Fred had a vision and damned if he aint pullin it off. I'm real proud to be with this group.....except maybe Otter.....he's lookin at Turtle real funny like >:D
rich

Yeah know this her otters from the buckeye state and we like to chew on Michigan's lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 30, 2016, 06:19:31 pm
I've been having a tough time making weight. Can't say what it is to avoid clues, and I've run out of options and am on the verge of too much set. No string follow yet. The bow is otherwise my best performer so far. Fifty arrows through it and the unfinished blank is in the upper 170's w/10 gpp. Starting to finish it tonight, but if eight doesn't pan out after more shooting in, it will be a personal bow for me and on to good old....you guessed it......Plan B!

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBow5.jpg)

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBow4.jpg)

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/TradeBow6.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 06:30:08 pm
Plan B, just curious, but if it's shootin that fast, dont believe a few pounds really matters, especially if ya got the draw length ya want.....just sayin 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 30, 2016, 06:33:57 pm
Hey guys I need some advice. I'm chasing another Osage stave and am a little concerned about this bug damage. It goes close to 1" in diagonally in the center of the limb about 13" from the tip. Is there any hope? Can I fill it with super glue?   I've got some two tone epoxy! 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 30, 2016, 06:48:42 pm
Tim....I would fill them with a thin glue and sawdust mixture...a sloppy paste of sorts.

B....I know you deflex ed the handle on that bow....did you flip the tips as well?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 30, 2016, 06:50:56 pm
I've done a few with bug holes and just shot some super glue in and left that spot a little stiffer.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 30, 2016, 06:51:42 pm
I'll see if I can find pics. I did one similar couple years ago. I made sure they were cleaned out by running a solid copper wire into the opening. I actually had it come out through another hole a couple of inches up the stave. I then filled the void with fine osage sanding dust and tamped and packed in in with the wire.Then saturated with Loctite 420.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 30, 2016, 06:57:22 pm
Here's my sloppy shave horse. It use to actually be one till one day I got alittle mad a purchased this vice and junked the rest. Let's see every body else's
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 30, 2016, 06:58:24 pm
On a side note....and rich and Fred can scold me after....but I think some of us (including myself) may be trucking along a little fast...I just realized I haven't had two bow blanks worked out this fast ever....I'm thinking about letting my blanks sit for a couple days just to weigh them and monitor the weight loss if any.   I cut these a little over a year ago and they have been in the garage.  I have had them inside since the start of the trade.  I hear hickory likes to hang onto moisture.

All that being said I'm thrilled with how the trade is going so far and the level of commitment that is already being displayed by all the participants. 

Thanks again fred and rich for taking part in this!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 07:33:24 pm
aj....you aint the only one havin fun ya know....all of the participants are a real inspiration to me and most everyone else.

Gutshot....here's a pic of my "horse" and vice

Otter, aint scared man....her's why.....I'm too small, too old, and aint got enough meat to make a snack. But here's the kicker nobody wants to eat something thats covered in POO >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 30, 2016, 07:36:54 pm
I had other things that needed done today so no bow work. :(     
Wont have much time for bows until Thursday ( dang job  >:() but then I will have 6 days off. ;D
In the meantime I will keep checking in.


This is the horse/vice Otter and I use.  But alot of times istill prefer one like Rich's.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160129_110654560.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 30, 2016, 08:17:17 pm
Rich I like back rest and all

Turtle, Otter yours to is nice too.

Ok I've got the twist out of this limb but it's kicking my butt. Should I try to straighten at #1 or 2 I'm gonna leave the crook coming out of the fade and the circles are pin knots. I'm using heat to straighten. What cha think. It's half time of the game so I've got 20 minutes lol

And if the pic comes back up of the Osage and tape measure I don't know why it's not my pic
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on January 30, 2016, 08:29:48 pm
Gutshot......... I would probably straighten at #2 just to not stress the pins but thats just me.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 08:32:13 pm

Otter, aint scared man....her's why.....I'm too small, too old, and aint got enough meat to make a snack. But here's the kicker nobody wants to eat something thats covered in POO

Lol yeah your right about the poo ... I hope to get busy again here soon... I might have to buy a new bandsaw blade mine feels sharp but wasn't liking that hhb ... Too fat to use ax lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 08:43:17 pm
Otter.
    I cut a bunch of ironwood....I get my blades from the local "industrial supply" waht works best for me is This: comes right off their tag when they make 'em up....NEO- length- 3/4--3Hook  I also use 1/2" 4 hook. My saw is real old and only 1 hp but I can cut most "half logs" up to about 6" depth.

Just what I use
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:03:42 pm
Half eye,
 I have a old sears craftsmen and it only has a 1/2 horse motor .. 1/2" blade is the widest I can go, best place I found to get mine are at woodcrafter's ... I forget what the length is off the top of my head... Only paid 50 BUCKS for it ... I do have a 3/4 horse motor same rpm and a 1 1/2 horse that's faster horse just need different pully.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:08:01 pm
Faster rpm lol the 1/2 horse will bind up especially if you get the stave in a little twist
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 30, 2016, 09:12:56 pm
Thats the reason for using the "hook tooth and only 4 to the inch) the hook has a wider tooth set and the teeth will really help clear the kerf....it will actually be easier on your 1/2 horse. The blade stock they use is Lennox.....they do measure in feet and inches though and since I blocked mine the blades are 7 feet-9-1/2 inches They are big.....but they cost 16 dollars.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on January 30, 2016, 09:23:33 pm
I'll try and see if I can find some of those blades thanks for the info half eye
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 30, 2016, 09:32:19 pm
Ok here's my progress for the day. I actually got a lot done. It's to floor tiller and ready for the next stage. It's at 1 1/4" at the fades and 70" long. It's turning out nice. I'm going to to fill the hole with yeller wood and super glue and round the belly some and hope it holds. The last is the sister stave. I've got another 73" Osage stave to split and chase a ring on  but I'll do that Monday I'm going to church tomorrow so I probably won't get any bow work done.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 30, 2016, 09:41:22 pm
I use tb3 or tb2 with sawdust.. I think superglue might set up kind of fast and not mix well.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on January 30, 2016, 09:44:39 pm
I use tb3 or tb2 with sawdust.. I think superglue might set up kind of fast and not mix well.

That's a good idea thanks I'll give that a try. I've got more tb3 anyway!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 30, 2016, 10:03:23 pm
If you use slow set epoxy or wood glue you mix and then patch. If you use sg then you pack the hole with dry sawdust and then saturate with sg.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on January 31, 2016, 01:04:00 am
Well, I made some progress tonight, too!

Here's a glamour shot of some osage shavings from getting the side profile to size.

(http://i.imgur.com/hcttykX.jpg?1)

I managed to get the limbs roughed out on the sides tonight.  I won't be able to do much tomorrow, but Monday (Sundays and Mondays are my weekend) I will hopefully get the belly roughed out.

(http://i.imgur.com/Mx30VlQ.jpg)

I also ordered some Smooth On, so as soon as that gets here, the real fun begins!  >:D

Also, as a side note, occasionally for my job, I will have to fill in cracks, chips, and holes in wooden clarinets.  Mixing CA glue with dust from the original wood does a fine job of making a patch.  I will alternate putting sawdust in the hole with putting some CA glue on the dust, then pack it in, until there is a slight mound.  You can then sand the patch down.  By the time you stain and finish it, it's damn hard to tell there was anything wrong with the wood.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on January 31, 2016, 10:05:37 am
Got my stave split in 2, now I got a stave and a backup!  I will have some followup questions regarding the rings on this stave, but for now, I wanted to show progress.

First 3 pics show my centerline tool and the actual line.
(http://i.imgur.com/FBB4Uni.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/Rtik7sv.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/OOvdwZw.jpg)

Here is my kerfing and splitting tool selection, and the kerf.
(http://i.imgur.com/3lnAJ7h.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/dyhgIIn.jpg)

Lets get to splitting!

(http://i.imgur.com/iG10IXy.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/RokDkDf.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/sLcJM44.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 31, 2016, 10:15:18 am
TY and Sidmand.....Man you fellas get after it dont ya....Some fine and picky work right there gentlemen 8) 8) 8)
rich
Title: Bandsaws
Post by: PlanB on January 31, 2016, 10:32:22 am
I have an old Duplicarver 3 wheel bandsaw w/ a 24" wide throat. The wheels are small however, so it eats blades. I now buy 100' rolls of bandsaw blade and make up my own by silver soldering them. It's not hard, and takes less then 5 minutes per blade. I use a skip tooth blade like Rich's.

Some bandsaw tips for those who don't already know them.....

When re-sawing very thick cuts, you can make up a tall L-shaped wooden fence that you just C-clamp to the table. This will support the face of your board rather than the table supporting the edge, and give you much more consistent thickness.

Also, instead of trying to get your wooden fence square across the table, set it at whatever angle the blade wants to cut a straight line on a test piece. Then clamp it down. If you're lucky and everything in your guides is adjusted perfect, and it's a new blade the test cut MIGHT be square to the table, but generally it isn't. So don't try to fight it -- set the fence parallel with the way the blade wants to cut.

When cutting curved lines on bow blanks (the usual situation) without a fence, as for instance doing the belly cut, don't run the bow flat to the table. Angle the blank a little toward the back (but cut just outside your line). Do this from both sides. This will cut a beveled belly with the high point in the center -- a little thicker than at the edge of the bow.

This ridge is easier to plane off than a flat back with extra thickness would have been, and yet still gives you extra meat in case the blade bows or your table and blade were off square..... or other errors happen. And they do on a bandsaw when ripping irregular grain.

Finally, don't think you have to cut the sides of the bow with a bandsaw, just because it tapers or even has a gradual curve. I often use the tablesaw for this freehand on 1" or thinner stock -- ie a board bow, or bendy handle bow. I set the blade height just over the thickness of the material (important to minimize binding). You have to go slow, stop and switch off if there is any binding, and don't cut out the handle and fade dips, leave those for a bandsaw or other method.

Obviously freehanding is more risky than straight guided cuts with a tablesaw, and should be done only if you are experienced at it. But if you are comfortable freehanding on a tablesaw, you'll get a smoother cleaner faster cut for a bow blank than on a bandsaw. I now cut bow blanks that way, clean up the handle and fades on the band saw, and then band saw the thickness taper, per above.

Of course a hatchet and heavy rasp works great, too for all of the above, but if you have the machinery and want to use it, maybe some of the above will be helpful.  :)




Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on January 31, 2016, 10:42:06 am
Everybody's looking good, I'm feeling like I'm falling behind. Here's what I have going on. from left to right, 2 ironwood staves I got from Rich last summer. Two are roughed out and one I bent some flip into the tips. The other staves are, one ash, and one shorty hickory stave. I also have another shorty hickory stave I have bending. I put some copperhead skins on the tips, and in the pic, glueing on some birchbark backing. This is the one I mentioned way early that has a silk backing. I didn't like the color of the silk after glueing, so now applying bark and skins. It ended up too short, had to pike it a little. I'll probably only get 22 or 23" draw out of it. I guess I'll have to keep that one for myself...oh darn. ;)

Tattoo Dave   
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 31, 2016, 10:47:07 am
Nice job Sid!  Dave I do t think your anywhere near behind....nice looking set of staves!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 31, 2016, 11:17:41 am
Plan B, real good advice right there. I too freehand all my cuts on both saws (my bad >:D) and I agree with you about using extreme caution while doing so at the beginning......but once ya have it it's a wonderful  time saver.

Dave you looking good bud.....well, rather your work is ::) aint no hope for you man

rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 31, 2016, 11:21:12 am
Nobody's falling behind that I can see here! Some of us have more time to whittle, being old, mentally stuck in an earlier time, and self-unemployed except for small jobs when they come up. I admire everyone's work here and am amazed at the progress all around. We're doing this because we like to, not because we hve a quota to fulfill or a boss telling us to produce. So it can go as fast or as considerate and measured as it needs to be for each individual.

Me, I'm an impatient cuss, and stubbornly independent, so I'm sure to go too fast, ignore advice, and make twice the mistakes. But that's what I like! :laugh: Makes life full.

I'm finishing up the bow now, don't know what it will finally pull after shooting in -- good chance it will miss min. weight by a little, maybe, maybe not. It will be awhile before I can shoot it again, as finish takes time, so I'm starting on a Plan B bow. We've got til August after all. And I said at the start of this I promised to do the best bow I can make. We'll see if I learned anything on the next one, and may the best bow win for my particular victim....

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBow7.jpg)

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 31, 2016, 11:27:58 am
We sound much alike B!!  Especially with this bow I feel like I'm thinking so far ahead at things I want to do I know I'm getting ahead of myself at times.

"Me, I'm an impatient cuss, and stubbornly independent, so I'm sure to go too fast, ignore advice, and make twice the mistakes. But that's what I like! :laugh: Makes life full."

I don't think anybody has ever said truer words about me without even trying lol.

I have some questions about birch bark backing Dave.  Do you soak the bark before application?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 31, 2016, 01:46:19 pm
I know I have posted progress pictures of how I do my nocks but I thought I would go into a little more detail.  I start by marking a reference line down both sides of the belly from the tips to midlimb.  Next I use that line as a reference as to how I taper/round the tips.  I usually go all the way to the taper line for the first 6" and then taper it out to midlimb.    I clean everything up with a finer rasp and scraper when that is all done.  Next I make a reference mark 1" down on each side of the limb as well as marking a centerline down the belly of the limb a few inches from the tip.  I draw my nock reference to intersect this centerline at the same spot.  Next I use a nickolson 49 rasp the score the line I marked and follow that up with a chain saw file.  I mark my outline for the front and side profile of the nock and shape them with a nickolson 49.  Everything gets cleaned up with a finer rasp and sandpaper.  I threw a picture of the top nock as well.

I also did some further work to the handle.  I really like way the handle is shaping out.

(http://i.imgur.com/FICGW6v.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/Uz8HPhQ.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/AwVnGRT.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/VlB5gJb.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/YmWkvjj.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/WrnC4Pc.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/h5mwH4F.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/BSm6bSu.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/b2hG5pA.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/nFT46FC.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/lNm8TMr.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/WGE7GFs.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on January 31, 2016, 02:39:44 pm
ajooter, I figure a lot of us fits that description  :) your bow looks great!

Sidmand, I really like how you split that. Your center marking gage is really similar to the 8-side gage used for marking the bevel lines on tapered spars in boatbuilding. They use two pencils.

Otter and Turtle, great to see you guys going to town on that wood, and a wonderful spacious shop you have!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 31, 2016, 02:50:53 pm
Ajooter, I'm a liking that handle more and more. It's very interesting. I look at it one way it has a natural rest for a RH shooter then I look at it another way and that natural RH rest becomes a good place for a LH to rest there thumb. Just a interesting peice. Keep up the good work!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: cabinetbowguy on January 31, 2016, 06:36:19 pm
Got it floor tillered and now waiting for the tip overlays to dry   :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 31, 2016, 06:41:06 pm
What ya got there for bow wood cb guy?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on January 31, 2016, 06:44:29 pm
You'll have to bring her over for me to take a peek at once you get te tipsshaped out. I'm sure you'll have them shaped before I get off work.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: cabinetbowguy on January 31, 2016, 06:45:45 pm
Hickory back, osage belly, cherry core  walnut and maple tips and handel
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on January 31, 2016, 07:46:52 pm
Can't wait to see that one finished out. Wow, CBG, you learn quick.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 31, 2016, 08:04:39 pm
That sounds fantastic.....I hope you got my address right Fred!  8)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on January 31, 2016, 08:17:44 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/OMPXQtb.jpg?1)

Gonna steam the handle tonight and try to get everything lined up.  I hope that knot at the handle plays nice during the operation.  I'm pushing away from the knot to the right to get my alignment so I think I should be ok.

I do have a "plan b" if things don't go as planned ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 31, 2016, 08:34:51 pm
CBG, That is gonna be sweet. Cant wait to see her bending

Ajooter, It'll go great sir....way to nice lookin to have any issues....Ya sure dont need much movement. All you guys just amaze me.... 8) 8) 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 31, 2016, 08:54:33 pm
Dang CBG that trilamb is nice I bet it will be a arrow smoker!!!

My BL has came to a stand still I just can't get that crooked limb where it needs to be. ITS NOT CORROPERATING!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on January 31, 2016, 09:12:51 pm
Gutshot, there is a little something on the way as of Monday should arrive mid week ;)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on January 31, 2016, 09:41:34 pm
H.E.  Cool I've put 3hrs into straightening this kind and still 1" away. It's been a bugger of a job. I want give up on it. There's a good bow in there some where. Plus PLAN B is on its way
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on January 31, 2016, 10:40:14 pm
Gutshot, I know how you feel. I've been working all day on my stick trying to bend it but no luck really. This is my last try for the night:
(http://i.imgur.com/JnsGonJ.jpg)
My plan B that I worked on a bit today trying to straighten it gave me some bad news. I cut it with no leaves on and thought it was Ash but after some extensive research tonight I've figured out it's gotta be Box elder, which sucks :(
Better luck tomorrow.
(http://i.imgur.com/qutYOt1.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on January 31, 2016, 11:27:52 pm
I spent the afternoon taking the red bud down some more, chased down two more rings and it looks much better I think.  Here is the knot cluster after taking off two more rings.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on January 31, 2016, 11:55:58 pm
Loope - the back of the redbud looks good.  Did you figure out if you can avoid the knot on the edge of the stave when you layout your bow?  I would try and avoid if I could - knots on the edge of the limb without plenty of wood flowing around them on the outside of the knot are problematic at best.

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 01, 2016, 06:27:49 am
I'm a liking that red bud too.... 

Ive been trying to get this limb straight without cuting it down to my deminsions. Since I got it so close should I go ahead and trim it down to go the extra now. Or try another heat session this evening with it like it is. The complete width of the stave?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 01, 2016, 07:05:56 am
Gutshot,
      If your close but it's still being stubborn, I believe if you get close to final you have a better chance of moving it. I aint seen your stave or had it in hand, just seems the less wood ya got to move the easier it would be to move it.....Hows that for "no help at all" >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 01, 2016, 07:35:34 am
That's why I was thinking too just wanted a 2nd opinion. So tonight the wood chips will be flying and it will go back to the jig with a little heat to persuade it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 01, 2016, 07:42:18 am
I've always had better luck bending after its pretty much floor tillered.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 01, 2016, 07:42:32 am
At the moment I am thinking of a take-down lever arm bow for my guy.  I'm using a 4" wide, high crowned sapling which I have cut down to 2" wide at the fades, 65" ntn, any ideas how thick the limbs should be for a 50lb draw? Also, I have always gone hollow limb with hazel as I think it helps avoid crysals but is this a good approach for a lever-arm bow (don't wanna call it molle or holmegaard cos it won't be a replica)?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 01, 2016, 08:04:28 am
Mud...weylin just built that had yew molly...so I'm sure it would work.

Rich....I almost got her in line last night went well past straight.  Should be able to get the rest with the tip thinning.  I have another bow to practice flipping tips on.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 01, 2016, 08:15:34 am
(http://i.imgur.com/csrZtUH.jpg?1)

This was prior to bending....I'll post the other tonight.  I want to get the limbs to come around a little then I'm gonna heat treat and hopefully flip the tips a little.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 01, 2016, 10:24:04 am
Who posted they ordered goat rawhide? I can't find it or just overlooking it
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 01, 2016, 10:26:17 am
Ordered it yesterday gut.  I get it from Moscow fur and hide.  I cut it in 2" strips.  If you need it wider let me know...just pm me your address.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 01, 2016, 11:32:54 am
Mud...weylin just built that had yew molly...so I'm sure it would work.


don't suppose you know the link?  Can't find it :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: pincushin on February 01, 2016, 12:22:06 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/csrZtUH.jpg?1)

This was prior to bending....I'll post the other tonight.  I want to get the limbs to come around a little then I'm gonna heat treat and hopefully flip the tips a little.
Thats Looking Sweet
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 01, 2016, 01:55:10 pm
http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php?topic=55261.0

Here's that link mud
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 01, 2016, 03:49:13 pm
Well, finally got the little wife to take a few pics of me.

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Drew-3_zpskxlgtcaj.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Drew-3_zpskxlgtcaj.jpg.html)

I got some work done on my stave Friday and have had it in my hot box since.  It needs to dry a few more day since it's loosing weight.  It was harvested last March but is not as dry as I thought.  I need to get a crook out of the handle area and will post a few more pics soon. 

It's great to see everyone making progress.  Keep it roll'in guys.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 01, 2016, 03:59:42 pm
I finished the first layer of sinew on the black walnut. I'm working on layer #2 and will post a pic tonight.
Drewster, good mug shot. I had the impression you were younger. You've got me beat by a year.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Urufu_Shinjiro on February 01, 2016, 04:06:02 pm
Holy Smoke, leave the site for a weekend and this thread doubles in size, lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 01, 2016, 04:49:54 pm
I finished the first layer of sinew on the black walnut. I'm working on layer #2 and will post a pic tonight.
Drewster, good mug shot. I had the impression you were younger. You've got me beat by a year.

Hey Fred, I'm no "spring chicken" but I've sure had fun learning to build wooden bows......kinda addictive :-)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 01, 2016, 06:01:38 pm
OK, got all the wood out, halfway caught up, so now I get to join in the fun.....
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 01, 2016, 06:58:15 pm
Got a little bit more done today. I may have to back this one with deer rawhide. But I'm getting the twist out and putting reflex in it.  Hopefully going to get back at it tonight when the wife comes back from the churches lady's meeting.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 01, 2016, 07:12:40 pm
NICE....
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 01, 2016, 08:06:12 pm
It's looking real good TimothyR
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 01, 2016, 08:42:30 pm
Looking good Tim!  I'm hoping to be doing the same soon.  I think I got the alignment pretty well licked.  There's a little twist near the lower nock but nothing that I think will need fixing.
(http://i.imgur.com/gzbxwtS.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 01, 2016, 08:59:33 pm
Looking good Tim!  I'm hoping to be doing the same soon.  I think I got the alignment pretty well licked.  There's a little twist near the lower nock but nothing that I think will need fixing.

I agree - I think you got it.  Looking nice.

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 01, 2016, 09:00:29 pm
Let's get things straight.......here's the problem.

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Trade%20Bow%202016-1_zpsxiwazdsp.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Trade%20Bow%202016-1_zpsxiwazdsp.jpg.html)


I tried to lay out the bow so the crook would be at the smallest part of the handle.

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Trade%20Bow%202016-2_zpskpm0g4ex.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Trade%20Bow%202016-2_zpskpm0g4ex.jpg.html)


Time for a steam bath.

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Trade%20Bow%202016-3_zpsaerhoyby.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Trade%20Bow%202016-3_zpsaerhoyby.jpg.html)


I wrap aluminum foil around my pot so the heat coming up around the pot doesn't scorch the wood.  I'll use different sized pots depending on the area I need to steam.  I steamed this 10 minutes......per Rich, since the handle was a bit over 1" think where it needed to bend.

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Trade%20Bow%202016-4_zpsc6welz8d.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Trade%20Bow%202016-4_zpsc6welz8d.jpg.html)


Clamps and form are ready and waiting.

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Trade%20Bow%202016-5_zpswkoscsje.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Trade%20Bow%202016-5_zpswkoscsje.jpg.html)


Captured!

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Trade%20Bow%202016-6_zpsgcj4dijk.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Trade%20Bow%202016-6_zpsgcj4dijk.jpg.html)


Bent a bit past straight.

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Trade%20Bow%202016-7_zpszl7jwblx.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Trade%20Bow%202016-7_zpszl7jwblx.jpg.html)


The big picture.  We'll see how well we did in the morning.

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Trade%20Bow%202016-8_zpshwrwchiu.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Trade%20Bow%202016-8_zpshwrwchiu.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 01, 2016, 09:31:17 pm
Thanks y'all.  Man everything is lookin great!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 01, 2016, 09:49:58 pm
Timothy, ajooter Drewster, and all, lookin great!  :)
Rich good to hear you got wood ready!

I had a pleasant surprise today when a new digital bow scale arrived in the mailbox -- my old spring loaded one was reading low by 4 pounds. I checked it with the new scale and known weights. Never doubted it before, but it turns out every bow I've made so far (including the trade bow) is 4 pounds heavier draw than I thought. That means my trade bow might be on my guy's target after all. I can't tell yet because I'm still working on finish and won't be able to string it again and shoot it in  'til done with that. I  probably will still build another bow, just in case -- but I'm also psyched about this one!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mullet on February 01, 2016, 10:20:12 pm
Timothy, reduce the stave down some more and it will bend easier. Those limbs are pretty thick.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 01, 2016, 10:21:29 pm
I have gotten some work done over the weekend.  I backed the bow with whitetail rawhide. 

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/D195D052-D1CC-45CC-9C6A-70176DED914A_zpsnhsvxs5q.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/D195D052-D1CC-45CC-9C6A-70176DED914A_zpsnhsvxs5q.jpg.html)

I also cut nocks in the black walnut overlays.

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/1D678A31-5E8C-4110-AAB5-F737424ACA76_zpsfxjgq35q.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/1D678A31-5E8C-4110-AAB5-F737424ACA76_zpsfxjgq35q.jpg.html)

I started taking wood off the belly and got it to a low brace.  I tried a long string but quit that because one limb has reflex and the other doesn't. Now that I have it at low brace I can see where I need to take wood away.  I definitely need to even the limbs up.

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/94E1DD13-5669-4264-BED0-9100772AEEFB_zpsqkz6kur3.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/94E1DD13-5669-4264-BED0-9100772AEEFB_zpsqkz6kur3.jpg.html)


Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 01, 2016, 10:50:24 pm
Cb guy that's looking good..even in the miniature view :D

Swampman....rawhide looks good and low brace isn't bad at all!

Thinned down one tip after getting my alignment.  Had an unexpected visitor in our bed upstairs so I had to relocate him bacj to his own bed and abandon  the other tip till tomorrow.(http://i.imgur.com/4WQV2gK.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jeffp51 on February 01, 2016, 11:01:44 pm
I received a nice stave in the mail today. I now have a couple to work with, so I am hopeful that I should be able to put something nice together for the trade. I have to finish Mr sons' Christmas bows before I can really start on the trade but I am thinking really hard about how to do this right.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: cabinetbowguy on February 01, 2016, 11:18:49 pm
Well got the trilam bending :) tiller still needs some work but its comming along, and man its snappy
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 02, 2016, 04:34:14 am
http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php?topic=55261.0

Here's that link mud

Oh my giddy godfathers that has got to be my new favourite bow, absolutely stunning!  Thanks for the link ajooter, think I need to give up right now cos mine ain't gonna get anywhere near that one!!!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 02, 2016, 06:10:32 am
Drewster, man I would like to build a bow in your work shop ( nice, clean, and organized) mine dirty and unorganized! Keep up the good work.

Swamp man, rawhide and tip overlays looks good. You'll do fine fixing that tiller at low brace. That to me is the easiest time to fix it.

ajooter, like those thin tips. Looking good

CBG, your a flying through this build. Keep it up and you will beat us all done
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Otter on February 02, 2016, 08:57:28 am
Wow you all are rocking... I've seen so many bows that are all mouth drooling.... I can't wait to get back at it but I'm letting my stave's dry for a week more inside .... I do have another Osage stave that I cut down in 2012 that I'm thinking about chasing a ring, can't have to many back ups with this bunch  :o
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 02, 2016, 09:17:49 am
Bows are looking nice!

Drewster - curious to see how the steam worked on your handle area - hope you post some pics of the results.  You bow is coming along nicely.

That rawhide turned out nice Swampman.  The walnut looks good too.  Looks like you have some dogwood shafts laying there on the bench behind your bow?

Those narrow tips look awesome ajooter - I love the looks of narrow tips!

CBG - I would say that the bends are looking nice on your trilam.  Did you taper the core before glue up?

We have a blizzard going on here today - maybe will be able to get out to the shop and do some work on my bows!

Mitch

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 02, 2016, 10:57:40 am
Well it's in the 50's for the next couple days with rain all day tomorrow. Goodbye to the bay ice :'(.

On the bright side I'll be able to catch up to you over achievers. You guys all did your weekend homework on Friday night didn't you?

As promised here's a fishy pic.
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/100_2786_zpsa3z21h2f.jpg)
 Caught 12 Thurs. night (by myself), 40 on Friday(with a buddy and my daughter), and 1 lousy fish (by my daughter on Saturday). I think they'd moved to deeper water because it was clear and sunny that day. Got them all filleted and in the deep freeze yesterday. After I take a look at my wife's squeaky brakes, I'm back to making shavings. I'll get a progress pic up after I make a little more of it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 02, 2016, 11:13:52 am
OK, I admit it, I need help.

First the handle was slightly kinked, with the tips not lining up by a half inch, so  I (dry) heated the (hazel) stave into alignment  - slight overbend that cooled into a dead straight stave.  Two days later I may as well have not bothered and the stave is back in its old shape. I think I'll try steaming it becase hazel usually reacts really well to heat. The grain seems to run up the stave on one side and down the stave on the other, could this be causing me the alignment problems? 

Mostly I need help with the dimensions: currently the stave is 65" ttt with a 70:30 ratio (working arm length to lever length) - is this ok or is the bow too long , and are the levers too short? Oh, how wide should the levers end up - they are an inch wide at the moment to give me some wriggle room.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 02, 2016, 12:22:34 pm
Those look good kid...I miss that poor man's shrimp.

I'm sure we can collectively get you straightened out mud....well the bow anyway  ;) post some pictures of your layout and the grain orientation you mentioned.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 02, 2016, 12:27:55 pm
I assume you are making a mollie. I think a half inch might be too thick on the levers, but thats one of the few things on a mollie you can adjust later if need be. . My first mollie had 1/2" wide levers and a fair amount of hand shock to go with it. I took them down to just under 3/8" and it really helped and made the side profile narrower. They did have a slight taper narrowing to the tips(maybe another 1/16"). My levers were still pretty wide from the side though, compared to others I've seen. I liked how they looked though.  I also think you could make the levers longer if you wanted or the bow shorter. I've done them with both long and short levers. The speed seems to increase with the lever length/working limb ratio, but so does the stress on the limbs and stacking of the draw weight. I tried pushing my last one. It was HHB, 56" ttt, with 9" levers and I went for a 65-70 draw @28". That one took some set, well... a lot of set,  the most of any bow I made that survived. It also developed a slight hinge, it's in the rework/boredom pile at the moment. I wish I wouldn't have tried for too much, it had potential. Should have went with more working limb and 4" longer overall, and possibly some perry reflex.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 02, 2016, 12:33:15 pm
Looks like I may have the string alignment worked out.  Hopefully it will hold. Going to set it aside till Monday and start working on another stave. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 02, 2016, 12:40:58 pm
Nice haul Dakota! I've wanted to try perch skin glue. It was supposed to be the glue of choice in cold weather Finnish type bows. Must have been fun catching them!

Swampman, ajooter, looking great!

Glad that worked out Timothy!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 02, 2016, 12:48:55 pm
Was the perch glue made from the air bladder? I tried to locate them when cleaning but couldn't. Plus, these were caught in shallow water <20', so the bladders were empty. It's easy to locate when they're caught in deep water. It's hard to miss it when it's sticking out the mouth. It's like the bends for a fish. That's one of the reasons there's no summer size limit up here. Rarely do they survive being brought up fast from deep water. It's better to have some small ones in the bucket than to throw them to the gulls and catch more, from a conservation stand point anyway.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 02, 2016, 01:09:19 pm
Was the perch glue made from the air bladder? I tried to locate them when cleaning but couldn't. Plus, these were caught in shallow water <20', so the bladders were empty. It's easy to locate when they're caught in deep water. It's hard to miss it when it's sticking out the mouth. It's like the bends for a fish. That's one of the reasons there's no summer size limit up here. Rarely do they survive being brought up fast from deep water. It's better to have some small ones in the bucket than to throw them to the gulls and catch more, from a conservation stand point anyway.

Dakota from what I read it was perch skin, not the bladder. I have heard of isninglass made from fish bladders, used in clarifying beer when brewing. I'll try to find the references for the skin glue....
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 02, 2016, 01:13:52 pm
I actually looked it up while waiting to hear back from you. I went out to the trash and retrieved the skins. If you want them PM me your address. Dried first of course. Don't want to upset the mailman with rotten fish smell.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: cabinetbowguy on February 02, 2016, 01:22:34 pm
Mwosborn.. yep tapered the cherry before glue up
Jason
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 02, 2016, 01:28:19 pm
Dakota Kid, gotta love those perch. We had a spot out on the canal that flowed from Lake McConaughy to Lake Maloney that we fished as kids. The perch at that time we're abundant and man what great times we had. Nice catch.

TimothyR, I'm having a similar problem on my sinew backed black walnut. Rather than fighting anymore I'm going to eliminate the problem by using a side nock on the top limb. String alignment lines up  perfectly that way.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 02, 2016, 01:28:46 pm
Thanks Jason -

A trilam will be new for me.  Need all the help I can get.  I am going to try to rig up some kind of jig for my sander that will allow me to taper.  Wish I have a drum sander.  :(
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 02, 2016, 01:36:04 pm
I actually looked it up while waiting to hear back from you. I went out to the trash and retrieved the skins. If you want them PM me your address. Dried first of course. Don't want to upset the mailman with rotten fish smell.

Wow! Not to mention the missus! But she's used to some pretty crazy projects after all these years. PMing you. This should be interesting!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 02, 2016, 01:49:00 pm
Thanks Jason -

A trilam will be new for me.  Need all the help I can get.  I am going to try to rig up some kind of jig for my sander that will allow me to taper.  Wish I have a drum sander.  :(

You can buy a sanding drum drill attachment on line for about 10 dollars
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 02, 2016, 01:56:10 pm
Found the reference, Dakota:

"Rausing also emphasised the importance of glue boiling, which requires
ceramic vessels, as being a necessary precondition for the development of the
horn bow (Rausing 1967: 148). The method for making glue from the skin of
perch (Perca fluviatilis) used by the Saami, and presumably by other Finno
Ugrian tribes, however, does not require the use of vessels for boiling, since the
skins only need to be steamed to obtain a high- quality glue, suitable for bow
making."
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 02, 2016, 01:57:23 pm
Stuck - I have a couple of sanders.  I was talking about a drum sander that would allow me to sand lamination down to a very specific thickness or taper a lamination from one end to the other.  Thanks!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 02, 2016, 02:04:57 pm
With the blizzard going on and no work today I was able to get a few hours of work in on "plan A" - hackberry self bow.  I worked it down to bow dimensions and ready to start bending the limbs to floor tiller.

Here are a couple of pics from each end with the alignment string on.  The string goes through the handle fairly well from what I can tell.  There is a slight prop twist on one end and a little bend in the other, but I don't think it is worth trying to straighten with the way the tips are lining up through the handle as is.  What you think?

Also a couple of pics of the side profile - 1 from each side.  Has just a bit of natural reflex.
Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 02, 2016, 02:06:21 pm
Hey Kid, looks like you're in for some tasty eating.....nice catch.

Mitch, here's a pic of the stave since I removed the clamps while ago.  Looks like I'm good to go :-)  There are a couple of layout lines that I'll need to adjust......cause it's hard to lay out a bow on a bent stave. 

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Trade%20Bow%202016%20Straightened_zpsly3ptbhb.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Trade%20Bow%202016%20Straightened_zpsly3ptbhb.jpg.html)


I like Rich's short steam times.  I'll continue to do that.  Even steaming the handle for only ten minutes, there was some discoloration to the water.  It always makes me wonder if there is damage being done to the wood when the steam if causing leeching.  At least this was at the handle and should cause no problems.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 02, 2016, 02:07:26 pm
Here is what it looks like outside.  That "white hump" is one of my 3D targets getting buried by snow!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 02, 2016, 02:08:31 pm
Nice shop Mitch......all that natural light is fantastic!!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 02, 2016, 02:10:13 pm
Thanks Jason -

A trilam will be new for me.  Need all the help I can get.  I am going to try to rig up some kind of jig for my sander that will allow me to taper.  Wish I have a drum sander.  :(

I purchased a spindal sander at harbor freight. The mounted 2 inch aluminum angle iron on one end then I swing it toward the spindle set my depth and hold the other side with a c clamp. That's my poor mans drum sander. I am send a pick of it to you if you want to see it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 02, 2016, 02:14:11 pm
Hey gutshot - that would be great.  That is what I was thinking of doing also.  I already bought the aluminum angle iron - seeing how you did it would help.

Drewster - looks like it lined up rather well!

Hey Kid - if you are giving away perch parts....I don't need any skins...but those fillets sounds yummy!!  You could ship them on dry ice and they would get here just fine!! >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 02, 2016, 02:51:22 pm
Mitch , that Hackberry looks almost identical to one i'm workin on. what are your dimensions? I dry heated the prop twist out of the one limb and found a check crack on the one tip. the crack goes all the way thru from back to belly. will post a pic when i get home. ran some gorilla super glue in it and clamped it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 02, 2016, 03:36:10 pm
Stix - if you got glue down into the crack and clamped it, I bet it will be fine.  Currently mine is 66" ntn and right at 2" at the fades.  Parallel out to 12" then tapered to 1/2" at the tips.  By the time it takes shape, it will be a bit narrower at the fades and I will narrow the tips as much as I can.  From the hackerry bows I have made in the past, wider is better - much less set.  But then again, maybe my tillering just sucks!  ;D

What about you for dimensions?

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 02, 2016, 03:42:04 pm
Mitch, the dimenssions are 64" ttt 1 5/8 to mid limb(14") taper to 1/2" tips. This is my first go at hackberry
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 02, 2016, 03:43:56 pm
looks like some beautiful bows shaping up here. ;D

Mitch, that is a nice shop. I have to work outdoors to get that good of lighting and as you know there's no outdoor work being done today.

I did get 2 layers of sinew on the bl. Thought I had it close in tiller with the long string but after the sinew began to dry it is showing a lot more reflex in what was to be the top limb. I'll have to wait quite awhile to check that out and may need to retiller or switch top to bottom.

CBG your trilam looks like it could be a real shooter.

This thread is so huge I'm having a hard time keeping up.
if anyone has questions that haven't been answered already, shoot me a PM and I'll try to give or find you the answers.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 02, 2016, 04:01:05 pm
Man you all are flat getin after it .......I have to agree with Fred if I missed any ? please let me know as well.

In case any of you missed it, this is how these trades was meant to be, and all of ya make me really proud to just be a part of this.....what a damned fine bunch of people 8) 8) 8)

Plan B, Here in the Great Lakes the NA used fish skin glue....also perch (and/or Pike) but they included the perch roe. You might want to look into that as well......some of their petyrogliphs are still bright red on the rock faces of cliffs exposed to Lake Superior for hundreds of years.

Glad that worked for you Drewster

Back to belly cracks in or near the tips that are glued and clamped have never caused me any further issues.....just dont try to heat or steam bends into after the glue....wont hurt but you will get to do it a second time.....ya dont know how I found that out either >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 02, 2016, 04:09:06 pm

Glad that worked for you Drewster


Rich, prior to your post about steaming, I would have probably steamed the handle for 45 minutes......obviously NO NEED TO.  Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us.  The narrow section in the handle is a good inch wide and 2" thick.   Would you have steamed it less time?   Drew
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 02, 2016, 04:14:13 pm
Those look good kid...I miss that poor man's shrimp.

I'm sure we can collectively get you straightened out mud....well the bow anyway  ;) post some pictures of your layout and the grain orientation you mentioned.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 02, 2016, 04:15:21 pm
Rich, people around the world seem to think alike -- re. perch glue. This should be interesting! Hmmmm what about fresh sturgeon roe?  :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Re. short time handle steaming, reaally looking forward to trying that.

CabinetBowguy, Drewster mwosborn, bows look great guys!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 02, 2016, 04:28:18 pm
Drew,
     Depends how it "felt to you" when you did the bend. If went right to shape like a wet noodle then next time I would try 8min. I do my bends by hand just for that reason. I really try to steam for only as long as necessary and no more......likewise if you steam for a period of time and as you make the bend and feel some significant resistance ....then stop and pop it in for a couple min. more. I look for it to "yield" not real super easy or halfway hard. Guess thats about the beast I can describe it.

AJ, you got that right

PlanB, you got too much free time brother >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 02, 2016, 04:30:48 pm
Stuck - I have a couple of sanders.  I was talking about a drum sander that would allow me to sand lamination down to a very specific thickness or taper a lamination from one end to the other.  Thanks!
Have seen home-made jigs that allow a drum sanding attachment in a drill to run as a thicknesses, will try and find plans if ur interested?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 02, 2016, 04:47:35 pm
Thanks!  Gutshot hooked me up with a jig idea for my ridgid oscillating sander - we will see how that works.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 02, 2016, 05:20:41 pm
guys all bows are looking good.

Ive been talking to Rich and I have switched my BL from a rigid handle to a bendy. First time I've tried making one. But Rich walked me through on the lay out of the handle. All heat treating is done , I have got my string alignment good finally. So now its tiller time! Thanks Rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 02, 2016, 05:34:27 pm
Gutshot, looks real good sir. I especially like the character of the back of the bow.....sweet.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 02, 2016, 05:51:47 pm
Gutshot - that bow is looking good.  I've seen pics of several bendy bows Rich has made - they all look great.  He knows what he is doing!

Why don't you pan up with your camera and give us a shot of those critters hanging on the wall!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 02, 2016, 06:01:28 pm
OK - been wanting to try and build a jig to grind lams using one of my sanders.  Paul (Gutshot) gave me some suggestions so I went ahead and worked a little bit this afternoon.  The aluminum angle is bolted on one end and adjustable on the other.  Haven't tried it out yet, but I think it will work!  Maybe? :-\
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 02, 2016, 06:14:23 pm
That's looks great gut....has lots of character likes its creator! :P
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 02, 2016, 06:23:40 pm
Mitch, Gutshot....now that is slicker than snot on a doorknob  8) 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 02, 2016, 07:49:38 pm
Hey you got to be creative when you need to drum sand. It's slow but works good.

Mitch I like that yours is a belt sander.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 02, 2016, 07:52:01 pm
If plan b gets a decent glue out of those skins, I'll try a batch with roe in it with my next catch. That's the part I really don't like to discard. 1000's of potential meals that never got to be. My grandmother used to eat it battered and fried. That I won't do while other food is still available. I wonder if it will make my bow smell fishy?

It's too late on this round. It's too warm and they're in the trash outside.  I'm not going to be opening that lid again. It was starting to turn a little this afternoon, but bearable.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 02, 2016, 07:55:02 pm
Fred if I may make a suggestion that might help you keep your sanity. You should start another thread for Q&A and this one can be for progress pics and small talk. That way questions don't get missed. It is hard to keep up with all the posts.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 02, 2016, 08:07:00 pm
Lots of of great looking work getting done. Went to bed for a few hours today ( working nights) and when I get up I'm three pages behind.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 02, 2016, 08:12:03 pm
Mitch. I don't think you want to see those small critters on my wall. Every body has bigger deer than me. I do my own taxidermy thats why There up on the wall
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 02, 2016, 08:53:05 pm
Mitch I like that thickness sander!

Dakota, Rich, I was kiddin' about the caviar. Think I'll "stick" with the straight skin glue.  :laugh: Dakota you were a brave man retrieving those used perch! :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 02, 2016, 09:03:58 pm
Hey people,
I been away but now I'm back. Dang you guys are movin fast here!
I didn't get any scraping done but it was a needed experience gong back to the roots but that's another story.

Got 2 osage in the works and a lilac on reserve and 2 broken cameras so I wll get beter with a phone now  :)

Lot of great lookin work goin on here.

AWESOME!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 02, 2016, 09:09:27 pm
Started setting up to do some tip overlays...gonna use purple heart and some cow horn I got at the pet store.  I started out by slightly taking down the tip to accept the overlay.  Very important to keep it nice and flat.  I use the over lay with some sandpaper to do the final flattening.  I pretapered the horn to save myself some work.  Gonna glue up tonight....and I might get after them later for finishing.

Maybe some patience will prevail ay B?  I have very limited amounts!

(http://i.imgur.com/NZniNSK.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/kY9voE1.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 02, 2016, 09:13:22 pm
You're doing a fine job ajooter!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 02, 2016, 09:28:28 pm
I like the dark finish you put on that first bow...can't wait to see it finished out.   That's my least favorite part is putting finish on a bow...takes too long!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 02, 2016, 09:36:30 pm
Ajooter

Way to use your resources on getting cow horn. Hadn't thought of the pet store. Thanks I will check my local pet store out sometime and see what they got
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 02, 2016, 09:49:15 pm
Much cheaper then antler...DON'T buy that at the pet store!!  You will be broke...crazy how expensive that stuff is.  The only thing about horn and antler is it stinks to high heavens shaping and sanding it.  I wear a half face respirator with particulate cartridges.  Stuff is nasty!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 02, 2016, 10:54:13 pm
Thanks PlanB - I went ahead and tried it out...didn't work too bad.  As gutshot warned me, it will be slow going.  It was!   :laugh:  I had to take just a tiny bit at a time and run it through several times at each thickness.  It did sand to a pretty good uniform thickness.  The backing is at 1/8".  I checked it in several places and they all read 1/8".  But, if you run your finger along the length you can feel some very very very slight dips or humps.  The core and belly are at 5/16".

Just have to figure out how I am going to taper the core lam...that will have to wait until tomorrow.  Looks like I will have time - another snow day - there ain't nothing moving until the wind goes down and the snow plows can get out.  There is a 5 foot drift across my driveway and even bigger ones on the streets!   :o

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 03, 2016, 01:37:30 am
Mr B, so was I ...just my wierd sense of humor sir.

Mitch, Are you aware that you can cut thickness tapers on a table saw? they will come out so you mayonly need 1 or 2 passed with your thickness sander.....or if ya use a finish (fine tooth) blade no sanding at all?  For what it is worth....we are gettin hammered up here as well we are falling freezing rain, snow, white-outs, and heavy wind all at the same time ...aint it great >:D

Mr. DuBois, dont even blink around these fellas....you'll miss something. This is outstanding 8) 8) 8)

Dakota, around these parts the old-timers (like me) would butter fry the eggs till semi crispy and the small kids ate those cause they taste pretty much like perch but the momma's KNEW for a fact wasn't no bones, the lady's really worry about that.

AJ, did you happen to see the hoofs? they sell them as well and they are hollow, triangular in section, and actually respond real well to reshape with steam....and there are as many colors as bone.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 03, 2016, 07:49:35 am
Rich I like a weird sense of humor! Mitch, along with  Rich"s suggestion of the table saw, one way of cutting long tapers is to temporarily attach the lam to another board that is much thicker and tapered, or padded out to the taper. then you can run both against a fence on the saw and/or sander, and separate afterward. Another way is a shooting board and plane.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: pincushin on February 03, 2016, 09:52:22 am
wow you guys are moving fast looking like the trade will be done by the start of summer
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 03, 2016, 10:52:16 am
Some of you are way ahead of schedule and these bows are looking great. Keep up the good work.
I on the other hand along with many others are just getting the feel for things and slower from the starting gate.

I know that some have just gotten staves and need to catch up. For everyone still laying out their bows let's try to get started by this weekend.

As soon as I get my morning coffee down(yes, I slept in late) I'm going to try to clear a path to my outdoor work station through the snow. This blizzard left about 5" drifts just outside my back door.
I knew I should have installed that snow fence before winter.


Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DC on February 03, 2016, 11:27:36 am
This is a tip made from a chew hoof. You have to rifle through the box to find the nicely colored ones but they turn out like agate. I use the corners of the hoof, it's thicker there. They stink like horn.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 03, 2016, 11:39:37 am
Plan A bow has turned out under draw weight after shooting @ min draw length, and don't want to send it. So out with the plan B stave (which is actually even nicer than Plan A was).

This one is wider (2-1/4" vs 1-5/8") and I'm going to line out for a 2" width. It looks absolutely clear so far, but haven't got the bark off yet. Plenty of length (81") to move things around on and about 4" reflex overall. Also black birch.

So back to square one!





Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on February 03, 2016, 11:44:06 am
We all find ourselves back to square one. No matter if the last attempt was a success or failure, we always go back to the beginning. Feels like home after a while.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 03, 2016, 11:59:17 am
That tip looks great DC gonna have to try that!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 03, 2016, 12:19:49 pm
Persistence is the key to success PlanB.  Keep it going.  We've all been there.

Great looking tip overlay DC.  I'll have to keep my eyes open in the pet stores.  I have some extra deer antlers if anyone needs some pieces for overlays.  I'll be glad to share.  Send me a PM.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 03, 2016, 01:05:00 pm
Well fellas here's my progress so far..... The award bow is finished and waiting for skins, This is the first of my 2 trade bows...ready for color and string fitting....also have the rawhide string twisted up for the quiver. So here is the first trade bow so far
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 03, 2016, 01:07:10 pm
OH cool Rich.  Someone is going to be a "happy camper" with that bow!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 03, 2016, 01:13:04 pm
Thanks Drew, sure hope so....my bows are pretty plain
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 03, 2016, 01:27:15 pm
DC - those tips look great.  I might have to give that a try!

Rich - cool looking bow.  Thanks for the suggestions!  I cut those lams on my band saw and was a little more conservative than I needed to be.  Next time I will cut them a little closer to what I need. :-[  Experience is a great teacher.

I like D. Kids idea on a new thread for questions about the bows.

Been out scooping snow all morning - no time for working on bows!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 03, 2016, 01:39:37 pm
mwosborn:
I was looking at trilams last night and I saw most people tapered the core but no one said why. Why you taper the core?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 03, 2016, 02:22:02 pm
Wow Rich, thats one helluva piece of work there. Someone's gonna lose their mind when they get that. DC sweet tips, prolly gonna steal that idea too. Got my hackberry very close to long string tiller. Put er back in the caul last nite for another heat treatment.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 03, 2016, 02:25:29 pm
Great, Rich! I envy whoever gets that Penobscot. I've always been curious about native bows from my region, and that design is and eastern Abenaki neighbor. It would be Cowasuck Abenaki, here. Are here any records of bows for them?

Sleek Drewster, thanks! (I'm actually glad to be building with everybody again. Might slow down just to enjoy it longer...)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: willie on February 03, 2016, 02:32:06 pm
Nice lookin stave, planB. are you going to go with that natural reflex? it looks about as even as it gets.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 03, 2016, 03:10:55 pm
Dakota, I am pondering your suggestion. Thank you!! We'll see how it goes down the stretch. It looks as though right now the questions have been answered if not by someone else then by me with what knowledge I have.

DC, fine looking tips!! Now to show my ignorance. Whats a chew hoof?

half eye, your work absolutely amazes me.

The top limb on this black walnut is 1" longer and I thought the tiller on the long string looked good. After 2 layers of sinew and 2 days the top limb is showing far more reflex than the bottom. Not sure what to do about it at this stage and will have to wait a few months to tell. Possibly it will surprise me and still work out with some scraping. Too late to do anything about it now unless one of you has a suggestion.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DC on February 03, 2016, 03:27:22 pm
They are cow(I think) hooves that are cleaned up and sold at pet stores. If you have an indoor dog don't give it one of these. They stink real bad when you work them. They stink even worse after adog has chewed on them for a while.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 03, 2016, 03:53:08 pm
Fred - that did take quite a bit of reflex didn't it!!

jandersson - I am new to trilams so most likely not the person to ask.  But, tapering the lam prior to glue up helps in the tillering process.  It is a bit like tillering before it is glued.  Those that make FG bows taper before glue up as there is no removing material afterwards.  I plan on tapering at a rate of about .003"/inch. (core only)

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 03, 2016, 04:43:27 pm
Willie, one end twists a little and reflexes more than the other, so I'm thinking cut that end short Hard to tell from the picture.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 03, 2016, 05:32:20 pm
Well... I finally got my staves in from Half Eye... Of course they look great.

Anywho, I am including a couple pictures of the one for the trade. The stave is Ironwood (HHB). I have a few questions for you guys...

How wide should the limbs be, and how exactly should I taper them? I believe the tips on most be is are normally about 3/4, right? Should I go in a straight line from the (fades??), to the tips... Or should I go out a little ways and then angle towards the tips?

About what thickness should my limbs be? They appear to be 5/8-3/4 (give or take a little) right now.

Also... It has some natural recurve that seems to be pretty even. Should I do anything else to it? Recurve the tips? Or just leave as is?

I am open to ANY suggestions. Once I figure out what exactly I'm going to do, I will get to work...

(http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l62/krzyjon123/Mobile%20Uploads/20160203_152722_zpscguv1vam.jpg) (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/krzyjon123/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160203_152722_zpscguv1vam.jpg.html)

The other picture will be in a different post. :D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 03, 2016, 05:32:57 pm
(http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l62/krzyjon123/Mobile%20Uploads/20160203_160432_zpsxcztezs9.jpg) (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/krzyjon123/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160203_160432_zpsxcztezs9.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 03, 2016, 05:50:26 pm
Hey David, glad to see you rec'd the staves from Rich. I've never worked hhb but these others will chime in. Half eye is the hhb wizard in my book.

Thrilled to see you getting started and will follow along. I'm going to have to trade Rich some osage and try hhb.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 03, 2016, 05:59:05 pm
David - I have not tried HHB yet either.  From what I hear, it can handle various designs.  Looks like Rich has it roughed out to approximate dimensions.  The easiest (IMO) might be a pyramid design.  Taper straight from the fades to the tips.  Not sure how wide for HHB, but I would guess 1.5 to 1.75" at the fade and .5" at the tips for a start.  How long you going to make it?

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 03, 2016, 06:02:57 pm
David. Not for sure on HHB but a good rule of thumb I go by on any wood, from the fades I like to go 12-14 inches down parallel at 2" wide then taper to my knocks @ 1/2" wide. Also you need to draw a center line through your bow. The reflex looks good. and make it long you can always take wood off but can't put it back on. Have fun you will do good
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 03, 2016, 06:12:32 pm
David,
     First off I left you enough wood to make about anything ya want. Something to consider is if you put the limb tips on a couple 2x4 (the way it is right now) you can probably stand on that thing and not touch the floor >:D

As to layout if you taper from fades to tips you basically have a pyramid design (means very little thickness taper.....If you go out some then taper you will be making an American flatbow.

It does not require hardly any HHB to make good weight so you are going to need and take a bunch off....(it does work well with hand tools however) If your desired weight is around 50-55# you will not need more than 1-1/2" wide limbs and they will be well less that 1/2 thick just as an example.

The length is also more than you need. If you needed say 28" draw just use it the way it is and have a little leeway. One other thing....I do not heat treat but have friends who have heat-treated HHB bows (wood same as yours) and they said it responded very well to that method. As for recurves HHB steams very well.
rich

Maybe some of these guys will suggest a design that is ideal for what you have in mind....OH ya you can make any type tips you want and as skinny as you want.....that is some very tough wood.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 03, 2016, 06:32:04 pm
Rich, since you've seen and handles the stave how straight was the grain?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 03, 2016, 06:55:21 pm
David, that is a nice looking hhb stave.  Have fun with it.  Sounds like Rich gave some good advice.

I came home today to find the new Primitive Archer magazine.  I probably won't get much done on my trade bow tonight.  :D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 03, 2016, 07:00:17 pm
I think I'm going to taper straight from the fades to the tips.

How far should the string knocks be from the tips? I have heard 1/2".

Thanks for the info so far!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 03, 2016, 07:03:55 pm
Fred, that piece of ironwood and the other 3 as well have very straight grain without defects at all, but the bow rough out is as straight grained as a taught sting 8) 8)

PlanB....Apparently I forgot to hit "post" when I answered you ( of course it might be a vast right-wing conspiracy) na, just sender stupidity >:D I have not specifically studied these bows and variants....but have run into the general "white history" take in the museum specimens. By that I mean the Abenaki (like most NA tribes/bands) are lumped into a general pile without regard to any differentiation. There is also the matter of some specimens being attributed in error.....when the dust settles here I plan on doing more in-depth research.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 03, 2016, 07:12:52 pm
David,
      If you are planning to make "regular" string knocks (filed in on the edges and belly) or "pin" knocks then 1/2" will be good to start.
     As a starting point, make your centerline down the long axis, draw in your pyramid tapers and grip area.....then cut out your front profile ya just drew.....when ya get that done come back and I'll give a tip or two on laying out your thickness profile.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Badly Bent on February 03, 2016, 07:31:17 pm
That ironwood of Rich's is excellent David. I've had the pleasure of working some of recently and was really impressed with the stuff. As said you can go with just about any design with that wood and count on it to do well.




Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 03, 2016, 07:35:14 pm
Ok , instead of fluppin thru 55 pages, wanted to know who was ordering goat rawhide from moscow hide and fur? Just wanna know how u order it. Thanx.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 03, 2016, 07:37:01 pm
Thanks HE PLAN B has arrived will draw the bark and sap wood off this weekend.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 03, 2016, 07:43:08 pm
David E
      I met a guy named Greg last year at moontree get together he gave me this ruler I wish I had one to give you and every body else. So here is a pic maybe you can print a ruler off on paper then write everything else in. I use it on every bow I make. And you might be able to find it on the interweb. That pic is awful anybody who wants a good pic pm me with a email. Thanks
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Knoll on February 03, 2016, 07:50:20 pm
Looks like Ferret's bow layout ruler. I have several that MoBow made available at 2014 MoJam. Yep, purty handy!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 03, 2016, 07:51:16 pm
^^ That is really cool!

On the handle...  Should I just kind of round it off, or do a bunch of shaping? I don't think there isenough wood to do much with.

Thanks for the help. I'm going out in just a minute to lay out the limbs, I'll let you know what happens... :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 03, 2016, 07:56:36 pm
Yep, Ferrets floppy rule. I copied one and keep misplacing it. A must have.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 03, 2016, 08:01:28 pm
David,  After you draw in your centerline.....measure 3/4" on @ side at the fades and 1/4" to 3/8" @ side at the tip and draw a straight line taper between the two of 'em.  I made that grip rough-out so you can smooth off the sides and then shape the fades as you go on to your limb thickness. You can then have the room to wrap the grip without it being too large....with or without an arrow rest. I know who who your building for so if ya get the chance look up some of his bows and get an idea what ya want to do from there....ok?

One more, the grip as is will not bend on a 100 pound bow they are deceptive
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 03, 2016, 08:03:51 pm
Can't wait to get my hands on some hhb....gonna cut some thus year for sure!  Looks like that will make a nice bow David.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 03, 2016, 08:06:34 pm
Half eye, did you say your bows are "pretty plain"?
I'll go with the pretty part anyway.

Gutshot: you lucky dog!! got a he stave to work on. Now don't you stay up too late messin with that thing!

I will never catch up with the progress here so I better just go from here.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 03, 2016, 08:09:57 pm
Or is it David with the HHB from half eye?

Or both?

 :-\ :-[
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 03, 2016, 08:14:03 pm
Dubois
Osage from HE and by the looks of it I'm gonna have fun this weekend working it down. Already got a planB for this one and I hope planA and PlanB both work out. Yee-Haa
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 03, 2016, 08:19:28 pm
Marco, you're doing fine. I have my give away bow sinewed because it takes so long to dry. My trade bow is not even laid out yet. Waiting for the weather to turn.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 03, 2016, 08:22:52 pm
Ok every body talk to me should I take the knot out? it's at mid limb and I can keep my width. The side pic shows the knot isn't showing on the side but it will add 3/8" to the mid limb which I don't think will hurt. So whatcha think
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 03, 2016, 08:37:43 pm
Knots on the edge are a p.i.t.a.  I would decide based upon the looks of the grain around the knot.  Is it pretty clean with no violations?  Is there good grain on the outside of the knot to the edge?  Generally, I like to leave them if this is the case.  Good luck with it either way!

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 03, 2016, 08:39:59 pm
gutshot, if that is osage I really aint comfortable saying....with Ironwood I'd leave it be. You got more experience with osage than I do. Probably your first instinct is probably the right one, just from experience.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 03, 2016, 08:46:24 pm
By that I mean the Abenaki (like most NA tribes/bands) are lumped into a general pile without regard to any differentiation. There is also the matter of some specimens being attributed in error.....when the dust settles here I plan on doing more in-depth research.
rich
That's great Rich, I'd love to hear anything you find interesting when you do. As I understand it, the Sudbury bow might be the closest thing I can find, for the time being. A few weeks ago I found a very short video of it at the Harvard Peabody museum, but it's impossible to see the shape of it from that. Weird video angles and closeups.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 03, 2016, 08:59:35 pm
Gutshot, only because you asked for "everybody" to say..... I'd leave it.  I'd figure more wood if it's there than if it isn't, and ther'll just be half a grain swirl left at the edge if taken out. But take anything I say with a grain of salt. Nah, a spoon full.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 03, 2016, 09:02:38 pm
Half Eye it's Black locus

I believe I will leave the knot it runs at a angle and comes out the belly 1/2" from the edge.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 03, 2016, 09:04:10 pm
I forgot to take pictues...

Buuuuut, I got the limbs shaped. I also smoothed out the fades a little bit. Hopefully I'll get some more done tomorrow. I have been working on our beehives and bows at the same time. Hahaha.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 03, 2016, 09:49:08 pm
So much good info in this thread!
Plan B and David: You guys got some sweet staves to work on, I'm jealous.
ajooter: That handle of yours is a trip. Nice work!
half eye: Mighty fine sticks! You making three bows total?

Seeing the trilams here I think that is gonna be my plan B, I don't have access to staves but I got boards. I do wonder where the taper of the core begins, where the riser ends towards the tips? Are there any good build a longs?

My update:
I've had trouble bending the lilac, this time I did the whole limb though. I know, it's a pretty ghetto set up! But this time I got a better result. What do you guys think of the line up?
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMGP1987.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMGP1987.jpg.html)
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMGP1992.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMGP1992.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 03, 2016, 10:00:03 pm
Looks a lot better jandersson!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: willie on February 03, 2016, 11:11:00 pm
following along with the fun. wish I had the time to commit to the party

never did find a good picture of the sudbury, when I built on a few years ago

but I did find this pic in Native American Bows by T.M. Hamilton, not too long ago.

I have it in a higher rez, and if anyone wants a copy, just PM

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 03, 2016, 11:31:58 pm
Worked on layout tonight.  I tried the trick that Otter showed for layout of a pyramid, and it works very well.  I used craft paper because that is what I had, so the picture doesn't show up great.  I marked the center trying to follow the grain, and then marked the exact pyramid.  There are a few spots on the edge with small knots so I will have to adjust the layout lines around those spots.  Almost ready to start roughing out... hatchet and drawknife for me, would love to have a bandsaw.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 03, 2016, 11:38:50 pm
Nice curves Loope!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 03, 2016, 11:47:21 pm
Yes, currrvy!  I hope this one works out, I love the look of this stave.  I've got about 10 bows under my belt, only three are staves, so I am going slow and careful.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 04, 2016, 12:07:33 am
^^^That is the only way it should be done. Impatient people tend to find a different hobby.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 04, 2016, 12:19:26 am
I changed my lineup a bit.

From top to bottomt in order of current favorite:
Rock Elm- dry heat straightened, currently floor tillering
HHB- handle roughed in, mollie tips are next
spalted hazel- was my #1 but I'm liking the rock elm, so it's been collecting dust
Top secret- I forgot I had this. It's my first attempt at a decrowned stave. I didn't have the know how to deal with it when I acquired it. I hope I do now. We shall see.
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/100_2793_zpsetyv8ijo.jpg)

(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/100_2792_zps7gsts9lp.jpg)

It's hard to keep up with all you power tool users. Boy do my arms feel like jello. It's totally worth it though.

Oh and I found some osage today. In my area that's not a common occurrence. Now I just have to find out if I can cut it. I suppose if I waited for a few months it would fall in the creek and wash out into the lake, but who knows where it would wash back up. It did give me the idea to check the beaches for that very thing. All of the osage I've found here has been close to a creek. That's the main way the fruit is distributed now-a-days, since mammoths and giants sloths went extinct.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 04, 2016, 12:24:37 am
Gutshot.... I would probably leave that knot in.

jandersson.... Looks like you have it under control.


Loope....... Layout looking good. I've been looking for a good redbud to cut for several years now. Been avoiding the snakey ones so I'm watching this one closely.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jeffp51 on February 04, 2016, 01:08:00 am
Loope, your snakey layout shows you cutting straight through a knot.  Do you want to go around it maybe?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 04, 2016, 01:26:08 am
Worked on layout tonight.  I tried the trick that Otter showed for layout of a pyramid, and it works very well.  I used craft paper because that is what I had, so the picture doesn't show up great.  I marked the center trying to follow the grain, and then marked the exact pyramid.  There are a few spots on the edge with small knots so I will have to adjust the layout lines around those spots.  Almost ready to start roughing out... hatchet and drawknife for me, would love to have a bandsaw.


Hey Loope, that's a sexy stave! What wood is that again? I say hatchet is the way to go. I love how it keeps me true to the grain as I am hackin out the edges. I just gotta remember to take it slow and sometimes flip stave end for end to prevent tearing out too much.

Janderson: you are really taming that lilac, it looks real good to me. Say, what side do you need the arrow to pass on anyway  >:D?. How is the side profile looking for you?
PS: you have a nice kitchen (until your wife evicts you)  >:D  You ever get drip stains on the counters from the steaming?

DK: that rock elm is beautiful. gonna look sweet with the color contrasts comin out of that handle, but then same with the hazel.  I don't see how you could go wrong wth any of them!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 04, 2016, 01:27:50 am
Loope, your snakey layout shows you cutting straight through a knot.  Do you want to go around it maybe?

+1
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 04, 2016, 02:15:52 am
Loope, your snakey layout shows you cutting straight through a knot.  Do you want to go around it maybe?

+1


There are a few spots on the edge with small knots so I will have to adjust the layout lines around those spots.


Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 04, 2016, 06:49:40 am
Sweet Jesus.....a fella goes to bed and gets up feeling like he done something wrong >:D >:D >:D

David, love your get up and go, but try not to get way ahead of yourself. It will happen (the bow will get done) and it would be better if ya wound up with 3 more sticks to play with than having to start over .....damned I sound like a old man, eh?

Mr Andersson... that set up looks good to me.....got the job done, no?

Looope, that's gonna be a looker when ya get 'er done.....you got a pair my friend

Mr. Kid.....that stave stash is pure eye candy right there

Man this trade is rockin, even got the old man all excited and that aint happened for awhile now. I am lovin this stuff.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 04, 2016, 07:33:50 am
I managed to do a little work on my BL last night.  I just about have the limbs evened up and have it at a higher brace.  It looks much better now.  I have drawn it to 16 inches so far so it is getting close.  Time for. Me to slow down and go very careful. 

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/F9A856A7-0EF6-4ABA-94C9-4A6048EA6CB8_zpsebyvpm0b.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/F9A856A7-0EF6-4ABA-94C9-4A6048EA6CB8_zpsebyvpm0b.jpg.html)

Loope, that stave sure is looking nice. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 04, 2016, 07:47:34 am
Swampman....that looks REAL close.....can ya feel that baby breathin down your neck? 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on February 04, 2016, 08:05:24 am
Man this trade is rockin, even got the old man all excited and that aint happened for awhile now. I am lovin this stuff.


That's exactly how I'm feeling about Rich! This trade has got me checking the site again multiple times a day. It's making things fun again.

Tattoo Dave
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 04, 2016, 08:16:06 am
Absolutely sir !!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 04, 2016, 08:38:36 am
Rich those bows are looking good

Loope that is one snakey stave. That will be fun to scrape down to bow shape

DKID those are some nice staves

Fred sorry don't know nothing about sinueing besides it threw a lot of reflex in that bow

Everybody else. I'm enjoying reading and trying to keep up. But it's time for me to slow way down. I will post some pics this weekend when I get some filleting done.

Keep the wood a flying !!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 04, 2016, 09:07:56 am
Fred
I've only done a couple sinew backed bows so my suggestions/questions haven't been tried and may not be good advice at all. ;D

Can you just build an extra layer on one limb? Maybe shave just that limb down a little first as well. Or... Could the weaker limb be propped up for the next application? As previously stated I have no idea if these are viable options, but seemed like possible solutions.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 04, 2016, 09:12:49 am
Swampman that BL IS LOOKIN GOOD.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 04, 2016, 09:40:35 am
Swampman that IS pretty!
willie, thanks!

Everybody, too many names to count for sayin' you all are making this a terrific group project.

ps. I'm one of the impatient ones, now forcing myself to go slow on my plan B bow. 

Lesseee now uhhhhhh, fingers tapping, pacing back and forth, looking for the tenth time this morning at that stave. No. nope. nope. wait for it.

Aaaahhhh the heck with it, I can always build a plan C...........
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 04, 2016, 11:49:10 am
OK, so I straightened the stave again, boiling ti first then hitting it with dry heat
(https://stuckinthemudsite.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/image.jpeg)
(https://stuckinthemudsite.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/image1.jpeg)

then while it was straight, roughed out the handle and cut it in half, so now if everything drops out of square I can adjust the mating surfaces of the joint, which I'll line with leather to make up the width of the saw kerf and which should also act as a high friction surface.

(https://stuckinthemudsite.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/image3.jpeg)

(https://stuckinthemudsite.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/image2.jpeg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: cabinetbowguy on February 04, 2016, 12:30:07 pm
The trilam is up and shooting  time for a very light final sand then a nice glossy finish, which  means its time to start on plan b an osage elb



As being new to the forum eveyone is very welcoming, this is one enjoyable trade !!



I would love to have every ones thoughts on tiller on this guy  hickory backed, cherry core, osage belly its pushing a 850 grain hickory 135fps so not to bad in my oppion  :)

Jason
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 04, 2016, 12:58:14 pm
Stuck.....that's lookin real good sir

Cabinet....That speed with that weight arrow is a deer killer if this old man ever seen one....That tiller looks real good to. This is how these baby's are supposed to be....they are great in my opinion too
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 04, 2016, 01:02:52 pm
CBG it looks bad close if you get your camera guy to line your riser up with the metal ribs on the building then come to full draw and take a pic. I hope that's clear as mud. Haha then we can see the tiller with the lines on the metal
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on February 04, 2016, 01:05:30 pm
850 grain arrow at 135 fps.... Dude thats power.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 04, 2016, 03:15:34 pm
How do you guys lay out your limb thickness? I have the pyramid cut out, but now I need to thin them up. Is there a certain tool you use for thinning then down?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 04, 2016, 03:21:19 pm
David, Gordon's build along is a really great help at this stage of a stave bow. There are others, too. It's just the one I remember most easily:
http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,53195.0.html

And since it's a pyramid bow, Bubby's board bow might be helpful, too:

http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,35312.0.html



Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 04, 2016, 03:28:22 pm
Cool. I will check those out.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 04, 2016, 03:31:43 pm
David
     I will have some how to photos up within the hour sir.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 04, 2016, 03:33:33 pm
How do you guys lay out your limb thickness? I have the pyramid cut out, but now I need to thin them up. Is there a certain tool you use for thinning then down?

I use a ruler and measure down from back 1/2 down and mark it all The way down from the end of the fades to the tips every 1/2 " then I connect the dots (both sides) your doing a good job David. Main thing be patient and take your time. I'm still making mistakes do to getting in a hurry!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 04, 2016, 03:57:12 pm
DuBois: No stains yet just cracked the counter top clamping boards and bows on to it >:D Goal is to get it on the tree today and get some bend to it.

halfeye: True, it worked though.


Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 04, 2016, 04:10:31 pm
Mr. Ewing,
     Here is how I start the limb thinning....I do it this way so everything stays even and gives a nice bend. By repeating this you can go from very heavy to just right and usually will have no stiff spots or hinges in the bends.
    At 1-1/2" wide I would start by making a 1/2" line down from the back....and on all 4 sides of the limbs.....I use the "finger guide" method shown in pics 1 and 2.....then draw a centerline (rather more like sketch it in) now rasp from the edge lines into the centerline untill you have a "peak" running down the belly. You can now check the floor tiller to get a sense of how strong the bow is.....if it's too strong then rasp down the peak to flat limbs and check again.......if still too heavy then start over by making new side lines and starting all over......when you are close go to the scraper and work the belly into a shallow oval to flat profile....several pics from diff angles to illustrate the sidewalls and ridge.
    If I screwed up on the explanation please let me know....see if I can clear it up.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 04, 2016, 04:10:58 pm
last pic
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 04, 2016, 04:21:31 pm
That makes sense! Thanks!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 04, 2016, 04:31:44 pm
I like the centerline, even bevel and using the round off to check stiffness ideas, Rich. I'm going to use those.

Trimmed the stave down and now trying the get the bark off. Last time it popped off, but not this time. Black birch bark is thick and hard.....I really need to make myself a shaving horse at some point..
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 04, 2016, 05:06:50 pm
Fellas,
    Here is the quiver I made as a give-away for members of this trade. It is all done (note: the thunderbird and underwater panther need to have their pupils and thunder and lightening bolts painted in.....) The strap is twisted raw-hide, the stiffening rod is tied in with raw-hide. The underwater panther is painted on a "medallion" which is sewed to the quiver. The hide is a very old fawn hide and is quite thin, and while usable will have to have careful handling....or at least not rough-handling.
    Enjoy the pics and I hope you fellas like it.  There are 2 sets of pics
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 04, 2016, 05:08:12 pm
rest of the pics
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 04, 2016, 05:18:03 pm
Sweet half eye! You and Fred are spoiling the traders this year!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 04, 2016, 05:32:21 pm
Oh wow! That is a beautiful quiver!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 04, 2016, 05:33:05 pm
Are you kidding me with that quiver Rich?!?!  That's some fine work sir.  Beautiful piece.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on February 04, 2016, 05:50:33 pm
Your a great inspiration Rich,,, awesome quiver as well! I am busy scraping/sanding on my hickory curve and will have pics up in a few days. Great progress everyone-Hammertime
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 04, 2016, 05:51:19 pm
Didn't get much progress today but did get a little done.( People kept showing up with things for me to work on)
I got one limb on the vine maple bending fairly even but still way too stiff and other limb just starting to move. It has one limb that I can see is going  to give my eyes fits while tillering.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160204_165337062.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 04, 2016, 05:56:22 pm
Turtle, looks like one of mine....aint they a hoot >:D >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 04, 2016, 06:25:17 pm
Rich, that quiver is great.  Very nice work. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 04, 2016, 06:36:02 pm

Rich your magical how did you turn that pink puppy into a real dog in your demo pics of laying a bow out
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 04, 2016, 06:37:56 pm
Dang Rich that quiver is awsome!!!!!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 04, 2016, 06:40:10 pm
Thanks swampman.....the Danzen Bar arrows (they stay with me >:D) do make it look nice
rich
Just seen your post Mr. Gutshot.......I'll have you to know that Miss Keika does pretty much what ever she wishes and like all spoiled kids she gets toys out but not so good at puttin them back >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 04, 2016, 06:47:41 pm
all i could think of today was that Osage stave i got from Half Eye,  i got home from work and started hatcheting away then roughed out a ring to see what I had to play with. My thoughts were wow thanks Rich just what I needed character!  OK rough layout this bow will be hopefully 64" with a forward offset handle I'm going to hopefully drop 6 rings coming down my fades to the limbs this by measurement about 3/8" drop  I'm looking at leaving the 6 rings high on my tips for a natural tip overlays. I'm gonna need alot of luck on my side never done nothing like i just explained.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 04, 2016, 06:54:10 pm
Rich, that quiver is sweet.  You do fine work.  Someone is going to be a proud owner.  Thanks for all your time and help with this trade.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 04, 2016, 07:06:40 pm
For the good management and this fine group right here......it is truly my pleasure.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 04, 2016, 07:44:36 pm
Turtle, looks like one of mine....aint they a hoot >:D >:D
rich


Not sure if HOOT is the exact word I would use. ::)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 04, 2016, 08:14:54 pm
I didn't get anything done this last couple days. Been all over the place and had to build a gate today.  I go back to work Friday Saturday and Sunday so I won't be back at it till Monday and Tuesday.  I've got a few pics to post so I can get y'alls opinions but I will do that tomorrow. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Blaflair2 on February 04, 2016, 09:19:18 pm
Man the weather is warming up, so I'll be in the shop. Dug out my last/best stave from the Osage I cut a few miles from my house in ny. Was gonna save her for my personal rig but it's only wood right? And id rather have someone else share in my story. The farmer will get a kick out of it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: dylanholderman on February 04, 2016, 09:34:08 pm
i steamed my osage stave pretty fla ;Dt i might add some reflex later after i get it bending a bit more. how long should i wait now that its been steamed?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 04, 2016, 10:05:23 pm
Very cool quiver Rich - you done well!

That one limb on the vine maple does look like a challenge Turtle - good luck!

Gutshot - I am not smart enough to understand your plan! :-[   I might need sketches and diagrams!  :laugh:  It does have some character to it though - enjoy!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 04, 2016, 10:08:17 pm
Rich, that is one fine quiver!! How do you keep up with all you got going man! And you may have had a lttle snow?

Thanks Turtle for showing me what I missed. Loope has them knots in hand better than I have hold of what's gong on here  :-\

Gut: that is lookin cool.

So many working on great things I can't keep up.

I gotta get away from the trading post so I can focus on this more.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 04, 2016, 10:23:27 pm
Gutshot: I saw Simson (Simon?) do that on one of his Osage bows, go for it. Good luck!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 04, 2016, 10:27:02 pm
Well I finally finished shaping one of my nocks...been busy lately haven't had as much time.  I'm gluing up the second nock tonight.

I got a package in the mail today.  And my gf made what will probably be her only contribution to the trade ;)  Other then putting up with me working on bows all the time.
(http://i.imgur.com/Aoh2mAN.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/FZCoNeF.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/NFXRQgx.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/Ch0MEqX.jpg?1)

Offer still stands....anybody who needs some rawhide speak up!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 04, 2016, 11:02:49 pm
Dylan, give it plenty of time. Don't rush it. Sometimes you have to find a different project to take your mind somewhere else for a short while. I believe in letting it regain it's composure for a few days and with steam I'd wait even longer. Keep it  in a controlled environment. Weigh it  everyday and see what that tells you.

Rich the quiver is amazing. That would hang on my living room wall!!!

ajooter, that's a nice hide and looks huge. What was it?

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 04, 2016, 11:11:34 pm
Offer still stands....anybody who needs some rawhide speak up!

I could use a small amount. Let me know what you need!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 04, 2016, 11:18:57 pm
Let me know how wide and how long and I'll hook ya up Tim!  I don't need anything in return.  Shoot me your address via pm.

Fred it's goat rawhide.  It's really nice to work with.  I soak the whole hide and then cut it into strips.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 04, 2016, 11:41:47 pm
How do you know when the bow is ready for the tillering tree? I'm aiming for about 50 lbs. I don't have a clue how much the limbs should bend when I push on them.  They are some what flexible, in my opinion anyway. I don't really have anything to go off of.

 Once again I forgot to take pictures. Hahaha. I'll get you guys some tomorrow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 05, 2016, 06:06:47 am
David,
     are you familiar with the "push-pull" method of stringing a bow? If so do that just a little bit to test for relative power. You can put it on the long string now....but be real careful that you do 2 things and I do mean watch BOTH of 'em.....Pull just enough to see if both limbs look like they are pretty even.....
if they are not then stop and make them more even.....when they are then put your scale on and pull it to 40 pounds and see where you hit that weight....if it hits 40 at about say 8-10 inches you are still heavy but close enough to go to your scraper......
    When I say long string I define that as JUST as long as the bow (not real sloppy) I know it's the "exciting time" right now because you want to see her bend.....please dont do that you only have to pull it one time a little to far and ya got a kids bow EVERYTIME.
   Here is your mantra.....are they even? where do they hit 40, are the even, where do they hit 40......keep that up till you are about 6 inches short of full draw.....then are they even, where does it hit 50 ....are they even and where do they hit 50....until you are there.

 Make sure the limbs are real close to bending the same first, then pull and NEVER go past intended draw weight........the more bows you make the more the urge to just pull her back is gonna creep in.....stick to the mantra. Also, once you are back to about 6-8 inches of draw then be sure to shorten your string to "low brace" before you carry on......at about 14" you should be able to safely brace it.

Each and every time you shorten that string you better be damned sure you have nice even bends in the limbs....if not then get 'em even FIRST.. I'm not trying to be a smart ass....it just that there is a certain process to tillering, if you follow the mantra you wont have any big problems.....when ya get over confident (like I still do at times) something will come back to bite you and ya got either a kids bow or a broken bow.

Oh ya......quit forgettin the pics man cause you know us hill-billy's like our pics  >:D >:D >:D
rich

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 05, 2016, 06:56:46 am
Rich, thanks for that info on tillering. I'm going to change my method of tillering and give yours a try because I've made more kid bows than good bows. Thanks again   And David keep asking those ?'s and you will make a awesome bow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 05, 2016, 07:19:53 am
David,
     are you familiar with the "push-pull" method of stringing a bow? If so do that just a little bit to test for relative power. You can put it on the long string now....but be real careful that you do 2 things and I do mean watch BOTH of 'em.....Pull just enough to see if both limbs look like they are pretty even.....
if they are not then stop and make them more even.....when they are then put your scale on and pull it to 40 pounds and see where you hit that weight....if it hits 40 at about say 8-10 inches you are still heavy but close enough to go to your scraper......
    When I say long string I define that as JUST as long as the bow (not real sloppy) I know it's the "exciting time" right now because you want to see her bend.....please dont do that you only have to pull it one time a little to far and ya got a kids bow EVERYTIME.
   Here is your mantra.....are they even? where do they hit 40, are the even, where do they hit 40......keep that up till you are about 6 inches short of full draw.....then are they even, where does it hit 50 ....are they even and where do they hit 50....until you are there.

 Make sure the limbs are real close to bending the same first, then pull and NEVER go past intended draw weight........the more bows you make the more the urge to just pull her back is gonna creep in.....stick to the mantra. Also, once you are back to about 6-8 inches of draw then be sure to shorten your string to "low brace" before you carry on......at about 14" you should be able to safely brace it.

Each and every time you shorten that string you better be damned sure you have nice even bends in the limbs....if not then get 'em even FIRST.. I'm not trying to be a smart ass....it just that there is a certain process to tillering, if you follow the mantra you wont have any big problems.....when ya get over confident (like I still do at times) something will come back to bite you and ya got either a kids bow or a broken bow.

Oh ya......quit forgettin the pics man cause you know us hill-billy's like our pics  >:D >:D >:D
rich

Oh, that explains Sooo much about where I've been going wrong.  Awesome post, thank you !! :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 05, 2016, 08:14:37 am
David:
Listen to half eye :) That is good advice.
And I don't know what tillering setup you have but if you're up close to the bow when you're pulling the string it can be difficult to see how it bends. See if someone can snap a picture while you're pulling the string it that you can look at , it really helped me to get some perspective.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 05, 2016, 08:44:30 am
I like your method Rich, and I'm going to change to that this time. Keep writing this stuff! Also, like everybody else, said, the person who gets that quiver is a lucky so and so!

I have only one little thing to contribute, and maybe it's just me.... sometimes when I had some local weirdness in a couple character bows I tried, and it was hard to tell if there was hinging, I found that exercising the bow on the tiller tree and looking carefully at the limbs moving helped me see how it was bending all along better than I could judge by just holding it in one position and looking. The movement showed the bending part of the limb in action. It also helped when one limb had more deflex near the handle than the other. When it was stationary it looked like the deflexed limb was bending more, but it was actually stiffer at one time when I was doing that. That was when I was tillering on a pulley rigged tree.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 05, 2016, 08:51:12 am
Awesome. Thanks guys.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 05, 2016, 09:08:12 am


I have only one little thing to contribute, and maybe it's just me.... sometimes when I had some local weirdness in a couple character bows I tried, and it was hard to tell if there was hinging, I found that exercising the bow on the tiller tree and looking carefully at the limbs moving helped me see how it was bending all along better than I could judge by just holding it in one position and looking. The movement showed the bending part of the limb in action. It also helped when one limb had more deflex near the handle than the other. When it was stationary it looked like the deflexed limb was bending more, but it was actually stiffer at one time when I was doing that. That was when I was tillering on a pulley rigged tree.

+1
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 05, 2016, 09:17:18 am
Rich, that's a great post.....for all of us.  Thanks!  I would add that while following your mantra, exercise the limbs really well every time you remove wood.  Some have recommended to exercise them 30 times or so, but I exercise mine 40-50 times each time wood is removed to help really train the wood to bend.  Proceed slowly and patiently.  Sometimes it helps me to tiller a little and then wait til the next day and look at the bow with fresh eyes before proceeding.  Just my 2 worth.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 05, 2016, 09:27:02 am
You make very valid additions gentlemen.....When we have everybody contributing it HAS to be good and thanks for caring enough to contribute.....as I have said before this is GREAT
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 05, 2016, 09:36:54 am
J
Anderson:  How would you rate the lilac and steam? I am gonna start shaping up my lilac today so any pointers you have (I probably missed it in here somewhere) I would really appreciate. Not a lot of experience in here on lilac that I've seen compared to the more common woods. Thank buddy.

Rich, that's a great post.....for all of us.  Thanks!  I would add that while following your mantra, exercise the limbs really well every time you remove wood.  Some have recommended to exercise them 30 times or so, but I exercise mine 40-50 times each time wood is removed to help really train the wood to bend.  Proceed slowly and patiently.  Sometimes it helps me to tiller a little and then wait til the next day and look at the bow with fresh eyes before proceeding.  Just my 2 worth.

I agree. Having the discipline to wait and be sure my brain and guts are on the same page is tough. Also to exercise limbs and just inspect the grain and wood in a calm manner for a while. Every time I get into the hurry up mode I will do less quality work. If I am feeling rushed for whatever reason it aint so good. I am trying to keep it more meditative.....But then it aint July 31st yet  >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 05, 2016, 09:39:42 am
Agreed on all fronts fellas....Def agree on exercising the limbs in between wood removal.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on February 05, 2016, 09:43:33 am
Here is a video showing Rich's method:  https://youtu.be/SDJPgUN5XqE

I do this exclusively to string longbows and even some recurves, it's a whole lot safer than the ole step through method.  For some really heavy recurves with big sweeping curves, you need a stringer.

David,
     are you familiar with the "push-pull" method of stringing a bow? If so do that just a little bit to test for relative power. You can put it on the long string now....but be real careful that you do 2 things and I do mean watch BOTH of 'em.....Pull just enough to see if both limbs look like they are pretty even.....
if they are not then stop and make them more even.....when they are then put your scale on and pull it to 40 pounds and see where you hit that weight....if it hits 40 at about say 8-10 inches you are still heavy but close enough to go to your scraper......
    When I say long string I define that as JUST as long as the bow (not real sloppy) I know it's the "exciting time" right now because you want to see her bend.....please dont do that you only have to pull it one time a little to far and ya got a kids bow EVERYTIME.
   Here is your mantra.....are they even? where do they hit 40, are the even, where do they hit 40......keep that up till you are about 6 inches short of full draw.....then are they even, where does it hit 50 ....are they even and where do they hit 50....until you are there.

 Make sure the limbs are real close to bending the same first, then pull and NEVER go past intended draw weight........the more bows you make the more the urge to just pull her back is gonna creep in.....stick to the mantra. Also, once you are back to about 6-8 inches of draw then be sure to shorten your string to "low brace" before you carry on......at about 14" you should be able to safely brace it.

Each and every time you shorten that string you better be damned sure you have nice even bends in the limbs....if not then get 'em even FIRST.. I'm not trying to be a smart ass....it just that there is a certain process to tillering, if you follow the mantra you wont have any big problems.....when ya get over confident (like I still do at times) something will come back to bite you and ya got either a kids bow or a broken bow.

Oh ya......quit forgettin the pics man cause you know us hill-billy's like our pics  >:D >:D >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on February 05, 2016, 09:47:29 am
You guys are killing it on here!  I'm still chasing a ring on my Plan A stave - the rings are so thin its like scraping butterfly wings.  Due to my inexperiance with Osage, when I first saw the stave I thought to myself "self, that aught to be easy chasing those rings".  But, when I got into it, I relized that what I thought were big fat rings where really groups of very very thin rings, I think there is a thread on here about something called "moon rings" or similar, and this stave has em in spades.  But, I got it figured out and I'm on the trail of a good ring.  I think it's going to make a killer bow, the wood is willing and sound, I just have to do my part to release the beast.  I only have a few hours a weekend to work on it though, so you guys are smoking me.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 05, 2016, 09:49:01 am
The idea that you have to "train" the stave/board to become a bow, really helped me understand tillering. There was a period in my building where getting the limbs to bend evenly became much easier for me. During this time, I broke 3 or 4 bows in a row. I finally realized it was because I was getting an even tiller with fewer overall limb flexes. The limbs were bending evenly but the flexibility wasn't increasing because of minimal exercise. Just because your tiller is even doesn't mean you're ready for a full draw, or even a half draw. When you do your 30-50 pulls after removing wood, the draw weight will decease between that first pull and the last one without removing any additional wood. Just one more instance where lack of patience can ruin your day(and your bow for that matter). The more you bend your stick, the closer it gets to being a bow.   
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 05, 2016, 09:51:25 am
Fellas, Mr. DuBois generouly sent me some skins for Ms. Lauren's award bow (amoungst other goodies) got them yesterday so thought I would post the start of the skin job. Remember that I did not take any character out the bow's limbs, just went real careful and think it will look real good when done. The skin would have covered the entire bow but I left about 6" on each end so that I can put a raw-hide wrap (decoration) on @ to match the grip and then a touch of paint on the flipped tips.
    Anyway, thanks so much Mr. BuBois.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 05, 2016, 09:58:24 am
Sidmand, this aint a race bud, as long as your having some fun and are still enthused it's all good....and I sure hope you are having fun doing this.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 05, 2016, 10:00:37 am
Wow Rich she is gonna love it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 05, 2016, 10:02:02 am
Excellent explanation Rich. Using close to the same method and say working on a bow I want to come out 50#@28, once I reach my desired weight @ say 24 or 25", I then begin finish sanding my bow front, back, and sides, getting rid of unwanted tool marks, rounding off all corners. I'm basically finishing the bow except for what little scraping and sanding may be remaining on the belly to achieve my final desired weight. I haven't missed weight since utilizing this method,

Sidmand, don't fret the moon rings just stay as clean as you can.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 05, 2016, 10:09:58 am
I got the bark off of the back of the second bow last evening. That was slow going. I have to say this stave is about all I could have asked for -- clear, no twist to speak of (yet) and the natural reflex is already pretty. I lined it out for cutting today, and I'm just going to go slow with it, because really, it just seems like wants to be a bow all by itself. I just gotta keep from interfering with it.

Last night:
(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowB2.jpg)
Bark scraped off:
(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowB3.jpg)

Natural reflex:
(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowB4.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 05, 2016, 10:13:00 am
Excellent explanation Rich. Using close to the same method and say working on a bow I want to come out 50#@28, once I reach my desired weight @ say 24 or 25", I then begin finish sanding my bow front, back, and sides, getting rid of unwanted tool marks, rounding off all corners. I'm basically finishing the bow except for what little scraping and sanding may be remaining on the belly to achieve my final desired weight. I haven't missed weight since utilizing this method,

I like that Fred. I have a habit of getting too close and then being under weight after finishing.

Glad I could be a part of it half eye, thanks.

What is that wood Plan B?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 05, 2016, 10:24:07 am
Plan B, how seasoned is that stave?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 05, 2016, 10:41:06 am
Fred, it was the wany edge of a black birch board cut last summer, then stripped off @ 1-1/4" thick and stored in a shed for a couple months, then brought indoors in the house for 3 months. I sawed it closer to profile couple days ago, and I checked it yesterday after striping the bark off and it was 1159 grams. Today, just now weighing it, it's still 1159 grams.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 05, 2016, 10:49:46 am
Mr.B
    That right there got "eastern Woodland" wrote all over it, cant wait to see what ya got cookin 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on February 05, 2016, 10:59:01 am
Sidmand, this aint a race bud, as long as your having some fun and are still enthused it's all good....and I sure hope you are having fun doing this.
rich

Yes, always fun, thank you.  Bow making is my escape - it's cathartic.  I have 6 kids at home right now, and they are very active and a lot of fun.  But, sometimes we all need a break and a little quiet time - that comes around noonish on the weekends, when the smallest of the thundering herd take naps, and the rest are sent to their rooms for some R&R.  That's when the bow making happens. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 05, 2016, 11:46:04 am
Rich, I already trimmed it some a few minutes ago before I read your post -- I went 2" wide from fades straight to 16" from the tips, then tapered to 1/2" tips. So I couldn't back up to a straight end profile for an eastern woodlands bow (as I understand it).

Overall length is 68+ right now. I was feeling kinda cautious since the last bow was 1-5/8 black birch and didn't think I could make weight without straining. It was down to 60" piked and heat treated, etc. Still couldn't do it.

This one I was thinking the design would be: limbs are straight for 18" out, then taper for 16" -- sorta between flatbow and pyramid. And maybe not fool with anything as far as steaming or heat bending or treating, and just let it be what it is because of that clean reflex already there. I don't know -- I guess it'll uhhhh "speak to me" as I go along about that.

Anyway, I could leave it 2" straight from near the fades. But what you suggested is still tempting, and I could cut the straight section down in approaching the fades to give it a more blade like shape like the Sudbury bow. Willie was kind enough to send pics of that, and it's something I really want to do. But I'm a little worried about strain in the waisted section with black birch, as stiff as it is (compared to the ash of the Sudbury). And I wouldn't know how to tiller it there.

Maybe I should wait for that, and get this bow done to have a trade bow I like, and then try that one -- you know, Plan C? :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 05, 2016, 11:47:55 am
David:
Listen to half eye :) That is good advice.
And I don't know what tillering setup you have but if you're up close to the bow when you're pulling the string it can be difficult to see how it bends. See if someone can snap a picture while you're pulling the string it that you can look at , it really helped me to get some perspective.

I find standing near a big mirror or other reflective surface allows you to flex the bow and look at it at the same time, but use an arrow clearly marked with the pull-distance so you do not over-bend the bow. Alternatively video yourself pulling it from the side (like with an ipad or smart-phone) - the small screen really shows up the tiller
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 05, 2016, 12:14:12 pm
Mr B,
     Man ya got a plan....I'd stick with it sir. Hey I'm old and stuck on Eastern NA bows so ya know what they say.....they all look a like to me >:D >:D >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 05, 2016, 12:45:13 pm
I think I'll taper above the fades in just a leetle.........

Next one EWB for sure!

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 05, 2016, 01:34:01 pm
Started working on getting limbs on the vine maple floor tillered better. While working on the big whoopty do I opened up an unseen nasty knot.  Soaked it with super glue and guess I will just have to leave that area stiff. Unless you guys have any better ideas on how to hande it.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160205_114703850.jpg)(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160205_114711873.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: burchett.donald on February 05, 2016, 01:35:03 pm
Rich,
         That's some "half eye" work on that quiver...Creative work and accurate paintings! Looks like that was found 300 yrs. ago in an Ojibwa camp...It's my understanding that the big underwater cat protected the copper in your lake around Michigan ;)
                                                                                             Nice work bud, Don
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 05, 2016, 01:42:52 pm
Dubois:
With the lilac get it down to when you're gonna put it on the tillering tree. I had to steam the whole limb for about 45-60 to get results.  Also what I noticed is that even though I'd steamed it for so long it was still pretty stiff almost like I had not steamed it at all. When I steamed some red oak it got soft but not this one. Part of my mistake was I left it to thick and that was about 1/2" thick.
Good luck sir!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 05, 2016, 02:01:10 pm
turtle, did you dig all of the rot out before applying the sg? If you did you should be fine. Otherwise I'd drill the decay out, clean around it and then build it up with glue and sawdust.

I'm amazed at how well all of you are doing so far. This may danged near the best bow trade I've ever witnessed. Thanks to all of you for the great participation. You guys all are chipping in to answer every question presented and sharing knowledge that we're all learning from.

I'd at this time like to give a special "Thank You" to Mr. Rich Rouseau (half eye). Your involvement, knowledge, and sharing has been an inspiration to me and all of us here on this trade. This wouldn't have been possible without your generous giving help.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 05, 2016, 02:25:08 pm
Damned Fred....now ya got me all kinda red here.....I agree on the "best" trade comment. I believe that with everybody sharing these are gonna be real kick-butt bows and some good memories as well.

Mr. Burchett,  you must have been researchin there ya sneaky little devil....cause your spot on the "underwater panther" thing.

rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 05, 2016, 02:31:12 pm
turtle, did you dig all of the rot out before applying the sg? If you did you should be fine. Otherwise I'd drill the decay out, clean around it and then build it up with glue and sawdust.

It wasn't rotten. Just slightly soft around the edges.  But the more wood I remove from the belly the bigger it gets.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 05, 2016, 02:37:41 pm
Steve, my guess? is that you should still be okay. You might want to ask others that you know who've
built more than I have. I've only had a couple that were left in the working part of the limb and they were both osage.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 05, 2016, 04:25:21 pm
Three cheers for the red guy in green!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 05, 2016, 04:28:20 pm
This is the shape it's gonna be, and now I'm quittin' for the day before I floor tiller it too far....

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowB6.jpg)

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowB5.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 05, 2016, 05:04:41 pm
Plan B, love that profile. That should be a shooter.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 05, 2016, 06:05:30 pm
Well after several hours studying that bad spot I decided that even leaving it stiff that I still needed to remove more wood. Low and behold the spot started getting smaller. Maybe it will dissappear before I'm done.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160205_173947813.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 05, 2016, 06:16:45 pm
PlanB, that stave is starting to look like a bow.

Turtle, I think you are going to be good with that knot.  That is good news it is disappearing on you.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 05, 2016, 06:21:35 pm
Man Turtle you must be one clean living dude >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 05, 2016, 06:58:11 pm
 ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 05, 2016, 07:04:31 pm
Thanks Fred, Swampman. :)

Turtle, that's looking promising.....really glad to see it!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 05, 2016, 07:14:24 pm
I started a fire in my wood stove and am waiting for my shop to warm up.  I will be doing some scraping soon. :laugh: :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 05, 2016, 07:32:52 pm
I went back to where I saw the osage the other day and found an offering from the tree. It was a standing dead trunk. The usable section was only 5' long and after splitting it might make a better set of billets, but any osage is good osage in this neck of the woods. This is a first for me but I seldom split osage. There were thorns inside the stave. Check it out.
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/100_2794_zpsduqwwmpc.jpg)

(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/100_2796_zpshviclbpz.jpg) 

Wasn't expecting that. I thought they were nails at first. I was quite relieved to say the least.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 05, 2016, 09:34:55 pm
Hatchet work is done.  Got the profile rough cut, but still need to get it clean up to the layout lines and work around the knots.  Its going to need some heat straightening, the tips are out of alignment about 2 inches.

I laid out the handle symmetrically from the bow centerline, and it is still not completely roughed out, but I am not liking the overall look of the handle and fades.  I think I will bypass my handle layout lines to get it more uniform.  I also plan to heat bend the bow in the handle area to get the tips closer in alignment.

What do you guys think?  Am I going the right direction with the handle?

Michael
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 05, 2016, 09:43:07 pm
Loope, it looks like if you moved the lower limb ( the one on the floor in the pic) right at the bend just below the grip hump looks like the tips would line up center of the grip.

I am not there to touch so cant be sure about that but ya could check it with your string. It sure is looking good sir....you must have the patience of Job 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 05, 2016, 09:46:42 pm
Got some more work done today... Not much, but I'm in no hurry. Cut the belly down some more, and smoothed the sides out from the bandsaw cut. One limb is a little bit stiffer then the other.... and they are both still pretty stiff.

I also re built my tillering tree. I've had the pulleys for a while, but just got around to putting it together.

(http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l62/krzyjon123/Mobile%20Uploads/20160205_202227_zpsq8vbgzfs.jpg) (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/krzyjon123/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160205_202227_zpsq8vbgzfs.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 05, 2016, 09:51:56 pm
Looking good David. Just keep nibbling away at her and it will come around for ya. Doesn't take much ironwood to make weight does it? >:D >:D >:D  Now I'm bein a smart-butt
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 05, 2016, 10:02:09 pm
Thanks Rich,

I checked it with a string from tip-to-tip and it looks like a couple inches off the centerline, maybe slightly more.  I had been wondering about bending it right where you mentioned, sounds like that is what I should try.

I'm going to thin the limbs somewhat this weekend, and then be ready to try straightening somewhat.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 05, 2016, 10:07:56 pm
That is the smart thing to do sir. You may also wish to think about single side string knocks if ya get her real close but she just wont give ya the rest ......you would be surprised how much putting them on opposite side will move a string ....just something to put in your pocket in case she gets a wee bit snippy >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 05, 2016, 10:16:29 pm
Looking good David. Just keep nibbling away at her and it will come around for ya. Doesn't take much ironwood to make weight does it? >:D >:D >:D  Now I'm bein a smart-butt
rich
Nope, it doesn't! I've never heard of this wood... ever... And it just keeps impressing me.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 05, 2016, 10:43:27 pm
Dakota, that's pretty interesting-- I wonder if two trunks grew together?
Loope that's a wild stave alright!
David, you're well on your way. Bet you're excited!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 05, 2016, 11:04:55 pm
David it's starting to look real good! Slow and steady take your time and keep those ?'s and pics coming.

Loope interesting stave, right up my alley, makes you want to set back and scratch your head

DK I've never seen anything like that, I thought barb wire when I first seen it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 05, 2016, 11:32:54 pm
Loope: You don't learn anything if you don't get challenged, that's a great stave for that!

David:You did the right thing setting up that tillering tree, so much easier tillering that way.

PlanB: Seriously, two bows almost done? Keep 'em coming Mr they look great!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 06, 2016, 12:02:01 am
Well I got my BL to full draw tonight and it is right on track for goal weight.  What do you all think of the tiller?

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/131DFE2E-F061-46C7-ADA8-917E133959B6_zpsayfv5e6x.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/131DFE2E-F061-46C7-ADA8-917E133959B6_zpsayfv5e6x.jpg.html)

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/331FB5FC-78BB-43D1-91D3-D0CC6D26806D_zpsafml1a2a.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/331FB5FC-78BB-43D1-91D3-D0CC6D26806D_zpsafml1a2a.jpg.html)

I shot a few arrows and I was very pleased with the result.

Here are a few more pictures.

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/F555F5AF-32DC-49F3-AC1A-5646B382F165_zpsrtkgrnd8.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/F555F5AF-32DC-49F3-AC1A-5646B382F165_zpsrtkgrnd8.jpg.html)

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/FAC6F6F0-BD70-4FF2-82BF-39025B6A20CD_zpsdznq3ujs.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/FAC6F6F0-BD70-4FF2-82BF-39025B6A20CD_zpsdznq3ujs.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 06, 2016, 12:40:23 am
Looks good man....in your hand I think the top limb needs a little work from midlimb to about 5 to 6"  just below the tip.  I think the bottom limb looks perfect...nice graceful arc.  What's it look like unbraced?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 06, 2016, 06:23:50 am
Swamman   Lookin good.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 06, 2016, 07:20:01 am
Looks good man....in your hand I think the top limb needs a little work from midlimb to about 5 to 6"  just below the tip.  I think the bottom limb looks perfect...nice graceful arc.  What's it look like unbraced?

1+

But it is hard to be sure since I aint there...come to think of it, even when I am "there" I aint always real sure  :-\

DK- I've seen a few like that. It's almost like the osage grows n on itself. Those are some nice big ones!

Davd E. Nice job all around buddy!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 06, 2016, 07:40:13 am
Looks good man....in your hand I think the top limb needs a little work from midlimb to about 5 to 6"  just below the tip.  I think the bottom limb looks perfect...nice graceful arc.  What's it look like unbraced?

Ajooter, the top limb in the picture with me has been causing issues for me all along. That limb started out with 3 inches of reflex and the lower limb had a bit of deflex.  I have had to rely on my tillering gizmo on this bow from the start.  My tillering gizmo tells me the arc is the same in both limbs but when I look at it in the picture, I am not sure.  When unbraced, the bow is almost straight with the bottom limb still showing the original deflex.  The top limb is showing a bit of set if I consider the reflex it had. 

I may toast the belly and adjust the tiller after that.  I have never had anything bad happen from toasting a belly. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 06, 2016, 07:41:35 am
Woke up with "bow brain"

Last night I decided I needed another stave in this so dug out an osage and chased a ring. Got some pretty little leopard spots in it!

Lilac on hot stove after olive oiling and still in clamps now. It never wanted to give way easily like you said Janderson. Not sure I can pull this off just to get it in line??
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 06, 2016, 07:43:45 am
#2
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 06, 2016, 08:17:37 am
Mr. DuBois, you are an animal with that stave sir 8) Got some feedback on that sinew deal if ya get a chance to call.

Swampman,  I think your tiller is good, while it might use a very small amount of tweeking, it is close enough to shoot forever. A lot of my staves are pretty knarly and sometimes you can go nuts trying for perfection. Take what the wood will give.
    I am pretty sure you are going to work the mentioned area though ::), just trying to say that would be good, but if it just wont seem to come around like you want.....then leave it be, it really is not that far out.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 06, 2016, 08:35:04 am
Swampman I don't trust photos much when it comes to small differences. I think you know better holding it in your hands, looking at it all over, knowing its history, and irregularities, and shooting the thing.

If the wood was perfect, and identical limb to limb, the angle of the camera perfect, the camera itself not suffering from spherical aberration, barrel distortion, image centered, the lighting perfect, your hand in the exact centers of pressure at the bow and string, you didn't favor a positive tiller, any heat treatments were perfectly symmetrical, etc,.etc. then maybe the limbs would be mirror images of each other and bend at the exact same rates, and that would even show up in a photo.

And I also believe that what looks like perfect even tiller in a photo, might not shoot as well as it could in real life, or even look that way to a real observer, or in a mirror. This is all not to say not to use every tool you want to get a bow looking right, but when it comes right down to it, I would trust your instincts and your eyes and hands, because I can promise you from experience, it's possible to tiller something that shoots good and feels good to death by trying to follow a single photo. Not trying to argue anything at all here, but just trying to encourage with a plug for instinct and feel.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 06, 2016, 08:52:54 am
Fellas,
    I'm about ready to wrap up the award bow for Lauren. I would like everybodys opinion about the grip. What I mean is that she likes pink and blue so I wanted the grip pink and the tips blue. I knew that a hot pink would show through the rawhide and this is what it looks like now. Do you think I should leave this look or repaint over the raw-hide?   Also what is the general feeling on the tips as to look and color?
    Thanks fellas, appreciate your time and I feel a bunch of heads is better than one.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 06, 2016, 09:02:35 am
Swampman, that tiller looks real close. Is the top limb the one on the right in the top pic? It's hard to tell without seeing unbraced but it looks to me like that limb is stiff right out of the fade.

The more I look at it the better it looks. It doesn't need much to be damned near perfect.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on February 06, 2016, 09:48:51 am
Swamp, the tiller looks pretty darn good to me.

Dubois, that's one snakes stave! I can't wait to see it pulling back.

Rich, the award bow turned out sweet! Great work bud!

I'll be working on the ironwood bow later today, and will have a progress pic or 2.

Tattoo Dave
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 06, 2016, 09:50:51 am
Hey guys, If any of you need whitetail back strap sinew I have 7 oz left that I'm going to send out for $10 an oz donation. The funds will be used to offset the shipping cost for the 2 members we have that will be shipping bows over the big pond. jandersson took the first 3 oz.

And my email server is down for the weekend so PM's only until sometime Monday.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on February 06, 2016, 10:34:50 am
Fred, I'll mail out a 10$ donation for the shipping, but I don't need any sinew. Send the sinew to someone who needs it, or maybe someone who has never used it before.

Tattoo Dave
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 06, 2016, 10:42:11 am
Rich, bow looks great. Fred pm me when moneys r needed for over sea's shipping. And everyone else, everything looks great.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 06, 2016, 10:49:00 am
Dave, Thanks man....for everything !!!!

Stix, Thank you also for your contribution as well.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: burchett.donald on February 06, 2016, 11:09:04 am
 Rich,
          Very nice looking award bow, especially like the rawhide wrap on the skins near the tip...Lauren should be very happy...
                                                                                                                                           Don
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 06, 2016, 11:15:17 am
Thanks fellas, I'll get the bow sealed up and hope for the best.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 06, 2016, 11:42:19 am
Rich....Award bow looks great to me.

Fred.... I'll chip in for shipping, just tell me when and where. I dont want anything in exchange.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 06, 2016, 12:55:22 pm
Man - I can't keep up with this thread!  Bows are already tillered out and ready for finish, more staves being dug out and split - lots going on!!  Bows are looking great. 

I worked a little bit this morning on my backup.  I got the lams ground down and the core lam tapered.  Made some posts to put in some deflex and reflex during glue up.  Clamped it down for a dry run.

Before I add glue and clamp it back down any suggestions?  Center post is 3", mid-limb is 2" and the end posts are 4 1/2".

Thanks...Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 06, 2016, 12:56:14 pm
Rich that bow is awesome I'm sure she is going to shoot the fire out of it. She has been down here making more strings. I ask Lauren what leanth are you making she said a 12 stran 72" I said ok I guess we will have to make a bow to fit it some time. What a enjoyment!! I don't care if she makes 100 as long as there shorter than 72"lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 06, 2016, 01:09:34 pm
MW, That looks pretty sweet.....when I was looking into Asiatic bows there a couple of Chineese Infantry bows that were that shape, allways thought they were pretty darned cool.

Gutshot, her string is about 48-50 inch with some left over >:D I sure hope the guess on the colors will suit her.

Turtle, thanks man, always like to get a youngster excited. One of the joys to an old man.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: dylanholderman on February 06, 2016, 01:48:26 pm
i'm a little worried about pushing my osage stave out to the draw length i need sense its so short :( so i decided to dig out another stave from my stash ;D

found a branch of Japanese yew that is 63in long.
 (http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w411/dylanholderman/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/5030829A-B4AA-42F7-B30F-6E9DF3481CA1.jpg) (http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/dylanholderman/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/5030829A-B4AA-42F7-B30F-6E9DF3481CA1.jpg.html)
(http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w411/dylanholderman/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/ADE412CA-5542-448E-82CD-3F1C6DA265C9.jpg) (http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/dylanholderman/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/ADE412CA-5542-448E-82CD-3F1C6DA265C9.jpg.html)

looks fine till you see the side profile :o
(http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w411/dylanholderman/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/9678D2DB-08F3-48EC-A9C2-F70431726A19.jpg) (http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/dylanholderman/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/9678D2DB-08F3-48EC-A9C2-F70431726A19.jpg.html)

so i'm going to build it backwards >:D got what is now going to be my back cleaned of all the chop marks and the profile roughed in. just need to find something back it now ;)
(http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w411/dylanholderman/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/E1411B52-7E08-4016-B14A-89C338C959D0.jpg) (http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/dylanholderman/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/E1411B52-7E08-4016-B14A-89C338C959D0.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 06, 2016, 03:56:50 pm
I got some help/advice from Hunterbob on this one. I used the grill heat the limb. I know what an idiot!lol. I didn't leave it in very long and it opened up a drying check. Bob said it would probably be ok. What do you guys think.  I really want to use this stave because it's absolutely beautiful with lots of character.  I'm not going to get to work much on the bows till Monday or Tuesday but I will get back at it as soon as I'm off and have no other obligations. Tanks Tim
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 06, 2016, 03:57:52 pm
Just one more!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 06, 2016, 04:09:27 pm
TimothyR,
      Hunterbob told ya straight sir.......doesn't look like the check runs off of the bow, a little CA glue and light clamp pressure.....should be good to go........oh ya stay from the open flames too >:D >:D

Ya had to know that was coming , right? 8)
rich
PS: You may want to hear from some of the Osage guys, looks like it got toasted all the way around and since I dont heat treat I got no idea about that issue....or even if it is an issue.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 06, 2016, 05:00:53 pm
David, mistake in my explanation. Don't rasp down to the yellow line, only to d and f.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 06, 2016, 05:08:52 pm
Thanks everyone for your comments on the tiller.  It was very helpful.

Fred, you have a sharp eye.  The top limb right out of the fade is where the bow bent the last so. Think that needs to come around a little more.  I am going to work on it a bit more and see if I can bring that around. 

Rich, that bow looks great.  I am no help with the color scheme though.  I am color blind.  I will probably start work on plan b soon.  I would like to have a couple options to choose from to send out.  Maybe I can have a few ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 06, 2016, 05:12:22 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/f6kust4.jpg?1)

Some people don't like using circles...but that's exactly what I was seeing when I did this.  I don't have rich's eye yet....mine art as "experienced ".  ;)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 06, 2016, 05:23:06 pm
Went to mother in laws today so found a way to the garage with the hatchet and stave  >:D I love her, hatchet that is.

Got my newest and now favorite osage pretty much to floor tiller and need to get one limb to match the other with some heat. Looking sorta eastern woodland like at 67"

Left a little extra on the end with a shaving coming off it just to have something to clamp on.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 06, 2016, 05:27:55 pm

Also got better result so far than I expected on the lilac with steam and clamping the heck out of it. Might work out after all.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 06, 2016, 06:00:53 pm
Got a couple ?s for the group.  When I cut this piece of hickory there were some small branches that I saw off and they left some small stubs.  There are spots where the branches project through the limbs.  These obviously arnt the same as a broken branch that the tree has grown around thus resulting in a hole.  I wanted to gently file them down on the back and maybe put a sinew patch over them in preperation for rawhide backing the bow.  Is this feasible?

Pic of stub left on back of bow
(http://i.imgur.com/7bvUtDu.jpg?1)
Also was wondering about the knots showing on the belly and if they would require any attention?  They are centered in the limb but seem like they may want to check in a perpendicular direction across the limb.  I could hollow them out and fill them with sawdust and glue.

Pic of stub on back and where it projects to belly
(http://i.imgur.com/95G6kf2.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/Kd4RlJd.jpg?1)

Thank you for your advice and opinions in advance.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 06, 2016, 06:08:48 pm
Ajooter,
    I believe that if you dress the stub down as smooth as you can get it (meaning no sharp edges) and soak both sides of it with CA it ought to be tough as nails. Your scraper should remove any CA staining as you finish the tiller, and of course the raw-hide will take care of the back
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 06, 2016, 06:13:07 pm
Ajooter - No experience with the "branches" on the back of the bow - but I would think smoothed down and rawhided backed would be ok.  I have never had problems with knots on the belly - usually shoot some super glue into them.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 06, 2016, 06:14:31 pm
Went ahead and glued and clamped it up.  We will see...... :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 06, 2016, 06:40:54 pm
Looking good Mitch. I seem to be able to only TRY to master one thing at a time and I'm not even comfortable with selffbows yet. If I make it another 5 years maybe I'll delve into more complicated matters.  :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 06, 2016, 07:35:35 pm
Thanks Ajooter for putting the circle on my tiller picture.  That helps me to see the top limb does need to bend a bit more near the fade.  I think the branches on the hickory will be no trouble for you.  Hickory is tough, especially if you are backing with rawhide.

Here is a picture of my bow unstrung after heat treating the belly.  You can tell which limb has natural reflex.

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/1594E4F5-B731-4348-BE5F-68976DF2C0AF_zpsxqzc0t7e.jpg) (http://s1061.photo-bucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/1594E4F5-B731-4348-BE5F-68976DF2C0AF_zpsxqzc0t7e.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 06, 2016, 08:21:48 pm
Guys this thread is killing it

67 pages
997 replies
14252 views

Keep up the good work

Fred Thanks for doing this

Rich thanks for all the good info

Everybody else I'm enjoying the pics, ?'s, comments. Keep posting.

I will have pics soon of the Osage Rich sent me. Worked all day on it and only got the handle and one limb done. its a tough one for me. Lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 06, 2016, 08:56:49 pm
Yeah, Rich is known for sending people tough stuff to work on  :o

I agree completely gutshot; this is awesome!!

MW; that is one sweet profile.

Swampman; I like it. You aint too far from me up here in the snow.

I wish I could contribute more knowledge but I can barely keep up with you guys as it is  :o :-[

Here's the lilac again.
She's coming around and might be damn close after #3 steam session.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 06, 2016, 09:42:29 pm
Guys, all your bows are looking great, awesome progress!  I didn't get any bow work done today, went to the farm today and then after work was done, went on an arrow hunt.  Came back with a couple dozen shoots to try making arrows, mostly rose shoots, but also some honeysuckle.  It was sure great weather to be outside today.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 06, 2016, 09:56:43 pm
Guys, all your bows are looking great, awesome progress!  I didn't get any bow work done today, went to the farm today and then after work was done, went on an arrow hunt.  Came back with a couple dozen shoots to try making arrows, mostly rose shoots, but also some honeysuckle.  It was sure great weather to be outside today.


Yeah I didn't get any bow eork done either. Spent the morning doing my taxes. Then I split firewood and cleaned up my shop. Was going to do some bow work after but couldnt get in the mood for some reason. But I dont have to go back to work untill Thursday so I should get some more done.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 06, 2016, 10:04:59 pm
Yeah, Rich is known for sending people tough stuff to work on  :o

DuBois, Rich didn't send a tough stave to work on I'm making it tough, I just hope I can make a bow out of it that somebody will be proud of.

If I'm not mistaking Fred might have posted we want everybody to make a bow that will make you cry to give it away. Or something like that. And that's my goal on here. Heck when I stuck a big splinter in my hand today I about cried. Heck is that what Fred was talking about. Lol
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 06, 2016, 10:36:25 pm
I've been following Rich's mantra on long string on the plan B black birch. It's helped break the bad habit I had of marking and working on both limbs at the same time. It's going better because of that. I don't even mark the softer limb anywhere, until the other tip is at the same height.

I'm tillering with the bow upside down this time, on the floor, on a pad, foot on the handle. There's a discount store long dressing mirror a couple feet away, propped up and horizontal on the floor, angled up. I don't have to keep going outdoors to the tiller tree on the shed -- there's a lot of ice out there now, and putting on a jacket and ice grippers between scrapes is just too slow.

I've found I can keep my thumb on the spring bow scale so that when the pointer comes up to the tiller weight I want to allow, I feel it hit, check the mirror for shape. It's pretty quick to do that, lower the string and scrape. Seems to be working anyway.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 07, 2016, 02:15:10 am
Hey Gutshot,
I was just takin a little inside jab at Rich. I'm sure the stave is awesome since it came from him. Call me a little perverse, but I kinda like it when a bow fights back and gets me a little. Seems like every bow I work on draws blood. Now if it was just another creature besides me that would be better  :-[

Mr. B; I must have missed that half eye pearl of wisdom n the midst of all this but I sure do like the idea. I have a mirror like that in the garage that will be coming inside soon  ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 07, 2016, 08:06:42 am
Hey, Dubois.

Before Rich's advice, I used to be focused on stopping hinges on either side and getting an even bend in the limb. Now I ignore the weaker limb until tips bend to even level. And keep checking that all the way through.

I used to worry about any soft spot in the weaker limb not being reduced around right away. But you are still taking pressure off of it by reducing the stronger limb, and you are evening out that one in the process. Once tips are even, then you can go back and hit the other limb. Its hinge won't be as bad, and you won't take as much off. That's good because if you did it earlier when it was exaggerated, you might take too much off in evening it, and now that limb would be even weaker than the other. This over-scraping can exaggerate near the end of the tillering process. At least that's how I see it now.

re. mirror on floor tillering:

As a pad on the floor I'm using a  book that's the same size and exactly centered under the handle. I needed that because the reflex makes the tips hit the floor. Definitely makes a difference that everything is centered (pad, foot, scale hook). You can see diff. in the mirror image bend shape when you pull.  I'm seeing more this way than I did with a pulley tiller tree outside. Mirror is about 4 feet from the bow.

It's got me thinking about a more permanent holder with a plywood base and built in pad and handle stop, and a guard above the limbs. Maybe something that folds up with hinges. And a little fold out leg for the separate mirror that sets it at the right angle. The rig could fold up and be put away.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 07, 2016, 09:46:06 am
Plan B and the whole group......
      One of the reasons I said this was the best trade ever is because of the way Fred went about it, and the way this whole group responded to that. With everybody actively participating and throwing ideas "out-there" then hopefully we all get to take the bits and pieces of shared knowledge and then develop some techniques that make sense to us. Then that is the best thing that can come out of the entire deal.
    The take-away here (in my opinion anyway) everybody is sharing, using inf to tweek their personal take on it and then we all get to make better bows and feel comfortable at the same time.

    I have strange ways of doing things, but they make sense to me. I aint no bow genius so dont take what I say as some kind of thing needs wrote in stone, but rather hear what I throw out there and use it, forget it, or change it to suit your style and vision. Same goes to any of you fellas.....if ya got something works for you then please share it.  Shared knowledge  will make us all better at this crazy sport.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 07, 2016, 09:48:45 am
?? for you all on lilac.

I have the string coming over the arrow pass area where I want it and am happy I ever got it there . There is an inch or so to cut off each end still.
But
In this side profile you may be able to see, there is a slight deflex in the fades and both limbs do a little wombly thing and then deflex toward the tips. It is all natural and the same on both, and I am tempted to leave it alone, expecially since the knot holes on one end would be right where I would need to heat to bend in reflex.

Are there any bows with this profile intentionally? How do they perform and what do you think on this?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 07, 2016, 09:52:14 am
I would tiller as is man!! Both tips have that same slight reflex and then flatten out.  Should make a nice character piece.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 07, 2016, 10:02:34 am
Hey DuBois -

Is the stave in your pic belly up or belly down? I am assuming belly down  :laugh:   Even with the slight deflex at the end, the tips seem to be in front of the handle a bit to me.  The tips will be stiff anyway so.....  I would tiller it the way it is.

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 07, 2016, 10:04:37 am
One observation.
I have had a few lilac sticks that seem very dense like osage and they have all been small diameter. This one is from an older bush that was large for lilac and it has very little crown.

It does not seem as dense to me and I wonder if lilac changes as it get nearer to end of life?

It is healthy wood but feels lighter; somewhere between ERC and osage.

I'm gonna keep track of this for future reference.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 07, 2016, 10:05:29 am
Belly down Mitch.
Ok, 2 for, less work, I will go for it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 07, 2016, 10:09:22 am
I'm with Ajooter and Mr. MW.....PICK THAT PEACH !!!!!

The only thing I could see as a possiblity is to maybe heat a slight sharp reflex in the center like the precursor of a gull-wing......nowhere near what ya did on your last osage >:D >:D  and for what it's worth a lot of cultures in the arctic and sub-arctic regions all around the earth used forms of deflexed tips.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 07, 2016, 10:31:58 am
Dubois, I am with everyone else so far, tiller it as is.  Should make for an interesting bow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 07, 2016, 10:49:45 am
I like Rich's added reflex at handle.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 07, 2016, 11:00:10 am
One of the things I like about branch bows is the character. I'd run with it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 07, 2016, 01:48:28 pm
Dubois.....Go with it as is. Just remember that the deflexed tips will make it stack at a shorter draw than if they were straight.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 07, 2016, 02:27:46 pm
hey guys,
     here is a teaser pic of the 2 Penobscot trade bows. Dont want to say too much but the bottom bow is in the pics as a comparison and is about 45#....guess ya just got to speculate as to what the other 2 are gonna be.....my bad >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: willie on February 07, 2016, 02:29:50 pm
Quote
Once tips are even, then you can go back and hit the other limb. Its hinge won't be as bad, and you won't take as much off

I like your approach to that, PB

Btw. seeing the bend for what it is, can be tricky sometimes. I moved my tiller tree because I discovered my judgement was better from a greater viewing distance.....
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 07, 2016, 03:14:18 pm
So cool, Rich!

Willie, not mine, got that from Mr. half eye.
re. close mirror I'm thinking now it is best for before full brace, and my tree on the shed will be better after. Been going slow on this one so, not even to full brace yet.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 07, 2016, 03:58:05 pm
Rich, they are looking sweet.  The top one looks like it is going to be a pretty stout bow. You are very ambitious.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 07, 2016, 04:17:19 pm
Very nice looking bows Rich - I am sure everyone would love to shoot em!  You are a bow building machine  :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 07, 2016, 04:36:24 pm
Everybody seems to be coming along great!  I'm going to need to make another adjustment at the handle now that I've thinned the tips.  I got the top nock almost completed.  I filed and sanded down the stubs on the back. And....I got my rawhide.  I will hopefully be sending everyone's rawhide out monday.  This bow is going to have a ltitle bit of love from a lot of the fellow traders  ;).
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 07, 2016, 04:39:28 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/Bk8AluP.jpg?2)(http://i.imgur.com/etjuzRs.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/1yAcHS9.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/JUogb9d.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/Gm1Tr1h.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/1c2o8C7.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 07, 2016, 05:01:34 pm
Damned Ajooter, tips that good lookin got to be illegal.....and I mean class A felony type illegal 8) 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 07, 2016, 05:12:20 pm
+1
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 07, 2016, 05:33:49 pm
Thanks fellas....ALL your bows are lookin great rich...especially that award bow!

Can't wait to see how plan b comes out!  After the steam correction tonight I'm gonna work on my plan b a little.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 07, 2016, 05:50:20 pm
Ajooter, man I got to ask....with a bow that good lookin how come ya plannin a "B" model?
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 07, 2016, 06:12:30 pm
Just cause I wanna keep working on a bow while plan a is recovering from her handle tweak.  And because I haven't watched an entire football game yet this year and would rather work on a bow!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 07, 2016, 06:14:39 pm
I coated the back of the bow pretty liberally with elmers after I first cut it....what's the best way to get it off?  I will be putting a sizing coat underneath the rawhide but wanted to start fresh since the handle steaming is removing a little of the glue in patches.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 07, 2016, 06:17:28 pm
Wish i was doin as good as everyone else on here. Had to walk away today, just cant get top limb to catch up. Still got plan 2 and C to play with😄 great job guys.👍🏹
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 07, 2016, 06:21:47 pm
If it was me, I would "feather-edge" any dry spots, then go over the whole back with a medium grit paper (by hand w/ little pressure). That gives the "primer" some "tooth" to give even and excellent adhesion.
rich

Stix....maybe you could post up a pic or two and I'd bet somebody could get ya on the right track sir. Seems like we got a whole bunch of talented guys floatin around.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 07, 2016, 06:32:18 pm
ok here is part of plan B its rough and crud also its only handle and 1 limb.

I dropped 6 rings from back of handle to limb then back up 6 rings for natural tip overlays still needs cleaned up alot

it should be center shot with the s type handle

Im looking at next saturday before i have this thing ready for long string 

Also plan A is ready for tiller but im waiting on plan B so i can do all my tillering at one time
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 07, 2016, 06:37:40 pm
stixs dont worry you will do fine and your as good as anybody on here. Be patient

Ajooter those are sick overlays

Rich i dont know nothing about that bow your making besides its very different and I would like to shoot it.. Whats the little bow on top for

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 07, 2016, 06:47:26 pm
Gutshot, thats one funky stik, love the self tip build up  idea. I'll get some pics up tomorrow. Ajooter, sweet overlays.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 07, 2016, 06:51:51 pm
Mr. Gutshot,
     That there bow is looking real sweet, and man you been puttin in the work on that baby.
Them double bows are from the Penobscot Native American up in the North East. Always fascinated me so thought I would build some.....did a post on 'em....and Don Burchett has been testing one for a little bit now.....he has a post also. I guess they are real fast arrow speed for whatever draw weight they are pulling.
   I got some museum pictures if ya want to see one of the originals
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 07, 2016, 06:55:10 pm
Mr. Gutshot,
     That there bow is looking real sweet, and man you been puttin in the work on that baby.
Them double bows are from the Penobscot Native American up in the North East. Always fascinated me so thought I would build some.....did a post on 'em....and Don Burchett has been testing one for a little bit now.....he has a post also. I guess they are real fast arrow speed for whatever draw weight they are pulling.
   I got some museum pictures if ya want to see one of the originals
rich

thats cool, it looks like it would shoot hard
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 07, 2016, 07:34:57 pm
Those tips are looking sweet ajooter - and the back is is looking nice too, that knot looks fine.  I just usually remove varnish, paint, glue, etc. carefully with a scraper and course (80 grit or so) paper.

Gutshot - that osage is coming along real nice - looking forward to the progress.  You have a bunch of shavings and dust there on the floor!!!  ;D

I worked on my hackberry a bit this afternoon - pictures here in a bit.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 07, 2016, 07:50:08 pm
Gutshot, that is really nice!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 07, 2016, 10:56:14 pm
Began tillering the hackberry - taking it slow and steady.  Just have a long string on and only pulling it to 11" at 40#.  Just starting to bend.

Snapped a pic of side profile before starting to compare to as I tiller it out.  Drew a black line on the board across the top of the limbs - will be able to determine when and where any set begins.

1st pic - before starting to tiller.
2nd pic - pulling with the long string to 11" or so.
3rd pic - current profile pic.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 08, 2016, 04:30:40 am
Looking good Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 08, 2016, 07:11:03 am
Nothin wrong there.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 08, 2016, 07:23:17 am
I like the dry erase board....that's a great idea!  Lookin really good too!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 08, 2016, 07:24:08 am
I like the dry erase board....that's a great idea!  Lookin really good too!

I like the dry erase board too.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 08, 2016, 08:37:33 am
I'm gonna me too that.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 08, 2016, 09:43:32 am
ME TOO TWO!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 08, 2016, 10:14:05 am
You guys bows are looking great, I'm going to have to get on the ball.

Rich, those bows intrigue me. I'm going to have to study that design. It would feel awkward for me to use as a hunting bow but maybe a guy would get used to it.

I'm going to have to cut down some of the hackberry out here this year and start seasoning some staves.

Mitch, how wide did you leave yours?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 08, 2016, 11:38:06 am
Great idea on the board buddy!
At first I said "what the %6&% is on the back of that bow?"

Hey Rich, are those tough to get braced? I'd probably hurt myself  :'(

Fred, did I win the first drawing??? Oh, wait, I aint in it am I  ;) ;)

But seriously, when is the first prize drawing man?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 08, 2016, 12:20:36 pm
Fred would it be to much trouble to ask of you to repost a list of all the guys that's in the trade. I have looked for it but just can't find it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 08, 2016, 12:27:05 pm
Fred would it be to much trouble to ask of you to repost a list of all the guys that's in the trade. I have looked for it but just can't find it.
Gutshot, go back to the very first page. The list is there. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 08, 2016, 12:32:28 pm
I had removed it because I felt it was taking up too much room.  :-[
Just placed it up again with the rules on the front page.

Due to lack of participation by a few members I am shuffling some names around today. For the few of you that are well along with your builds please don't worry. You'll be building for someone else but with similar specs and I will PM you shortly.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 08, 2016, 12:35:44 pm
Mitch, add me to the list of admirers as well

Gutshot, left ya a phone message buddy

DuBois, no they are not too bad at all...just different from my usual push-pull.

Dont know Fred, about the hunting, I'll have to get that out when I can get back into the woods

Hey David, how the heck is your bow coming along....with the start you got thought we be seeing a little more of her.....your just teasing aint ya?
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on February 08, 2016, 12:42:38 pm
got my ring(s) chased on the stave, and got it laid out with pencil.  Then, I changed my mind on the layout, and I'm going to go a different route, but I didn't draw it up yet.  I will do that tonight.  Here pics of the ring chasing.  I said rings above cause this stave was covered up in those super duper thin "lunar rings" or whatever they are called.  I simply couldn't get down to one of them, but the back is super clean and those super thin rings won't be a problem at all, at least I don't think they will. 

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on February 08, 2016, 12:47:23 pm
that stave was whispering "make me a mollegabet", then once I got the back chased down and the layout drawn on it, the stave screamed "NO, WAIT, MAKE ME INTO A BENDY HANDLE BOW WITH SCALLOPED EDGES!!"  I couldn't turn that down, no sir.  So, that's what she is going to be.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 08, 2016, 01:11:54 pm
"NO, WAIT, MAKE ME INTO A BENDY HANDLE BOW WITH SCALLOPED EDGES!!"

That will be cool Sidmand.  I'll look forward to seeing that.

I've had my hickory stave in the hot box for a week and have been weighing it every day.  She's still loosing weight so I band sawed the limbs a bit thinner to where I can start floor tillering and put her back in the hot box.  That stave had more moisture than I realized......thank goodness for a hot box.

The steam bending at the handle has slowly returned to it's "crook" so I'll have to re-steam it in a few days.  I want to see how much more it drops in weight over the next couple of days.......patience......patience.  I'm getting behind some of you speed demons ;-)  BUT, got to get hickory dry!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 08, 2016, 01:15:06 pm
Very cool Sidmand,

Drewster, Youll whip that hick into shape sir......make it scream for it's momma >:D
rich

Fred, If you need anything on the reshuffle please advise sir.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 08, 2016, 02:05:57 pm
Drewster your not that far behind your just making sure all is done correctly. I'm sure thAt stave will be a sweet bow when it's said and done
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: paulsemp on February 08, 2016, 02:09:26 pm
I had removed it because I felt it was taking up too much room.  :-[
Just placed it up again with the rules on the front page.

Due to lack of participation by a few members I am shuffling some names around today. For the few of you that are well along with your builds please don't worry. You'll be building for someone else but with similar specs and I will PM you shortly.



I have no dog in this fight but I am curious. Guys are already getting kicked out?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 08, 2016, 02:20:09 pm
Nobody's getting kicked out that I know of
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jeffp51 on February 08, 2016, 03:05:07 pm
I have not posted a lot, but I have been following closely and working on bows where I can.  I keep thinking I just need to retire so I can devote myself full time to my hobbies. . .

I am also finishing up a couple of Christmas bows for two of my sons.  I would be done already, but one of the staves broke during tillering.   I got his plan B is tillered  on Saturday, though, so some finish work and I will be able to really concentrate on this one.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 08, 2016, 03:05:47 pm
You are right Rich   ::) Nobody's been booted. I don't intend to.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: paulsemp on February 08, 2016, 03:10:45 pm
Thanks for the quick response. Like I said none of my business and I wish this trade nothing but the best and was hoping you guys did not have drama right off the bat
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 08, 2016, 03:40:46 pm
Hey David, how the heck is your bow coming along....with the start you got thought we be seeing a little more of her.....your just teasing aint ya?
rich
Haven't got anything else done. I have been busy with other stuff...

:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 08, 2016, 03:44:22 pm
Just pullin yer chain David >:D >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 08, 2016, 04:06:11 pm
David E. Other stuff meaning school?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 08, 2016, 04:11:56 pm
Not on the weekend... lol.
I have been building beehives for this spring. Had to get them all painted.... During the week I am doing school though.

That stave was sittin' there the whole time...   Right in the corner of my eye. Hahaha.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 08, 2016, 06:07:13 pm
Thanks for the kind comments gents.   The marker board was rescued from the trash after a bunch were replaced with "smart boards" at a school. 

Fred - the hackberry I am working on I left a full 2" wide at the fades.  I will most likely end up narrowing it a bit as I continue to tiller, but I wanted enough wood to make weight.

Another hackberry I made a while back (pyramid) I ended up about 1 3/4" wide tapered straight to 1/2" tips to make 50# at 28".  Hackberry is good bow wood, but must be made wider than osage.

Sidmand - you got to love bendy handle osage bow!!  Looking forward to seeing it take shape.

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 08, 2016, 06:49:10 pm
Two heat sessions has my reflex evened up as good as I think I can get it and my tips in line. Got my tips moving about 6 inches so hopefully I can get them moving far enough tomorrow to get her to low brace. Still trying to decide if I want to heat treat it or not as I have read mixed reviews on heat treating vine maple. Will wait untill I get it to full brace to decide.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160208_180942276.jpg)(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160208_181005103.jpg)(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160208_180849163.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 08, 2016, 06:55:07 pm
Looking good turtle. Another bow wood I haven't used. I'm going to have to start doing some stave swapping.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 08, 2016, 07:02:41 pm
Well now Mr. Turtle, looks like ya got all over that ornery piece of wood sir.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 08, 2016, 07:08:08 pm
Finally wrasled the top limb into submission. Got er to low brace, lookin good. And decided to flip the tips.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 08, 2016, 07:14:28 pm
Looking good stix.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 08, 2016, 07:22:37 pm
Thanx Turtle, that stik ur workin is gonna be one helluva piece of art.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 08, 2016, 07:34:59 pm
Getting it done stix!  That's top limb longer?

Coming right along turtle...lots of character in that stave.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 08, 2016, 07:54:23 pm
Stixs it's looking good.

Turtle way to make that wood do what you want it to



Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 08, 2016, 07:55:57 pm
Vine maple is looking good turtle - love that reflex.''

She looks good at brace stix - looking forward to seeing the tips after you get them flipped.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 08, 2016, 08:01:50 pm
Ajooter, its not longer but it is 1/8" positive
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 08, 2016, 08:25:03 pm
All looking real good. stix, I'll bet that 1/8 positive will be excellent on that bow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 08, 2016, 08:33:37 pm
Had a little disaster today steam bending. Broke a tip, and lost 4". I figured the bow was a write-off then. But after walking away from it, eating lunch, coming back and looking at it all carefully, I realized I could make it bendy handle, shift it up the unbroken limb and reshape the fades longer and get a 62" bow out of it. By reshaping the fades it actually now looks more like the Sudbury bow I was interested in. Starting to re-tiller and it's coming along easy. In fact easier than before. I like the way it looks now -- a little more character and less generic, if I can make draw length I might like it even better than before. We'll see...
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 08, 2016, 08:39:00 pm
Plan B, i love recycling. Who knows might turn out better than expected.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Knoll on February 08, 2016, 08:40:37 pm
These trades threads are like HUGE build alongs! GRRRRREAT!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 08, 2016, 08:56:31 pm
Looking great fellas!

Turtle, that is one awesome character stick.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 08, 2016, 08:57:48 pm
Plan B, my money is on you sir.  If you have the Sudbury thing happening then you ought to be able to pull it off I'm positive.
rich

You fellas, each and every one, are some "stick to it", "wood bendin fools", and I'm damned glad to know all of ya.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 08, 2016, 09:02:51 pm
Hey! Look what Fred sent
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8252.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8252.jpg.html)
Some real nice sinew! My dog won't leave me alone, I better lock it up over night. Why the excitement you might ask? Well, I've never used it before and I'm very interested in seeing how it works out. I had not planned on using it , the stave have some nice back character but I'm not trusting all the pin knots also I gotta crank a couple of extra inches out of it.

So my question is in what stage should I apply the sinew?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 08, 2016, 09:09:34 pm
Mr. Andersson,
      I believe that having the bare bow to at least Brace height would be desirable, That way you wont  be trying to tiller down a 100# bow after the sinew sets up 8)......and by the way if Mr. DuBois happens to chime then under no circumstance listen to him >:D >:D >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 08, 2016, 09:27:59 pm
Turtle, Stix, great seeing you guy's bows! :)
Rich, Stix, thanks, muchly. I was kind of sick when it happened, but I've got hopes for it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 08, 2016, 09:43:24 pm
Honestly B, i've had more than a few bows that started out as 1 design and finished beautifully as something else.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 08, 2016, 10:33:31 pm
Turtle, Stix, man you guys are making nice progress.  That vine maple is looking interesting.  I've never had my hands on any of that but see it a lot on this site.  Looks like a challenge a minute to work with.

Stix, what wood is your bow?  Hard to keep up with everyone.  That "flip" looks mighty fine. 

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 08, 2016, 10:58:49 pm
Man... I can hardly keep up with this thread. Way to stick with it PlanB. It aint over till ya run out of wood.

Turtle, Stix, man you guys are making nice progress.  That vine maple is looking interesting.  I've never had my hands on any of that but see it a lot on this site.  Looks like a challenge a minute to work with.

Stix, what wood is your bow?  Hard to keep up with everyone.  That "flip" looks mighty fine. 


This is the first time I have tried vine maple but hope it wont be the last.It's nice wood to work but don't think I've ever seen any posted that didnt have a lot of character. Of course all this character in a new for me wood is forcing me to work slower which is a good thing.

I also got some  goodies in the mail yesterday.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/20160208_224618.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 08, 2016, 11:24:09 pm
Mr. Andersson,
      I believe that having the bare bow to at least Brace height would be desirable, That way you wont  be trying to tiller down a 100# bow after the sinew sets up 8)......and by the way if Mr. DuBois happens to chime then under no circumstance listen to him >:D >:D >:D
rich

Huh?  O:) O:) O:)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 09, 2016, 08:36:22 am
Hey, Thanks Turtle! :)

Stix, well here's hoping it turns out okay. I just have to make draw length tillering. Probably bend the tips back a little. Not sure on that.

Here's the new shape. Now 62" bendy handle instead of the original 68" hard handle.

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowB7.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 09, 2016, 08:41:17 am
Mr. B,
    That looks great. That ought to be a hard shootin hunting bow right there.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 09, 2016, 09:47:52 am
That looks awesome B....you flip those tips and ya got a screamer!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 09, 2016, 11:17:20 am
Better?

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowB8.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 09, 2016, 11:33:21 am
Plan B, That profile there is gonna surprise ya how fast it shoots.....man that's lookin good.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 09, 2016, 11:44:05 am
Plan B...

Are you standing on a chair in that picture?  ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 09, 2016, 11:45:23 am
 :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

yeah, man.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 09, 2016, 12:04:35 pm
Yes indeed PlanB, that's look'in really good!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 09, 2016, 12:27:33 pm
A+ B-man!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on February 09, 2016, 12:31:40 pm
That's a good lookin profile planb!

So I've got one of the ironwood staves bending back to 26", little more tillering. Only problem is the little twist in one tip. I've steamed it out twice now, keeps creeping back to where it started.

Tattoo Dave
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 09, 2016, 01:03:39 pm
I have had ironwood do that before....if the bow is drawing back smoothly that tip twist will make no difference at all.....and make it's life any shorter either.  Inter-tangled grain has pros and cons....tough as nails but a tad willfull. 8) 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 09, 2016, 02:06:02 pm
Thank you everybody!  :) :) :)
Had to put it away in the shed to let it rehydrate for a few days.

Looking forward to reading about all your great bows in the meantime....!!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 09, 2016, 03:04:30 pm
Spending so much time keeping up with this thread not got any time to carve a bow.. >:D Life getting in the way at the moment, will post when I can sneak off to the workshop for a few minutes. ;)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 09, 2016, 03:12:28 pm
Planb that thing is lookin sweet,
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 09, 2016, 03:18:02 pm
Hey fellas,
     Just thoughgt I'd show you that all of mine dont make it either ::) ::)
This was going to be the 3rd Penobscott....had it to 75# @ 14....and was stretching it out a bit. Then a small pin knot  (right on the edge, duh) decided to lift a splinter....but it's a damned fine one.
    Anyways, I can save it for a lighter bow but it's days as a heavy-weight are all done.....all ready cut out my plan "B". So here's the pics fellas.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 09, 2016, 04:04:19 pm
Half Eye, that stinks. But 75# that would've been a whopper of a bow when it was done. What weight were you going for?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 09, 2016, 04:13:15 pm
Was looking for about 80 after the back bow was added, but also had to have a lot of draw....just dumb on my part is all >:D >:D >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 09, 2016, 04:40:58 pm
That's a shame, Rich, but I know you'll have another whipped up even better.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 09, 2016, 05:32:47 pm
That is a lot of weight Rich - and it was looking good.  Knots on edges have bitten me a few times!  I avoid them at all costs now.  :laugh:
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 09, 2016, 05:48:58 pm
Dang Rich, it would take me and my best friend to draw that bow.  You were ambitious.  Give her another go.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 09, 2016, 05:59:26 pm
Thats a shame Rich. Make the next one a little lighter please....... my shoulder won't take 80# anymore. >:D

PlanB........ thats looking real sweet.


Got mine worked out to low brace today. That one limbs a real bugger.


(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160209_171810633.jpg)(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160209_171946820.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 09, 2016, 06:07:50 pm
All I can say fellas is this.....I've broke 'em before, I'm still breakin 'em, and I will probably break some more before I'm all done >:D >:D

Turtle, looks like you have a damned fine bend going there even with the character, that's an even bend going on sir.

MW, believe it or not Ironwood will tolerate that usually....untill some idiot wants a lot of weight on a 1" wide whitewood bow.....honestly I dont believe that would of happened if the weight was in the 50-60# range. 
Maybe I should change my name to "operator error" 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on February 09, 2016, 06:28:04 pm
Rich, toss a bamboo backing on it. That will take care of it mighty fine. I done that before on a hickory bow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 09, 2016, 06:34:19 pm
Good to know Rich - I have some ironwood drying that I cut last year.  I have heard lots of good thing about it and looking forward to working with it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Knoll on February 09, 2016, 07:05:47 pm
Rich .... only can wish my failure rate was as low as yours!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 09, 2016, 07:09:35 pm
Lookin great B!!

It happens rich...makes us keep coming back for more!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 09, 2016, 07:26:29 pm
Turtle that is niiiiice! Both ends look perfect in the brace, even with all the snakeys.
How's Otter doing?
Ajooter, thanks!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 09, 2016, 07:29:30 pm
half eye: I think it broke due to your non ergonomical pull, straight back and push with your legs >:D

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 09, 2016, 07:32:48 pm
Thanks for the sentiments fellas......but really not necessary. I dont like to break one for sure....but I aint gonna pour gas on my head and light it >:D  Just went and cut out another blank.

Turtle: will do brother....by the way, I never could pull that much weight 8) Anything over 60# and you all get the two hand pics, eh?

Knoll, your computer aint got enough memory if I sent pics of every stick I've ever broke, used to measure them by the garbage can full !!!

MW....I was tellin the truth bud, I dont think anything about cutting right through a knot (on the edge) this was just a case utter foolishness.

ajooter, absolutely sir....all of us like the abuse ::)

Mr. Andersson....now that was funny right there
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 09, 2016, 07:42:49 pm
Hey guys I'm all out of rawhide backing strips with the few that I need for the two bows I'm working on.  If I get some more I will let u know asap...sorry I couldn't help everybody out this round.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 09, 2016, 07:45:17 pm
Here's some a few progress pics. I need to make a string for it and start tillering. Hope the bug hole holes!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 09, 2016, 07:47:21 pm
Turtle, that low brace is lookin nice. Rich, if ya aint breakin ya aint makin. It's just part of bowery, if ya wanna do it you gotta the good with the bad. Ok , i'll stop.😜
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 09, 2016, 07:50:20 pm
Timothy, lookin good. Like to see how those holes hold up, i got a piece of sage with bug holes just been holdin off on workin it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 09, 2016, 07:57:47 pm
Thanks for kind words guys. With all the dips and bumps this has I have been paying extra attention to my thickness taper. Even used my calipers for the first time in a couple years.

Turtle that is niiiiice! Both ends look perfect in the brace, even with all the snakeys.
How's Otter doing?
Ajooter, thanks!


Otter's doing ok. He's just letting his staves loose a little moisture. I'll give him another week then I'll kick him Into gear.  >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 09, 2016, 08:01:57 pm
Looking good TimothyR. Is that one hole that goes all the way through?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on February 09, 2016, 08:03:43 pm
Update....ERC and hickory partial draws....really need opinions on the ERC I wrapped an area with some small frets with elk sinew then hemp wrapped, should I just hang it up on the wall of shame??-Hammertime(http://i1221.photobucket.com/albums/dd464/jeffreyakolste/f83a56c4-8a9a-4acd-922c-0a2c756657a3_zpspmd1znj1.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 09, 2016, 08:07:26 pm
Looking good TimothyR. Is that one hole that goes all the way through?

Yes sir it does!  It makes me nervous!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on February 09, 2016, 08:08:10 pm
Hickory(http://i1221.photobucket.com/albums/dd464/jeffreyakolste/cafe979c-dea6-4fbe-8860-8734f5475622_zpsku91yqkh.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 09, 2016, 08:13:47 pm
I'm tired of chasing rings. 9 so far. I'm thinking of putting it up for awhile and go ahead and start tillering the BL.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 09, 2016, 08:17:49 pm
Lookin good hammer....that second one hickory?  Is the erc asymmetrical or just canted a little? 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 09, 2016, 08:28:56 pm
Update....ERC and hickory partial draws....really need opinions on the ERC I wrapped an area with some small frets with elk sinew then hemp wrapped, should I just hang it up on the wall of shame??-Hammertime

In my opinion sinew wraps are good for holdin cracks together and splinters down , but don't think it does much for frets. I have seen bows on this site that had belly patches done in various ways but i have no experience with any of them. The hickory's looking good though.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 09, 2016, 08:41:35 pm
Gutshot, that piece of osage still giving you a bad time? maybe the fireplace would teach it a lesson >:D

hammertime, man that little static is off the hook bud

rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 09, 2016, 08:51:29 pm
I'm tired of chasing rings. 9 so far. I'm thinking of putting it up for awhile and go ahead and start tillering the BL.

I am starting to like it too much I think.

Heres the ones I done for this trade at floor tiller at this point L-R:  66" lilac (no ring chased of course), 65" osage, and 63" osage.

Then some more I started in the few weeks prior to the trade so I guess I can't use them in this deal....or can I? HMMM??? One never knows  >:D >:D

Guess it's time for some nocks and a tillering extravaganza! Anybody got a great scraper for trade  ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 09, 2016, 08:55:38 pm
Hammertime, don't think I can help you with the first pic.  In the second pic, is the bow perfectly vertical?  If so, your top limb looks stiff right out of the fade.  Sometimes images can fool you though.  Look at it from both sides and see what you think.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 09, 2016, 08:58:54 pm
Gutshot, that piece of osage still giving you a bad time? maybe the fireplace would teach it a lesson >:D

hammertime, man that little static is off the hook bud

rich

No fire place for this Osage I will make a promise that it will make a bow even if it's only 10lbs
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 09, 2016, 08:59:25 pm
Hey Hammer, I would be pretty leery of ERC with frets unless I could bring it down to get rid of them completely and get close to the weight still. I love the wood but I have had one explode without a backing and it was dramatic. I wouldn't draw it any further until I got the frets out and even bending limbs, then I'd shorten it a little and sinew it if it was bending nice and had enough left to get a sweet bow from. That's just me though. Liking that hickory though  ;)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 09, 2016, 09:02:17 pm
Last pic!  I'm calling it quits till this weekend!  This is at low brace pulling 27#@19". Hopefully it will hold up. What do you guys think about the tiller so far? 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 09, 2016, 09:05:22 pm
Hey Hammertime, what weight are you pulling on the ERC in that pic?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 09, 2016, 09:33:42 pm
Hammertime, top limb is a little stiff but not much. Are the limbs the same length? If they are flip it over and show us the same draw.

TimothyR, I like to use a tillering gizmo at this stage or even a rectangle scraper to check the limbs for bending evenly. My eyes aren't good enough at picking out small discrepancies.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 09, 2016, 09:40:26 pm
TimothyR, looks very good except where noted.  That area looks like it could develop a hinge......I would watch it closely.  Looking super otherwise.


(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Trade%20Bow_zpstqwfwzgm.jpeg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Trade%20Bow_zpstqwfwzgm.jpeg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on February 09, 2016, 09:53:03 pm
OK thanks for advice, currently the ERC is 45@ 21",beautiful piece but I just don t trust it any more. The hickory curve has a ways to go, so I have room for adjustment there- Hammertime
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 09, 2016, 10:22:39 pm
I am glad everyone is posting so many pictures.  I am away from home for work this week so can't get into my shop at all. At least I can see all these great pictures of everyone's progress.  I should get into my shop this weekend again.  Great work everyone.

Mike
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 09, 2016, 10:46:13 pm
Hammertime - agree with Dubois on the ERC - it can be a fickle wood.  I have attempted 2 erc bows.  One turned out great and the other blew up into 3 pieces on the tillering tree.  The hickory looks great to me!

Dubois - the staves look great.  I admire anyone that loves to chase a ring!  It is the least favorite part for me.  I really have to be in the right frame of mind to do it.  :-\

Gutshot - 9 rings?  Are you kidding me!  :laugh:  See above.  :laugh:

TR - the tiller is looking pretty good to me.  Fred gives good advice on the gizmo.  Drewster could be right, but no hinge yet - something to watch.

I was able to do a little work tonight - pictures on the way.

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 09, 2016, 10:50:32 pm
The thumb rest set back off the handle enough where the bow wouldn't quite sit flat on the tillering tree and it didn't feel quite right in the hand so I started a modification.  I think it will be look pretty sweet when all is said and done.

Btw...and I don't mind judgment...but this bow is a little better then floor tillered....so there's actually a long way to go...but I keep getting these ideas and they just need to be applied.

Great builds all around fellas!!  Always a pleasure reading this post.

(http://i.imgur.com/tVkp7st.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/QvZA3QE.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/n5oiD8D.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 09, 2016, 10:52:26 pm
Fred:  thanks for the advice! I do have a gizmo so I will get that out this weekend.  I think I will back this with some rawhide or cherry bark!  I heard some ticks while flexing the limbs. I'm hoping it was nothing.  What do you guys think?

drewster:  I will watch out for that area.  I do believe that that is the bug hole and I won't be taking anymore of that area.  Thanks everybody I appreciate the help!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 09, 2016, 10:52:40 pm
Glued on some tip overlays last night.  Used walnut for a nice contrast with the white hackberry (it is a bit soft, but it will do).  Shaped them just enough to file in some grooves so I can get it to brace.  I will clean them up and do the final shaping after tillering.  Plenty of wood there yet (still 11/16" wide at the base of the grooves).
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 09, 2016, 10:57:18 pm
Wow, I haven't logged on in a couple days and had quite a few pages of posts to go through.  No bow work for me for the past couple days.  I'm in the midst of a big project at work, so we have had several longer than normal days at work, and trying to get my taxes finished.... ughh!  But I hope to get back to the fun in a couple days and have most of the weekend in the shop.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 09, 2016, 10:58:30 pm
Also glued up a riser for the trilam.  Hard maple with a walnut strip.

Here is a pic of the bows profile after glue up.  Also a front profile picture after cutting out the limb shape.

Try and cut the riser tomorrow...maybe?

ajooter - that zebra wood looks awesome!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 10, 2016, 06:26:49 am
Couldn't sleep real good last night all I had on my mind was that stinking Osage. So I got up early and finally got both limbs chased down to the same ring. Next I will get the natural tip overlays done and the forward handle. Also do a final lay out of the bow and get it down to limb width. Shave the limb thickness down to 1/2". And ready for floor tiller. Maybe by Friday I can get more pics posted of this #%^> of a bow.

TimothyR looking good
Hammer time  stick with the hickory
Mitch I want to learn how to do tip overlays like that always been a little scared to do those
Ajooter that handle is still awesome even though you got to modify it. (Should've made you a new tiller tree) lol😃
Everybody else keep up the good work
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 10, 2016, 07:08:41 am
ajooter, I missed your pic of the bow in the mirror at the bottom of page 66. That's looking great!! And I'm going out to find me a mirror just like that one.

I went to bed at 9 last night and woke up about midnight feeling refreshed so I started on Pg 1 and read thru all of the posts to date although I will admit to just scanning the last 10 pages.

I found a few mistakes I made

#1 and my biggest concern is that when I sent your victims names to you I inadvertently sent some of you your own specs instead of who you are building for.

SO, if the person you are building for has the same specs as you BEWARE. I may have errored. I found 3 of these and believe That is all of them but please double check me just to make sure
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 10, 2016, 07:23:53 am
Fred, I'm positive my victims specs aint my own 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 10, 2016, 08:02:09 am
I'm good on my specs Fred. There not mine.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 10, 2016, 08:03:56 am
I got the right guy and specs too.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 10, 2016, 08:06:15 am
Mitch, I love that profile!

I have considered gluing a handle on my lilac but I'm sure it would come out with bad lines and looking rough.

How do you guys get the glue lines so tight on anything besides a board to board glue up?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 10, 2016, 08:22:20 am
Mitch, I love that profile!

I have considered gluing a handle on my lilac but I'm sure it would come out with bad lines and looking rough.

How do you guys get the glue lines so tight on anything besides a board to board glue up?

Belt sander. ;)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 10, 2016, 08:27:32 am
Specs I got definitely aren't mine. :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Mo_coon-catcher on February 10, 2016, 09:08:30 am
No real progress to speak of the last couple of week. Busy work schedule and far too windy on the little free time I've had lately. More than likely I'll have to dig out plan B. The ERC decided to start letting go a bit while the sinew was pulling tight drying. One limb reflexed about 1" the other pulled about 3" but that because that limb developed some cracks on the belly and one on the side letting the limb pull more. I shot in some super glue to hopefully hold the cracks from opening more. But who knows, it could all work out once the tillering begins on it, or I'll get a nice explosion of wood and sinew.

On the plus side, one of my snakes is heavily into shed so I should have a good piece of decoration for the bow soon. I definitely want to do a molle and I have the decorations all figured out already. Turkey body feathers for the working portion with snake sheds on the levers for a scaly look. I just gotta get the bow working so I can decorate it.

Kyle
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 10, 2016, 09:29:59 am
I'm spec free. The specs i got r not mine, close but not mine.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 10, 2016, 10:34:39 am
I double checked my guys specs against what he posted and I am good to go. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on February 10, 2016, 10:45:45 am
Just a quick update from me:

Work has also gotten the better of me this past week and a half , so I haven't made a lot of progress on the bow.  I did get some Smooth On ,though, and work has gotten a little lighter.  I'm optimistic that if I can't take an extra day off this week to do some other errands (and work on the bow!), I will definitely have time this weekend.

Also, the specs I got for my trade are different from my own, too.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on February 10, 2016, 10:55:12 am
Got a couple of questions on my bow.  I want to do scalloped edges, but I'm undecided on whether I want one side only or both sides to be symetrical.  SO, you folks who have a lot of knowledge in regards to eastern Indian tribes and bows in general. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ryan C on February 10, 2016, 11:13:52 am
(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm165/jreefer454/4B02E8FC-EE9C-4A9A-A782-4AE6751D365B_zps4wqan0kn.jpg) (http://s296.photobucket.com/user/jreefer454/media/4B02E8FC-EE9C-4A9A-A782-4AE6751D365B_zps4wqan0kn.jpg.html)
Got mine finished but it wasent wanting to go to 28 with this nasty knot.. I'm going to start a new one with a cleaner stave. Won't have my phone for a while so will do my best to post pics.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 10, 2016, 11:58:10 am
Mr. Sidmand,
      Regards the scalloped bows....Most all of the Iroquois Nation used them, as did the Algonquian Language group (Odawa, Chippewa, Pottawatomie,  Ho Chunk, Menominii, and most of the Great Lakes area like the Shawnee.
     Scalloped bows were known by all of these Native Americans....but they also knew of straight bows, double curved bows etc. Elders have advised me that bows of this type are not much different than whites who have a fancy for different types of fireams....the style of bow was not wrote in stone it was a matter of personal choice of the carrier. By the way, the same can be said for the lack of grip wraps on most eastern bows....most were not but that does not mean that some did wrap theirs as a personal preference.
    How the scallops are deployed is usually a give-away as to nation and/or tribe. Some were scalloped all the way up one side (with or without a scallop at the grip) and the size of them makes a difference.....some were on opposite sides one side upper limb and the opposite on lower limb. The only scalloped bows that I know of scalloped up both sides would be the Odawa (in their home territory and single sided for those few displaced to Oklahoma)
   The best way to make them is to shape your front profile, then draw a line in 1/4" from the edge, lay out the scallop pattern, then cut them in no deeper than 1/4" line. Then the scalloped edge(S) should be thinned slightly like the back and belly have a "low crown" section. Then go back and cut the separation "v" ....do not make them deeper than the scallops, about 1/2 to 1/3 the depth is correct. If you are not 100% confident in your cutting of the V's (so you dont leave any sharp stop cuts) then I recommend the use of a file to make them........when all that is done make sure to smooth anything that even resembles a sharp edge.
    Only other thing is if your scallops are cut already when you scrape the belly to finish tiller be careful or you scraper will make a whoopty-do at every peak of the scallops so make sure to have your "low crown" going on.

rich

forgot to say....most all eastern woodland bows had raw-hide strings, a few had bark strings, and I have not seen one with a fiber string (doesn't mean that there never was any however)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 10, 2016, 11:58:37 am
The specs I have are different than mine...   I looked at the guy who I drew, and they match up.... So everything is good here.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 10, 2016, 01:25:53 pm
Managed to get half an hour in!  Rounded over the edges and started hollowing the limb; lined the cheeks of the joint as well, though it will need refining.
(https://stuckinthemudsite.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/image4.jpeg)

(https://stuckinthemudsite.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/image5.jpeg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Onebowonder on February 10, 2016, 01:38:32 pm
That is an interesting looking joint you have there SITM!  I don't think I've ever seen one quite like it before.  Is that for a permanent joint or a take down?

OneBow
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 10, 2016, 01:49:28 pm
Got it to low brace yesterday, so today went all over the belly and sides with the scraper to remove all tool marks. Then I sanded the belly and sides withe 80 grit then went to 200 over the entire bow. Then I started increasing brace highth. At each increase I would scrape any stiff spots  I found and then go back over those spots with the sand paper again. This keeps me from loosing too much weight at the end when doing final sanding. Anyway I got it out to a 6 inch brace and am ready to start exercising and stretching the draw out.
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160210_125906543.jpg)(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160210_125837504.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on February 10, 2016, 01:51:26 pm
Thank you half eye!  That is very very helpful!  I have not done the layout yet, I will try that in the next day or so, got church tonight, maybe tomorrow night.  Right now my staves are right at 1 1/2 inches wide, but they are still very thick, probably close to 2 inches thick, I haven't removed much belly wood at all.  I'm thinking/hoping with Osage that I can make a couple bendy handle scalloped bows that are around 1 1/4 wide but scalloped at least on one side, so the tips of the scallops would be 1 1/2 or so.  Got to draw it out and see. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 10, 2016, 01:57:45 pm
Take down, was hoping the joint would be a tight interference fit and only need one bolt but the interference isn't tight enough and either needs an offset key or twin bolts or an offset bolt to jam it tight. Am thinking there's not enough timber depth for a key, offset bolts are a pain in the neck and always cross thread so twin bolts are probably the way forward. May work up an antler plate instead of washers.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 10, 2016, 01:59:18 pm
Turtle, man I got to tell ya....you got a natural talent for tillering those "natural" condition staves, hats off to ya man 8) 8)

Sidmand, if you have any particular tribe/band in mind I'll see if I have a pic of one......I did post nearly all the bow pics I had....dont know if they were kept or not but ya could also check on that....but I do have a few left on my computer.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ranasp on February 10, 2016, 02:04:45 pm
Finally got started!  Took me a bit to get the proper tools, namely a couple of wedges, but I've split my first log!  And it only cost me one sledgehammer!  >;/  At least I was mostly done with cracking the log open, and for the rest of it I just used the sledge head like a nicely shaped rock and whacked it onto the wedges.  The Black Locust log had a big crack in it already started so with Fred and Richard's advice I started with that one instead of the super solid Ironwood logs.  Looking at the two halves, it seems that they both have a crack started on them, am I right in thinking I should split those off and possibly get a couple of kids bows out of them? There's quite a hook at one end of the thinner (left) half, but since the log is nearly 90" long I think I have some room to work with. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 10, 2016, 02:20:14 pm
I think you'll be fine. Rich has experience with black locust, I've never used it but understand it is similar in quality to osage. The small split offs should be fine for lighter weight kids bows. The rings look nice. Someone will be along shortly to help you proceed with that nice looking stave. It should make an excellent bow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 10, 2016, 02:28:42 pm
Ranasp,
     I dont have a lot of experience with black locust, but there certainly are fellas on here that do.
As to the "off splits", those natural cracks are stress relief when she dried up. Just split it off to determine what you have exactly so you can pick your layout section of the main stave.
     Glad to see you slingin chips
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on February 10, 2016, 02:33:49 pm
half eye:  no particular tribe in mind really, just a style of bow in my head that wants to come out and manifest itself in some wood.  I still toying with it and shaping it in my head since I can't get to my tools yet, that comes this weekend (maybe, hopefully).  I might sinew back the bow, I have a little over 4 ounces of deer leg sinew unprocessed, for you guys who have pounded sinew, do you think 8 or so deer leg sinew would be enough to sinew back a bow?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 10, 2016, 03:06:07 pm
I would split it right right where its showing you it wants  to split at anyway. Looks like there's a few bows in that log.


Turtle, man I got to tell ya....you got a natural talent for tillering those "natural" condition staves, hats off to ya man 8) 8)


Thanks Rich, but I dont think I have anymore talent than anyone else in this trade. Maybe a little more experience than some but not talent. I have been fortunate enough to meet quite a few realy good bow builders from this site and not only learn by watching them but have them step in and help me. Also advice and encouragement from many others on this site that im sure I will never meet. This is the 4th trade ive been in and I have learned something new each time from the bows I received just by studying them and seeing how the builder wrked around problems in a different way than I would have. Thats what makes these trades so great.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 10, 2016, 03:30:54 pm
Hey guys, help Ranasp and myself out here if you would. Do you have to chase a ring on black locust or can you use the sapwood back?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on February 10, 2016, 03:41:57 pm
I'm almost positive that you should chase a ring on black locust.  I say almost because I have never used BL, but everything I have ever read on here or elsewhere says chase a ring and use the heartwood.

Hey guys, help Ranasp and myself out here if you would. Do you have to chase a ring on black locust or can you use the sapwood back?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 10, 2016, 03:53:17 pm
You should remove the sapwood with black locust like you do with osage.  The heartwood is the preferred wood with BL.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 10, 2016, 03:54:04 pm
Most people chase a ring but I have seen sapwood bl bows posted on here before.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 10, 2016, 04:54:59 pm
Ranasp strip that sap wood off find you a good ring to chase you want to lay that bow out to at least 2" if you possibly can. One good thing to remember BL LOVES TO BE HEATED slowly don't scorch it
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 10, 2016, 05:00:11 pm
Definitely chase a ring and remove sapwood!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: huisme on February 10, 2016, 05:10:42 pm
I've done three surface wood locusts and two chased Smallwood ring locusts for the two-tone effect but really the best way to use it in my experience is to chase the first heart wood ring you're comfortable with and try to cut off a belly stave ;)

Those small splits can actually be turned into full strength shorties if you're so inclined, short narrow bendy numbers are my second favorite to build. Heat treating and flat faces are your friends.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 10, 2016, 06:05:58 pm
Thank you Marc
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 10, 2016, 06:29:44 pm
I agree with chasing a ring with BL and that it does like heat.  A few pages back you can see the reflex I got from heat treating BL.  It was straight before I took my heat gun to the belly.  My first BL Bow really surprised me with how little wood I needed.  It is good bow wood.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 10, 2016, 06:31:14 pm
Rich thanks you just made a little girls day. We had snow today so the kids stayed home from school. The mailman brought a package to the door and she opened it and found the bow you made her. She was sending me pics of it and as soon as I got home she was ready to shoot so off to the basement we went. That little bow will smoke her arrows. They are 7/16 Dahl rods with turkey feathers. Thanks again. Paul
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 10, 2016, 07:15:39 pm
Well, she is an exceptional young lady and I'm glad she likes it....and glad to know her.
rich

I forgot to say that the skins were given by DuBois, and the rawhide was given by Oglala Bowyer so thanks you fellas also.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 10, 2016, 07:45:47 pm
What a great team effort to help a young archer......congrats to all!

Here ya go Gutshot

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Gift%20bow_zpsz9lrvlre.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Gift%20bow_zpsz9lrvlre.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 10, 2016, 07:51:28 pm
Way to go Rich. :)


Gutshot........ I hope your arrow holder wasn't recycled.  >:D >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 10, 2016, 08:09:06 pm
(http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l62/krzyjon123/Mobile%20Uploads/20160210_172903_zpsbyjkqfbe.jpg) (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/krzyjon123/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160210_172903_zpsbyjkqfbe.jpg.html)
Got some more work done today. Thinned the limbs down some....
The left limb obviously has a hinge. That little spot is giving me trouble.... I used the draw knife to scrape away some wood, and It broke off a big chunk....  Guess I'll be using the rasp for the rest of it. It I still pretty heavy, so I'm not too worried. The picture was taken with the right limb bent to 6". I think the left limb is still stiffer. Once I get rid of that hinge, they should be pretty equal...

This is FUN! ;)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 10, 2016, 08:09:53 pm
Looking at it closer, it appears the right limb close to the fades is starting to hinge? Or is that just me?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 10, 2016, 08:15:19 pm
Good man Rich!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Knoll on February 10, 2016, 08:28:41 pm
This is FUN! ;)

That's the attitude!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 10, 2016, 08:37:54 pm
David.... looking pretty good. Maybe my eyes are just tired but I cant see a hinge on the right limb. I would work work a little between the gouged spot and the fade on the left limb and check it again. You might be surprised at how much better that will make the hinge look.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 10, 2016, 08:49:06 pm
Awesome bow Rich, u are the man! David , just work both sides of that hinge , slowly. Remove a lil and check it and so on. You'll be fine. The right limb maybe about 4" out from handle, maybe. Just keep an eye on it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 10, 2016, 08:53:50 pm
David,
     I agree with Mr. Turtle.....I put some marks on your picture (hope thats OK)
1. The orange line is where you need to make it move a little more....do that first
2. The green line might be a tad stiff.....but wait till you get the orange moving first.....then if still looks a little bit "flat" where the green take a little bit off there.

Like turtle said you are gonna be surprised how little bit of wood taken off will change things so go slow and check often.....you have pleanty of wood yet so please dont over pull it or you will cause set that's not necessary......just pull enough to see if the left limb shape is improving and no more.

Keep posting pictures sir.....it helps these fellas see what is happening while there is still time to fix any mistakes....or maybe keep you from making one. Knoll said it ....ya got the right attitude, sir.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 10, 2016, 09:22:53 pm
David, you got some good direction above.  Just don't forget to exercise the limbs 40-50 times after you remove wood.  Then you can see how the wood reacts to your adjustment.  Patience.  Work slowly.  Look at it.  Look at it.  Patience.  You'll get her bending like a champ.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 10, 2016, 10:36:26 pm
Man everybody's bows are coming on. It's along time till Aug 1st.

Drewster how did you make my pic look normal. I'm still having trouble with my pics.

Turtle we always recycle including are arrow holders
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 10, 2016, 10:56:40 pm
Ok Rich threw in a surprise in with the award bow. I still can't say what kind it is but this little iron wood double bow is smoking fast and fun to shoot. I put around 50 arrows through it tonight. And my 15 yr old son has laid claim to it. I don't know how many he shot. But it was quit a few. But any ways thanks Rich again your a very giving man.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 10, 2016, 11:38:52 pm
Did a little tillering tonight...tiller isn't quite even and I still need to tweek my alignment some more.  I may have cut the rest a little deep so straightening at the handle may be a little dicy but there always plan b ;D

It's at about a 4" brace and pulling 30#@14".

(http://i.imgur.com/VPBJxlh.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/LkiyPNk.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 10, 2016, 11:41:31 pm
What a great team effort to help a young archer......congrats to all!

Here ya go Gutshot

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Gift%20bow_zpsz9lrvlre.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Gift%20bow_zpsz9lrvlre.jpg.html)

I love to see this!! Hope my girl and boy want to keep at this as they grow up.

PS: Gut you lucky devil you!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 10, 2016, 11:43:03 pm
Thumbs up Rich!    You and all the others in the group make me happy I jumped in!

David - If you get a chance, a pic of the unbraced bow along side of the pic where you are pulling on the tree makes it easier to determine whats going on with the bow.  You probably have one posted here somewhere - but we are up to 80 pages!!  :laugh:  Depending on the unbraced profile that "hinge" may not be as obvious as you think.

Didn't get any work done tonight on the bows - meeting at school.  :(

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 10, 2016, 11:56:21 pm
Gutshot, I saved your image to my hard drive, used one of my photo software programs to rotate it and then reposted.  Just took a couple of minutes.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 11, 2016, 06:28:33 am
Did a little tillering tonight...tiller isn't quite even and I still need to tweek my alignment some more.  I may have cut the rest a little deep so straightening at the handle may be a little dicy but there always plan b ;D

It's at about a 4" brace and pulling 30#@14".

(http://i.imgur.com/VPBJxlh.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/LkiyPNk.jpg?1)

Ajooter bow is looking good. And what's up with the Hoyt shirt on a PA website. Just agrivating ya! I have a Mathews shirt on here at work.

It's at about a 4" brace and pulling 30#@14".

(http://i.imgur.com/VPBJxlh.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/LkiyPNk.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 11, 2016, 06:43:30 am
David I was going to mention that the interlocking grain of HHB often can lead to tear outs if your draw knife starts splitting rather than cutting. That's about the only drawback with that wood I've noticed so far.  Watch the blade angle and keep it sharp. Looks like there's still plenty of wood left though. I usually switch from the draw knife to a surform pocket plane after the rough out is finished. I like to modify the blade a little so it takes off more wood. If you take a small flat pointed file and do 2-3 pushes from the inside in each little hole, you'd be surprised by the improvement. It looks like it would take far longer than it actually does, maybe 10 minutes but well worth it. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 07:55:44 am
Well I made up for the splinter, kinda-sorta. Decided that with a bunch of weight I'm going from a Penobscott to one of the Iroquois types of single bows, got that cutout and just passed floor tiller.

Dont know about the rest of you fellas but we are in the middle of a series of winter storms at 3 days and a couple more to go, and averaging 10-12 inches a day :o But I did manage to get this much done after diggin out the shed for the umpteenth time >:D
rich
PS I agree Dakota, I have to cut mine out with a saw but from then on it's hand tools, meaning rasps and files then sanding blocks.....yup, Ironwood will let you know the minuet your tools get dull....but it makes a hell of a bow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: burchett.donald on February 11, 2016, 08:08:19 am
  Rich, Those pictures make me glad I'm living in S.Crolina >:D  By the way that looks like some kinda heavy beast your pulling ;)
                                                                                                                                        Don
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 08:17:12 am
Mr. Burchett,  We have had a easy winter compared to the usual, but this is getting old right here >:D
Ya that thing is definitely in the "stand on the string" range for sure. 8) 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 11, 2016, 08:26:45 am
Rich, you've funneled off all our normal winter snow before it gets here. Plowed once this winter, and that wasn't even worth it - 3". But I wanted to start the old tractor because it's been sitting for months.

Looking forward to your bow build!

Dakota, that's a neat tip, sharpening a sureform -- I'm going to have to try it!

Gutshot, the bow looks real good now. I sure hope the handle works out.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 11, 2016, 08:39:47 am
God morning,
The work on the lilac has been going slow. I've been taking a lot  of belly wood off the last few days but it's still very stiff. I found some posts by "sumpitan" and I guess he makes bows that pull 45# out off thumb wide 48" lilac sticks. After reading that I realized I'm gonna have to reduce my stave a whole lot. Mine is now 1 7/8 wide across the belly, 1/2"-5/8" thick, 60" long and about 44" working limb. I've decided to sinew the back for extra security. My question is if I should try to keep the width and work mostly on thickness? Right now I got 50# at 3".

(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8256.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8256.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 09:05:32 am
Mr. Andersson,
      You have yourself a balancing act here.....the sinew is going to add enough performance that you have to consider BOTH factors that you mentioned. If you leave the limbs wide and sinew you run the risk of having to tiller wood away on the belly to the point of making them too thin.....BUT....if you narrow the limbs width first you need to be carefull that you leave enough to guarantee enough surface area so that the sinew doesn't "pop" off.
    I have never built a sinew bow, but have worked on some, so my advise would be to study up on width vs thickness......then reduce width, then sinew, have enough wood to finish the belly tillering process.
    That is not a whole lot of help, and maybe some of the guys who know about the process can give a more direct answer.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 11, 2016, 09:42:18 am
jandersson, that's pretty interesting about the thumb wide 48"  45# lilac bows. But I'm wondering what is their draw length?

I guess  a lot depends on what you need for your trade guy's draw. I see you have 44" working limbs total because of the stiff tips. And the reflex right out of the handle is going to make bringing to brace hard to start with.

Just to give you a thickness data point, black birch, which has a similar very high stiffness, runs about 3/8" thick mid limb, on a 2" wide non-lever 64" 40# bow. No backing.  I don't know the quality of the 44" working section of yours, so don't know why the backing. Not making any recommendations one way or the other at all in this, just giving you info to add to your cogitations when considering draw length, width and thickness.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 11, 2016, 10:10:04 am
I think when you "sharpen" the surform blades, most of the improvement comes from bending as apposed to sharpening.  The file pushes those little blades out a smidgen and changes the blade angle. This allows it to scoop and lift more wood with each pass.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 11, 2016, 10:16:44 am
Oh, okay Dakota, I get it -- I was wondering about whether a file could sharpen, because I figured the sureform blade was hardened. Makes sense. Thanks!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 12:47:55 pm
Fellas, thought I'd catch you up on the latest bow....there are pics of the front and side profiles and a couple of "floor tiller" pics ::) I'm nearly ready to brace it up and check tiller and weight.
rich
2 sets of pics and also a shot of my files and rasps
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 12:49:45 pm
second pics

The first "draw" pic you can see the left limb is stiff and the second ya can see it coming around
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 11, 2016, 01:06:24 pm
That bow is looking good there Rich. I'd like to he the story's  all those rasps and files could tell.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 01:21:53 pm
Gutshot....yes sir, a couple of them is older than me....they probably got up to no good way before I got 'em >:D......ya sure
rich

Hope your sonr and daughter still crankin them bows back....is she getting used to the "fat" grip yet?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ranasp on February 11, 2016, 02:05:42 pm
Alright, I followed the cracks that were already in the wood and now have something a bit closer to staves, albeit sloppy ones.  First pic shows the four splits I got, the rightmost and leftmost seem to be the ones to go for now.  Narrowing it down to those two, I don't like how blurry the ring looks on the right one although it's off to the right side of it and it looks like there's plenty of material to work with on the left of it.  The leftmost stave looks (to my uneducated eye) to be the best of the lot, the rings look regular and clean.

 On all of them I can clearly see where the sapwood is a different color from the heartwood.  So I should just knock off about the outermost three rings?  (yeah, "just"!  I'm sure it will be that simple. )
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 02:23:27 pm
Ranasp, looks either one will work very well....but for your first I would recommend going with your first instinct. Also if you have picked out the "bow part" of it cut her down to close to size and save some ring chasing....if not then chase the whole thing and then decide, getting the sapwood off will also give a more concise view of what you have for sure.

As an aside: those logs were cut a long time ago, meaning to get a good judgement of rings it would behoove you to make a fresh cut on the ends (saw off a thin slab) so you can get an accurate opinion.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 11, 2016, 02:29:56 pm
Gutshot....yes sir, a couple of them is older than me....they probably got up to no good way before I got 'em >:D......ya sure
rich

Hope your sonr and daughter still crankin them bows back....is she getting used to the "fat" grip yet?

Oh ya her hand and the bow has become one.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ranasp on February 11, 2016, 02:37:37 pm

As an aside: those logs were cut a long time ago, meaning to get a good judgement of rings it would behoove you to make a fresh cut on the ends (saw off a thin slab) so you can get an accurate opinion.
rich

You're quite right, they were cut some time ago and left to cure in a corn crib.  I'll knock off the ends and see what comes up. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 11, 2016, 02:39:12 pm
Ranasp on that black locus, I always hatchet that sap wood and bark off. Also BL is notorious for pin knots. I don't worry a thing about the ones In The sap wood but when you get a chasing a ring make sure you don't violate it around the knots. I just put a circle about the size of a quarter Around them and leave all of that. tyen after I finish my ring up I go back and ease off that wood around those pin knots.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 04:42:13 pm
OK fellas,
      When I was working the bow on the floor the one limb was slightly stiff just inside the recurve. So I slowly worked that to a point where it looked like even bends at a low brace...then bent it some more and rechecked and needed a slight tweek but got it so I was happy with the evenness of the bends. (took 3 pics the first 2 are before the final tweek with the bow inverted from pic to pic.....then the last bow pic is after I felt satisfied with the profile.
     At this point since I want at least 70# @ 30 inch I needed to get an idea about where I was weight wise. I'm going to explain how I go about that (at this point) please dont think I'm professing it...it is just the way I do it.
      Since I dont want to induce unnecessary set or other damage here at low brace I like to have an idea of what the bow should be at lower weight draw. What I do is say I want 70# @ 30 so I take 2/3 of both numbers.....2/3 of weight is 47# and 2/3 of draw is 20" so as a guide I worked the bow back to 50# which occured at 17 inches.....so I'm going to stop pulling the bow any further untill I sand down the belly (tiller) and the weight comes into range at 20" of draw.....then I'll work it back more untill I hit full draw.
 Many not be the normal way but it works for me.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 11, 2016, 04:57:12 pm
grateful for your working methods, Rich. It definitely helps.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 05:57:41 pm
PlanB,
      I am sort of reluctant sometimes because I dont want to get someone on the wrong footing. Personally, my tillering improved greatly when I stopped chasing "miniature" corrections. By that I mean instead of working small areas to fix perceived problems I started looking at the bow as a whole thing. Like if ya see a hinge starting by starting on the strong limb you can get a true picture of the remaining hinge that actually needs to be corrected......but if you go right for the hinge and get it straightened out then go to the strong limb you wind up removing way more wood than was truly necessary.
     When one limb bends more than the other, as you weaken the strong you are simultaneously strengthening the other and the limb bends start "coming together". That is pretty straightforward....but keep that in mind also when looking at localized problems such as hinges and stiff spots.
     Essentially my mind is looking at the tree line and not so much the individual tree, if that makes any sense.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 11, 2016, 06:11:36 pm
half eye, PlanB:
I was going to sinew it because of a bunch of pin knots on the back that I don't trust also I need to get it to an pretty decent DL. Would you recommend tone down the reflex a little?  I already took it down to 3" and was hoping to tiller some out of it or is that a bad thing to do? I want to make it a bendy handle would that affect what I want to do with the reflex? And my last question just to double check, when the bow is on the tillering tree you measure the DL from belly side of the handle right?
Thanks for all your patience guys!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 06:26:03 pm
Mr. Andersson,
       No patience involved sir. Was just trying to keep you from paintin yourself into a corner is all. If the backing is a matter of insurance against the pin knots you could back it with thin rawhide, or silk, or some such......if sinew is what you have then use it. If you do go with the sinew go only one good layer and maybe a small band down the center of the long axis (would be a narrow second layer).
      By having the small localized center reflex you may not get all of it come out as you draw the bow which is no big deal as the bow could be tillered into the classic 5 curve (gullwing) shape. My only concern is that by using sinew you are increasing draw weight and performance....if you go with something like rawhide then the bow is basically a protected self bow and would be easier for you to tiller out in the normal fashion.
      Wait to see what PlanB has to say because he may have a better idea for you.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 11, 2016, 06:53:46 pm
Ok... I'm at a stopping point. I almost have the hinge gone, but I've got a new problem... 

One of the limbs is more reflexed than the other. It's almost 2" more reflexed than the other. I have been talking with another bowyer, and he told me to reflex the not reflexed limb to be equal with the other. He also said to wipe Olive oil on the spot I was going to heat, then heat it so it did not burn the wood. My question is... Is that what I should do? Also, we're should I heat the limb to do this?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 07:02:00 pm
David,
      Please put up a couple of pics, nobody can give you advice blind.....thanks bud
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 11, 2016, 07:06:41 pm
Not at all Rich -- I don't have a worthwhile opinion on backing at all. My only thought was it seemed like a short working section. But I don't know the draw length, wood properties, with or without backing, so maybe it's fine. If the lilac and backing combo can handle the handle reflex plus the stiff tips on that 22" per limb working section for the draw length, then it would be a very fast bow, I bet. I'm not radical enough in the bows I've built to know, so still worried about chrysaling and compression problems in unbacked black birch. It maay not be the best wood to compare with lilac either. Kind of an unknown I'm just finding out about.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 11, 2016, 07:16:29 pm
I will get you some in a minute Rich.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 07:22:14 pm
PlanB....Mr. Andersson....upon reflection and considering the sharp grip reflex maybe you should go with the sinew and maybe two complete layers.....not on account of the pin knots mind but rather because of the high stress design.

Thanks David it will help a lot
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 11, 2016, 07:24:38 pm
(http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l62/krzyjon123/Mobile%20Uploads/20160211_181242_zpsy7gcmcrr.jpg) (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/krzyjon123/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160211_181242_zpsy7gcmcrr.jpg.html)
Here ya go. The left limb goes straight out, but the right limb is reflexed a little.. (I think I'm saying that right)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 07:36:52 pm
David,
     your terminology is correct. It looks to me that the right limb gained the reflex from relief of stress in the tree and you have released enough wood for it to stabilize in the reflexed position. To correct the balance reflexing the left limb to match is the way to go......I would steam to do that but if you are equipped to use dry heat then by all means do so.....but remember that when you heat treat the left limb you will be making stronger as well so you will also want to do the right one. Make a simple jig byt putting the bow down on it's back with a block of wood under the middle of the grip....then clamp down the right limb at it's tip....now clamp the left limb tip so the profiles match.....then go to the oil and heat.
     I do not dry heat so maybe one of the other fellas in the trade who has experience with that can walk you through the process.

PA has a lot of knowledgeable people so if someone with experience wants to help ya then take the help.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 11, 2016, 07:58:11 pm
Awesome. Thanks! I am done for tonight, but maybe I'll get to it this weekend.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 11, 2016, 08:00:51 pm
And my last question just to double check, when the bow is on the tillering tree you measure the DL from belly side of the handle right?
Thanks for all your patience guys!


I have always measured from the back of the bow at the handle. AMO standards for draw length is measured from belly side of handle then add 1.75 inches to it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 08:03:26 pm
Turtle, thanks man...the old guy lost that one in the shuffle ::) ::)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 11, 2016, 08:06:38 pm
David, it's also hard to tell in the photo because the handle and back aren't level. Is the top of the tree where the handle rests level? It should be or it will throw you off when tillering

If I lay a straightedge across the back on my screen I see a little more reflex out of the grip on the right, but then it deflexes back mid limb.

 I like Rich's 5 minute steam bending for the early inner limb corrections now that I've tried it, because it won't alter the belly stiffness the way dry heat will. On the bow I'm working on now, I used dry heat at the tips a little further into tillering because I wanted to stiffen as well as bend them. I liked the combo. But like rich said, others have more experience and possibly better suggestions.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 11, 2016, 08:12:26 pm
Anybody working on buckthorn in this trade?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 08:15:19 pm
Marco, I do not believe so sir. Hell of a bow wood I hear
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Danzn Bar on February 11, 2016, 08:16:42 pm
IMHO Badly Bent is the Buckthorn King................
DBar
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 11, 2016, 08:18:56 pm
Beautiful bows, those.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: David Ewing on February 11, 2016, 08:41:13 pm
PlanB, I have checked that thing a couple of times... It should be level. I will check again next time I'm out there.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on February 11, 2016, 08:48:03 pm
here's some pics fellas. Ironwood, 48# @ 28". I put some wraps on temporarily, just to get some opinions. There's a little character to it, the top limb looks a little off on the tiller, but thats where the twist gets started. I'm thinking it going to work, but let me know what you all think. this is plan a, I'll get started on plan b after I get some other projects done. Thanks for the input guys!

Tattoo Dave
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 11, 2016, 09:05:17 pm
Dave,
     sweet bend right there sir.....I marked on your pic where you may consider a couple scrapes, not too much though. Character ironwood is hard to judge in a pic so I may be off on this.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 11, 2016, 09:18:08 pm
TD that iron wood is looking good the blue wraps look good too.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 11, 2016, 09:19:13 pm
Tattoo, that looks really cool. One day i'm gonna learn to make a bendy. David, Rich lookin good. Got my hackberry tips recurved and now letting sut for awhile, prolly gonna temper the belly tomorrow. Will post pics tomorrow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 11, 2016, 09:23:30 pm
Hey tattoo: how long is that HHB? Looking good and I like the colors!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on February 11, 2016, 09:25:11 pm
Thanks guys! Rich, you may be right. At the bottom of that line you drew, there's a decent size knot on the belly side that fell out, then I filled it with epoxy. So I didn't want to bend it too much on either side of it. The knot is about 1/4" around, and was maybe 1/8" deep.

Tattoo Dave
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: tattoo dave on February 11, 2016, 09:49:43 pm
Stix, a bendy handle bow is the easiest to make in my opinion. I like them for the simplicityof design and ease of build.

Dubois, it's 63" tip to tip. Widest spot is 1 and 3/8th" mostly1 and 1/4" wide though. Get wider just at spots of big lumps and bumps near handle. The thickness varies a bit too, but for the most part is 5/8" at the handle, and tapers to 3/8" at the tips.

Tattoo Dave
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 11, 2016, 10:48:45 pm
Dave - like the bend and like the wraps.  Well done!

Forgot my update :-[.....

Glued the riser on the trilam just before supper - won't be ready to unclamp until tomorrow evening.  I somehow got just a tiny twist when I glued up the limbs.  It made it tough to get really clean lines between the riser and the limbs.  Did the best I could and hopefully it should not be too bad.

Worked on tillering the hackberry for about an hour and half.  Going slow!  Went from the long string to a very low brace of 1".  Limbs look even.  40# at 13".

Will take some pics this weekend.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 11, 2016, 11:07:36 pm
It's been one of those days... frustrating day at work fixing other people's messes, stressful meetings, behind schedule, etc... Working on the bow was a necessary therapy tonight.

Got the limbs thinned down to the ready-for-floor-tiller stage, and used heat to straighten the handle somewhat to help get the tips in alignment.  On the last turn of the C-clamp handle, I elicited a cracking sound from the wood, so of course I stopped right there.  Then heard another slight crack a few seconds later :( 

The wood was hot and was relatively easy to move.  I had put a small piece of wood between the handle and the C-clamp to protect the bow, so I am really hoping it was that piece and not the bow making the sound.  At that point I am done for the night... Even though I cringed and am worried about it, this was still good therapy for a crummy day at work.

I will take it off the clamps tomorrow and see if there is any damage.  Hope I don't have to switch to a backup stave.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 11, 2016, 11:54:43 pm
It appears a lot of guys are making good progress........keep it roll'in.  Like Loope, I got my hickory stave limbs thinned down ready to floor tiller.  The crook at the handle returned while drying the stave more in my hot box, so I re-steamed it this morning and have it clamped.  I'll unclamp it in the morning and hope it holds this time.  Floor tillering time tomorrow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 12, 2016, 07:26:01 am
Hey Dave,
     I must have missed the knot fill part, being ironwood and all thats the way to deal with it, so disregard my earlier,  bet it shoots just fine sir.

Loope, I agree on the therapy thing as well, just something about woodworking 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 12, 2016, 08:39:38 am
half eye: I'll have a deeper look into the 5 curve/ gullwing design this weekend design. I had a quick look at them and must say they're pretty sexy.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 12, 2016, 10:11:11 am
ja........
    Once you have a specific shape ya want to do.....make sure to heat in the mid-limb deflex before you sinew. The reason for that is give the bow some stability. By that I mean by having a steep (sharp) reflex at the center and your tips so far forward if you do not bring the tips back some you wont be able to string the bow in the normal manner.....if you can string it and have it stay it will take two people....one to bend it over thier knee and the other to set the string.
   By deflexing at mid limb you will gain back some of the inherant stabilty and avoid the 2 man thing. This will also make your tillering a whole lot easier......the sinew will give you all the power you could ask for so try to get the bow stable first.....it's still going to be strong. Dont ask how I know this >:D >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: JonW on February 12, 2016, 10:51:25 am
Rich ya been gettin any sleep bud?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 12, 2016, 11:04:00 am
Some here and there, sir >:D >:D >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 12, 2016, 12:23:34 pm
David,

Unless I missed it no one posted a dry heat method yet. Here's how I go about it. Clamp your stave with the limb you want reflexed to your workbench, leaving the handle and other limb hanging off into empty space. The way you want it to bend should be down the floor, gravity is your friend. The place where you want the bend to occur should be just off the edge of the table. Make sure your clamps have a good hold. Take a gallon jug full of water and hang it on the limb that's off the table. Put it somewhere in the middle to start. The closer you get to the tip the greater the downward force. Try to rig up a yardstick next to the milk jug so you can measure the movement. Apply veg oil, crisco, tallow, or some other oil to the area you'll be bending. The wood will bend without it, but it really cuts down on scorching and helps to hold the heat a little longer. Fire up your heat gun and take aim. Stay around 6" away and don't hold the heat in the same spot for too long. Heat the back, front, and sides for a couple minutes. If you see the oil start to bubble you're getting close to scorching, but that's right where the best movement occurs. If the weight of the jug alone isn't doing the job you can slide it closer to the tip, but you have to remember to check your yardstick measurement again for the new starting point. Often I just push gently on the limb with the jug. It should bend long before it feels like it doesn't want to move anymore. If it won't move easily keep heating. If the area being heated is pretty thick you may have to reapply oil if you see it dry out. After it moves the desired amount stop heating and wipe excess oil with a rag. This will help to cool the area and stop the movement as well. I leave it in the clamps for a couple hours or overnight if it's my second attempt, because sometimes your corrections don't hold and the limb creeps back to the original shape. You should make your bend a little bit farther than your target distance because there will be some creep back, maybe a 1/2 inch to an inch.  Go slow and remember you can try it again in the same spot as many times as you need to as long as you don't burn the spot.

I think I covered it all. Let me know if you have a question. I won't be home until after dinner though. I know there was a good tutorial on dry heat somewhere if you want to look it up and read that as well. The more info to cross reference the better.

Rich,
Have you ever used one of those hand held steam cleaners to do your bending. It's a nice way to avoid setting up in the kitchen. Plus they put out 20 times more steam than a pot of water. I rarely steam, but when I do I'm glad I have that little thing.     
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 12, 2016, 12:30:13 pm
Well darn, I'm not having any success with the short time steaming on my hickory handle.  I took it out of the form this morning after steaming it yesterday and it has already started moving back to it original shape.  I'll steam it for the third time after lunch and try 35 or 40 minutes this time......and leave it in the form clamped for four or five days.  Maybe the third try with have some charm.  The small part of the handle I'm trying to bend is an inch wide and 2" think.  Guess in just needs more time in the sauna.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 12, 2016, 12:47:01 pm
Dakota, never tried one of them.....sounds like it might be worth a shot.

Drewster, sorry it isn't working for you, maybe need the heat gun?
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 12, 2016, 01:10:13 pm
Rich, steam has worked for me in the past on hickory but I have been steaming it a lot longer.  I'll keep at it til it works :-)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: willie on February 12, 2016, 02:07:59 pm
Dakota

do you heat more underneath or on the top?

I seem to remember that heating the inside of the bend, worked sooner than heating the outside, on arrows.

williw
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 12, 2016, 02:48:18 pm
ja........
    Once you have a specific shape ya want to do.....make sure to heat in the mid-limb deflex before you sinew. The reason for that is give the bow some stability. By that I mean by having a steep (sharp) reflex at the center and your tips so far forward if you do not bring the tips back some you wont be able to string the bow in the normal manner.....if you can string it and have it stay it will take two people....one to bend it over thier knee and the other to set the string.
   By deflexing at mid limb you will gain back some of the inherant stabilty and avoid the 2 man thing. This will also make your tillering a whole lot easier......the sinew will give you all the power you could ask for so try to get the bow stable first.....it's still going to be strong. Dont ask how I know this >:D >:D
rich

C'mon Rich, tell us how ya know this  >:D >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 12, 2016, 04:56:26 pm
Hey fellas,
      Here is one reason why the old guy is kind of slow....5 days straight of snow, last 3 are accompanied by 30-35 mph wind, wind chills down to about -20 degrees. Diggin out twice a day. Explicative deleted >:D >:D   Visibility down to about 800 feet.
rich

Mr. DuBois....no sir
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on February 12, 2016, 04:58:41 pm
I know how you feel Rich,,, no snow here but this bitter cold is driving me crazy!!!- Hammertime
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 12, 2016, 05:26:28 pm
Aw come on you guys, it hasn't fallen below +3 degrees C (37F) much more than a half dozen times here this winter and we haven't had more than an inch of snow in several years - your pictures are killing me!  Need to build a snowman and go sledding sooo bad - haven't had a snowday off work for 3 winters  :( >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ryan C on February 12, 2016, 05:52:25 pm
(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm165/jreefer454/5D2DA3A5-44D1-466F-96EF-CF0CA0411599_zpsizaiso3u.jpg) (http://s296.photobucket.com/user/jreefer454/media/5D2DA3A5-44D1-466F-96EF-CF0CA0411599_zpsizaiso3u.jpg.html)(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm165/jreefer454/79E3AC0A-50A9-46B7-BA2A-BE33EEBB7135_zpslt6svf35.jpg) (http://s296.photobucket.com/user/jreefer454/media/79E3AC0A-50A9-46B7-BA2A-BE33EEBB7135_zpslt6svf35.jpg.html)(http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm165/jreefer454/EE9E7AB1-5D83-44E5-B047-0DC8B89BDDC4_zps74v17r13.jpg) (http://s296.photobucket.com/user/jreefer454/media/EE9E7AB1-5D83-44E5-B047-0DC8B89BDDC4_zps74v17r13.jpg.html)
Finally got to start on my new bow after the first one didn't want to go to 28". Got a nice large seasoned BL stave sawn in half and I am chasing a ring now.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ryan C on February 12, 2016, 05:54:30 pm
Other stave in the first pic is not locust its cherry.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 12, 2016, 06:03:41 pm
Hey Ryan.....You'll get it whipped this time bud 8)  I already lost one also ::)  Nice looking staves you have there though.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 12, 2016, 06:26:59 pm
When I heat with the steamer I make a "tube" of tin foil and slide it down the stave to the area I want to heat. Then, twist the open ends closed. I poke a hole in the middle  big enough to fit the nozzle of the steamer. I also poke a small hole in each end of my now sealed tube. The hardest part is trying to half squeeze the trigger for a light flow. If you full squeeze it blows the tube apart. The neat part about the tube is it holds the heat much longer. When you have everything all clamped up, just rip open the tube and allow to cool.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 12, 2016, 06:36:49 pm
I'm going on nights this weekend so I'll get a lot more done on the bows. Life as been getting in the way a bit.  And I want to make sure the bow is ready to bend after the heating.  The weather has been great here in southern Oklahoma so I'm going to take a few hours to hunt some rock tomorrow and then come home and work on the bow.  You guys up north are getting hammered with that cold stuff.  I think I would freeze instantly!   ;D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DC on February 12, 2016, 06:37:51 pm
When I heat with the steamer I make a "tube" of tin foil and slide it down the stave to the area I want to heat. Then, twist the open ends closed. I poke a hole in the middle  big enough to fit the nozzle of the steamer. I also poke a small hole in each end of my now sealed tube. The hardest part is trying to half squeeze the trigger for a light flow. If you full squeeze it blows the tube apart. The neat part about the tube is it holds the heat much longer. When you have everything all clamped up, just rip open the tube and allow to cool.

I use a plastic bread bag.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 12, 2016, 06:43:39 pm
The forecast temperature for my area of Minnesota tonight is -12.  I like it when it gets this cold because it makes me appreciate my wood stove more.  Hopefully I will get some. Work done on plan a and plan b this weekend. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ryan C on February 12, 2016, 08:18:32 pm
Hey Ryan.....You'll get it whipped this time bud 8)  I already lost one also ::)  Nice looking staves you have there though.
rich
its a great shooter just didn't trust it to go to 28" with the bad knot in it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 12, 2016, 08:30:46 pm
Ryan, that shows me you have a real "feel" for this bow makin stuff sir.... 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 12, 2016, 09:53:08 pm
I pulled the bow off the clamps tonight and didn't see any damage, so that is good.  The heat correction brought the string much more in line.  I had bent it past where it needed to go, but got enough spring back that I still need to straighten some more.  Will also need to heat correct the limbs some, one is reflexed and one is deflexed.

I also found some knots on the edge of the limbs.  I tried to miss one of them by leaving wood outside my layout lines, but didn't leave quite enough... the pin showed up in the edge.  The other knot I thought I would missed completely, but it had angled in towards the center enough that it also showed up in the limb.

The red line in the picture is a string from the center of the tips.  Got a little more straightening to do...
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 12, 2016, 09:56:03 pm
Here are some pics of one of the knots.  This one I thought I had missed, but it angled in to the center enough to show up.  I am not sure if I can miss this one.  I can take off just a little more from the limb width and that might put it right at 1/2 inch from the limb.  What do you guys think?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 12, 2016, 10:02:18 pm
Here is the other knot.  I thought I had missed this one, but there was a small pin that came out the side.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 12, 2016, 10:16:41 pm
Loop that's one snake son of a gun!!! Did you try localized steaming on the handle to get the tips in line yet?  I just had to steam mine again...some twist tip had me fooled on my alignment.

No pictures but I had the limbs bending nicely and at 30#@ 16" at 4" brace height.  I'm gonna try and get 30#@18 and up my brace.

If this one doesn't work out I'm gonna try a plan c...bendy handle recurve.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 12, 2016, 10:23:34 pm
I used dry heat on the handle.  It was a little over 2 inches out of alignment and I am a little less than 1 inch out now.  It needs another heat to get it more in line.  I have never tried steam, only used dry heat.  Anyone have thoughts on dry heat vs steam?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 12, 2016, 10:31:04 pm
If you look in the build along section Gordon shows how he does his handle steaming....I believe it's in the vine maple and hazel bow tutorials.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 12, 2016, 10:35:09 pm
http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,53195.45.html

Found the page loop
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jeffp51 on February 13, 2016, 12:48:18 am
Well I haven't worked on my trade bow, but I have a good excuse--more bows.  These two are still Christmas gifts for my first and third boys.  The osage is a belly split from my last bow and is ready for sealing.  Bigger bow is a white oak stave  that came to me floor tillered in the Christmas trade.  The bow I had planned for him broke during tillering the week after Christmas.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 13, 2016, 08:45:58 am
I'm getting the heavy Iroquois closer to final bend but a small amount to go. And sneeking up on an Osage for a friend.....a pics attached
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 13, 2016, 09:39:34 am
Your an animal rich!!  That rawhide is on its way along with some sinew I found at the grocery store  :P.  You'll have to let me know if it's usable stuff.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Knoll on February 13, 2016, 10:07:32 am
sinew at grocery store?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PatM on February 13, 2016, 10:21:53 am
Beef tendon is a major cooking ingredient. Tends to be short though.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ranasp on February 13, 2016, 11:23:12 am
Alright, I sawed off the ends and this is the end of the leftmost Black Locust staff that I was thinking of going after.  Is this about the right size?  Just double checking if I'm heading in the right direction with knocking off the rings.  What I'm seeing is the sapwood ending where the thick blue dots are, and I should try getting to the thin red dots.  Is that right?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 13, 2016, 11:30:08 am
Looks good to me Ranasp!

Rich - you are an animal.

Jeff - those bows look good - bet your boys can't wait.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 13, 2016, 11:40:26 am
These are full length leg tendons that are dog treats.  If you soak them you can pound them out into fibers just don't know if all the goodness was cooked out of them in the process of making the dog chews.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 13, 2016, 11:45:39 am
Had a little time to do some tillering this morning...

I narrowed the parallel section of limbs to 1 7/8".  Rounded the edges and after exercising limbs a bit on the long string, I braced it so that the string was just off the handle about an inch.  Currently pulling 40# @ 13".

The left limb in pic seems a tad stronger to me.  There is a hump in this limb about 12-14" from tip.  I am also thinking the outer 1/3 of limbs are stiff.  Any advice appreciated.  Although I have made several bows, I still struggle seeing the subtle differences in limbs and where and when to remove wood!   :-\

Pics are unbraced, low brace, and pulled to around 13".  (taking pics and pulling at the same time  :laugh:.

Oh, and do you think the left limb has just a little more reflex or is the back of my handle not level causing it to be tipped up just a bit compared to the right?

Thanks!

Mitch

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 13, 2016, 11:47:24 am
Lookin great mitch!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 13, 2016, 11:51:32 am
Thanks ajooter - any suggestions?

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 13, 2016, 12:02:04 pm
Loope -

IMO on the knots - belly knots usually do not cause big problems.  Those knots on the sides that are not exposed on the back of the bow probably won't either as long as they are tight and not rotted etc.  I make sure they are smooth and rounded with no sharp edges exposed.  Knots on the edge of the back can cause problems.  A splinter can easily lift if it is bending on the knot.  It looks like from the pics one of the knots is on the back?  It also looks like there may be some violations around that knot? 
I don't remember what kind of wood you are working and if you were planning on backing it?

On the alignment - if I had to try and staighten it, I would use steam and I would heat it up good for 30 40 min.  I would protect the wood with poly or shellac or something similar.  I will see if I can find some pics.  I use a large pot (couple inches of water) and set the bow across the pot and cover with2 layers of foil so that only the area I want to heat is exposed to steam.  I wrap the area I want to bend with a rag of some kind to keep it hot and moist.  I know there are other ways to do it, that is just what I have done.  Good luck with it!!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 13, 2016, 12:05:32 pm
Mw.......That is indeed looking good, very good as a matter of fact. That bump in the left limb does mess with you at brace....however by the time you are at the bottom of the draw that has dissapered  and both limbs very even with smooth curves.....I think you are set to start bringing her back.

If you start bringing her back try to watch for evenness and not  exceed the max weight all at the same time.....and STOP when either one happens. If it's the limbs starting to look different then correct that and then draw to weight......if it's weight then tiller evenly to bring the draw length back.

That bow is looking exceptional sir
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 13, 2016, 12:11:31 pm
MW,  one other ...IF there is a difference in the limbs it is in the outside 1/3 of the left limb....so keep your eye on that as you come back (as far as evenness goes)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 13, 2016, 12:24:43 pm
Thanks Rich!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 13, 2016, 12:52:43 pm
I think it looks great mitch....keep pulling just monitor your weight and check it at every inch of draw.  I use a gizmo quite a bit at that point.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 13, 2016, 01:23:46 pm
Gizmo is a good idea ajooter - will do.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 13, 2016, 01:58:00 pm
Looks a little stiff coming out of the right fade mitch...might just be my eyes playing tricks tho
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 13, 2016, 03:19:14 pm
I got some Mork work done on my plan a BL.  After I had the tiller very close, I toasted the belly on both limbs and ended up way out of tiller.  After heating one limb had about 4 inches of reflex and the other only had 1 inch.  I tried a second heating on a form for the limb with less reflex and did not gain any more reflex (this limb started with an inch of deflex and the other started with reflex).  I ended up tillering from there.  I thought I had the tiller good last night and all looked even.  I went out this morning and strung the bow an immediately could see the reflexes limb was way stronger.  I spent some more time tillering this morning and now I think I have this bow about as good as I can get it.  Below are some pics. In have shot the bow about 50 times today and it holds reflex in both limbs. 

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/8AFE4970-7D17-448B-AFA4-296A0E598EB5_zps3umjl0gg.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/8AFE4970-7D17-448B-AFA4-296A0E598EB5_zps3umjl0gg.jpg.html)

Here is the bow just after being shot.

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/7913AE5B-DB7C-445A-892B-1F7EB5791635_zpsg6t7k4n6.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/7913AE5B-DB7C-445A-892B-1F7EB5791635_zpsg6t7k4n6.jpg.html)

Here is the full draw.  I made weight but I wanted more.

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/B07B609D-D3C4-40F5-A276-99AA8F621B8B_zpshjsbym9v.jpg) (http://s1061.photo-bucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/B07B609D-D3C4-40F5-A276-99AA8F621B8B_zpshjsbym9v.jpg.html)

What do you all think of the tiller?  I have started on plan b and will post pics of that as I go.  I would like to get a few bows done and send the best one. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 13, 2016, 03:23:28 pm
ajooter,  got my care package you sent. Wish to thank you and some body is going to appreciate it as well.......thanks again man.

Swampman, ....the bow looks really good, think you did a great job, but have to say that unbraced profile shot is very sexy sir......
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DC on February 13, 2016, 03:28:50 pm
Swampman- When I imagine what a braced bow should look like I get an image just like your bow. I really like that. Kinda got Robin Hood written all over it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 13, 2016, 03:39:09 pm
Looks great swampman!! That's $ right there....that top fade has come around and the unbraced profile is lookin good too.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 13, 2016, 04:16:02 pm
That's a good looking bow swampman.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 13, 2016, 05:01:20 pm
Swampman, whoever gets that bow will be one happy archer. Very nice work.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 13, 2016, 05:17:26 pm
Thank you all for the nice comments.  The only thing I don't like about this bow is that I wanted a little more draw weight.  Like I said, I did make weight but barely.  It is a fun bow to shoot and I will enjoy shooting it some more.  now if I can make a better bow I could keep this one.   >:D >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 13, 2016, 06:07:01 pm
Mitch, that bow is really coming along great.  Keep it roll'in.

Swampman, your bow is looking like a winner too.  Nice work fellows.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PEARL DRUMS/PEARLY/PD/DRUMS on February 13, 2016, 07:06:01 pm
I used dry heat on the handle.  It was a little over 2 inches out of alignment and I am a little less than 1 inch out now.  It needs another heat to get it more in line.  I have never tried steam, only used dry heat.  Anyone have thoughts on dry heat vs steam?

Loope, I wouldn't worry about those knots until you have to. I'd guess the knot near the fade will be all but gone by the time it starts bending there and by the time you round those edges off good. Get it bending nice on the floor and then asses the knots again. As far as  steam vs. dry heat? If you need to make big lateral type move, like you do, I prefer steam. Just grab a stock pot and put 2" of water in the bottom. Get it just hot enough to rumble. Lay your troubled area over the pot, back up, and cover it with tin foil to catch all the steam. Give it about 35-40 minutes and make your bend within 30 seconds after you pull it off the heat. Let it sit over night and continue on your way.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 13, 2016, 07:27:15 pm
Thanks PD for the advice.  I will give it a go with the steam!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ranasp on February 13, 2016, 07:30:28 pm
I split off that chunk that wanted to go (fortunately it tapered off the further I went down the stave rather than digging into it) and debarked the entire thing.  I'll see if I can actually catch a ring tomorrow.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 13, 2016, 07:39:56 pm
Ranasp,    good for you....you must be livin right cause getting the bark to pop like that does not happen all the time >:D >:D Looking good so far.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ranasp on February 13, 2016, 08:03:08 pm
Really?  Lots of it was just peeling off when I pulled on it bare handed.  I'm willing to bet the ironwood will more than make up for how easy debarking was on the BL. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 13, 2016, 10:16:07 pm
Loope good luck with the big bend!
Mitch, doing a great job so far from the looks of the pics.
Swampman, classic looking bow with pretty tiller. Greaat work everyone!

I made a new tillering tree on the nearby shed outside today. It was zero F and blowing hard, so I did most of it in the house and then quickly screwed it to the shed siding with aa scrw gun. It was bitter cold with 30 mph gusts. I've been finishing up the old Plan A bow even though I'm not sending it out. It's a very nice bow, though 3 lbs under min weight. I also have been tillering the Plan B bow on the floor with a mirror. Been going slow on that. I'll switch to the new tiller tree when the arctic express leaves town! Oh, also was able to shoot the repaired Meare Heath bow yesterday. Looking forward to finishing that one off.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PEARL DRUMS/PEARLY/PD/DRUMS on February 14, 2016, 07:57:42 am
Black locust often times nearly falls off after a few years. Unlike osage, it just gets tighter and tighter and tighter. Like a boa.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 14, 2016, 09:00:51 am
Mr. B,
      Sounds like around here bud. Run out to the shed only as is absolutely necessary 8) Hope to have some more pics up today....both the heavy Iroquois and that osage sinewed 'nanner. Seems as most are just smokin along. This trade is just way cool.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 14, 2016, 09:40:51 am
Man..,...you guys are making me want to get shavings flying again but I'm stuck at work.

Have four days off starting tomorrow so hopefully I can get some shop time.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 14, 2016, 09:53:38 am
Turtle, I for one cant wait to see your stick bending, sir. That is going to be some bow.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 14, 2016, 09:58:06 am
Quick update, I bolted  the joint in my takedown with a single central bolt but the joint pulls open as the limb begins its bend around the bolt - only the one side, the one in tension, the compression side is good and tight.  I think I need to laminate a top piece onto the back of the one limb to turn the joint into a tenon joint so the bolt will pinch it shut instead f allowing it to flex open. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 14, 2016, 10:06:03 am
Rich, looking forward to those pics! Might have a couple pics today if I can get to it.

Went to minus 16 last night and breezy. The breeze was the problem. Froze the inside pressure pump, thawed that at midnight and put a clip-on light there, ran the water slow overnight, but not fast enough for the hot -- froze that pipe, thawed it this morning, put salt in the tub drain trap last night, that froze anyway. New backup kero furnace wasn't able to keep up overnight (piece of junk won't stay on high -- internal computer programmed not to!) -- 53 inside this morning, got the woodstove fired up good and temp is gradually rising -- up to 59 after 3 hours in some parts of the house, but it's sunny.  Drinkin coffee with most systems up again. High will be +6 today with a 25 below wind chill. Tuesday is supposed to be 42 and rain -- go figure!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on February 14, 2016, 10:22:07 am
Good grief. What part of hell do you live in?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 14, 2016, 10:28:44 am
PlanB....just about the same here, sir.....but we only hit -14. Sort of gives a clear meaning to "bitter cold", yes?  At this time of year we got a joke that goes " we live here why?" 8)

Stuck, With all the work you have in already I'm curious if you could consider a possible alternative? If you were to bind that grip with say 3/8 to 1/2 wide raw-hide strapping you couldn't move it even if you tried. Of course it would no longer be a take-down (at least not without a bunck of work). There are quite a few very heavy asiatic bows made like that and they were solid when found. Not trying to tell ya what to do....just maybe give you a possible option.
     Having said that, you have a plan and aint nothing wrong with "sticking to it".
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 14, 2016, 10:31:53 am
I was thinking about moving up north where it snows a little more so the kids would know what snow was. But I think I will change my mind after hearing planB's problem. Goon night you guys got it rough up there!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 14, 2016, 10:40:29 am
Rich my hat's off to you buddy with all the snow you have, too. Sleek, Vermont. But we have it easy here -- across the border in NH on Mount Washington it was 28 below zero yesterday with 88 mile an hour wind. Personally, I'd find that kinda irritating. I think it was last year they had one day where it was the second coldest spot on earth -- somewhere in Antarctica edged it out. And it was also hurricane force wind at the time, so wind chill was ridiculous. People stay in the observatory there all winter. Must be like living on the moon!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PEARL DRUMS/PEARLY/PD/DRUMS on February 14, 2016, 10:52:32 am
It's cold as...hell..? here to. I'm quite used to it, but this stuff will cut anybody if your not wrapped up tight. Add 15-20 mph winds and you're done fir.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 14, 2016, 10:55:00 am
Well dang, my hickory stave is giving me a hard time.  It had a crook in it so I laid out the profile so the crook would be in the small part of the handle.  I thought I would be able to straighten it easily.  I've steamed it three times to no avail......10 minutes, fifteen minutes and now 35 minutes.  I don't know whether to try steaming it 45 minutes or trying dry heat.  The last time I clamped it in a way to isolate the small part of the handle so it would bend there, but it didn't hold.  The section I'm trying to bend is 1" wide and 2" thick.  I'm afraid to make it thinner until I see exactly how I will need to do the final shaping.  I've never had this issue with hickory before.  Any thoughts?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 14, 2016, 10:56:51 am
PlanB....just about the same here, sir.....but we only hit -14. Sort of gives a clear meaning to "bitter cold", yes?  At this time of year we got a joke that goes " we live here why?" 8)

Stuck, With all the work you have in already I'm curious if you could consider a possible alternative? If you were to bind that grip with say 3/8 to 1/2 wide raw-hide strapping you couldn't move it even if you tried. Of course it would no longer be a take-down (at least not without a bunck of work). There are quite a few very heavy asiatic bows made like that and they were solid when found. Not trying to tell ya what to do....just maybe give you a possible option.
     Having said that, you have a plan and aint nothing wrong with "sticking to it".
rich

Trying to learn all I can about take-downs, else I would epoxy the thing back together and bind the handle really tight; once this bow has taught me all I need I can put it to one side and start the trade bow happy it'll go together properly.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 14, 2016, 11:09:48 am
Drewster,
      The problem might be trying to correct in too small of an area....ya know how hickory grain is >:D If the localized heat is the way you need to go then maybe dry dry heat. I dont have any experience with that but my understanding is that hick responds real well to dry heat.
      If the steam aint working then maybe take that bad-boy out behind the woodshed and let him talk to Mr. heatgun >:D >:D >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 14, 2016, 11:23:10 am
Well the old boatbuilding steam bent frame recommendation was 1 hr/inch thickness for steam, get it to the form in seconds, and then don't unclamp for a day. Allow for spring back in the form. And not all woods steam bend well. Also steam green wood. Too dry was problematic. If any of the above fits, maybe that's the cause.

I find rich's 5 minute steaming does work on black birch but in a thin limb section. Haven't tried a handle bend with that.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PEARL DRUMS/PEARLY/PD/DRUMS on February 14, 2016, 11:46:15 am
Drew, no less than a 45 minute steam for that job. It will move and stay put. Be sure steam is reaching at least 2-3" beyond the area you're wanting to bend.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Marc St Louis on February 14, 2016, 11:57:09 am
It's gone down to 37 below up here for 2 nights in a row now, the first night with brisk North winds.  Fortunately that's supposed to be the end of it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 14, 2016, 12:07:28 pm
Fellas,
    Here is some pics of a little sinewed yeller 'nanna....medium weight, highly reflexed, sinewed with deer and moose and a little snaky......wont post anymore on this one till it has all it's rawhide, snake skins, finished string etc........and yes it's quick.
    Enjoy the pics and I'll have more up today of the heavyweight Iroquois, think I got the tiller where it needs to be at this point....
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: burchett.donald on February 14, 2016, 12:26:02 pm
 Nice bend Rich 8)  Looks like a screamer :o
                                                                                                                Don
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 14, 2016, 12:32:58 pm
I had -2f this morning and thought that was cold. Glad I'm not as far north as some of you are.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 14, 2016, 12:42:55 pm
Got news for ya Turtle.....when it's minus anything and some wind it's cold bud, once ya get to popsicle stage your there 8) 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: willie on February 14, 2016, 12:58:10 pm
Rich -
that one nice bit of work there, like the reflex.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 14, 2016, 01:07:48 pm
Willie, for a bow a little over 50" that 6" of reflex with static tips is a real bugger to just get it to stay braced.....they got an annoying habit of trying to turn inside out. This one took some "persuasion" but finally cooperated. I string all mine with push pull and to do that with this guy ya need a strong grip till ya get the tips back some but then everything is real good.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: willie on February 14, 2016, 02:20:59 pm
Rich-
just out of curiosity, Have you seen any NA bows with double nocks or a tip shape that would enable the use of a stringer? (for those pesky highly reflexed designs)

willie
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on February 14, 2016, 02:30:37 pm
Here  is choice 3 I am working on, Elm, 66 ntn going for a elliptical tiller, have it out to 22". see any issues? Hammertime(http://i1221.photobucket.com/albums/dd464/jeffreyakolste/26e162f7-abb7-46f1-a4c4-8f697a7ecd0a_zps624ejang.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on February 14, 2016, 02:34:24 pm
This is an ELB style and I am not familiar with these so any input would be helpful but so far it seems to be making a nice bow-Hammertime
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 14, 2016, 02:36:13 pm
Willie, I have not seen any like that.....dont mean they were not used just that I have not seen any.

Hammertime,  Because of the pic angle I really cant say on the bottom limb, but the upper one could use some more bend in the outer half. So if they look the same to you (the bottom and top) then you may wish to get the outsides moving some. For what it's worth getting more bend in the outer half will really increase your draw length but will not have much effect of the overall draw weight.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on February 14, 2016, 02:45:40 pm
Ok Thanks Rich will do some scraping there-Hammertime
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 14, 2016, 03:38:17 pm
Rich that's a nice looking little yeller bow right there

Ajooter I got that raw hide on my little yeller static recurve today. That stuff is easy to work with

Been out for a hike 19 degrees carring a chainsaw and snowing about 2" hr. Well anyways cut a tree I've been wanting for a year. Got 3 6' percimon logs about 12" through. I'm stocking my depleted stave pile this year regardless. I have to have more bow wood. Now I have t snake those logs out that will be the fun part.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 14, 2016, 04:03:58 pm
Dang Rich, how many bows have u made since this trade has started. Every other page has u and a new bow. Your a machine, my man.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 14, 2016, 04:07:28 pm
I've put a decent amount of work into the rock elm pyramid. I realized I should stop for a couple pics before I continued. I flipped the tips a tad and I put a single layer of sinew/hide glue for protection after I was happy with the floor tiller. A friend finally found this fabric they'd been hunting for. I'd asked if she could find me some natural looking snakeskin. She came through. I airbrushed some detail and some darker shadow. The original print looked faded. It was definitely less work than painting a pattern from scratch. The fabric went on with TB3 after the sinew was dry. I'll be putting a highlight color into the skin next. Then tiller tree. 
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/100_2805_zps4grbe199.jpg) 
(http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m509/dakota_kid1/100_2806_zpseenngrgd.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 14, 2016, 04:14:49 pm
Dang Gutshot, you a glutton for punishment aint ya? That persimmon is some darned heavy wood.

Stix.....only 4 if you count Ms. Laurens and I did not make the 'nanner, just tillering for a fellow member. But I did have to call some friends for advice on how to whoop on that thing cause it was skinning me up pretty good at the beginning.  8) 8) 8)

Man Kid, thats lookin real fine right there, cant hardly wait to see her when she's all slicked up. All these bows sneekin up on being done... got to love that cause we gettin to the eye candy part.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 14, 2016, 05:05:00 pm
That Iroquois style bow is really nice, Rich! That's gonna make someone happy.
Super looking job Dakota!
I only tillered indoors today, no photos, just slow going. Bow is low braced.
Turtle, Pearl Marc, cold is cold, but okay because of the beauty we get in a couple months. Hate the wind, though, when it is.
Hammer, I'm with Rich -- bottom bending nicely.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 14, 2016, 06:46:31 pm
Ok I said I would post pics this weekend of my progress Ontario forward handle Osage with natural tip overlays. This joker has had slot of hrs put into it so far and needs lots more. I might be lucky to get it done by this time next year. Well any ways here it is
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 14, 2016, 06:49:18 pm
Lots of great progress fellas...nice little bow rich...glad that hide worked for ya gut....I have tomorrow off so I'll be getting into it for sure...had some misfortune aligning my tips...I forgot to pad on the side of the limb and it dented pretty badly...I'll clean it up and see what happens.  I want this bow to be as purdy as it can when I'm done with it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 14, 2016, 06:49:51 pm
More pics
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 14, 2016, 06:51:46 pm
This is an ELB style and I am not familiar with these so any input would be helpful but so far it seems to be making a nice bow-Hammertime

Coming right out of that upper fade it looks like it's a pretty stiff those first couple inches...but like the other said...get the tips coming around first and you'll make your way to the fades.  Just gotta be careful not to create a hinge early on near the fade area. 

What kind of wood is it again ?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 14, 2016, 06:59:07 pm
Gutshot,  that yella bow looks outstanding sir.....after all your hard work already I cant believe that tillering is going to be an issue at all ::) ::)

PlanB, hell man with the easy day and night you had you ought to be just cruising, ya right >:D

Ajooter, dont think it's anything you cant handle
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: burchett.donald on February 14, 2016, 07:39:06 pm
 Gutshot,
               I'm really liking the looks of that yellow character bow you got going on... 8)  You take your good old time around them fades when you get there...
                                                                                                                                   Don
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 14, 2016, 08:04:50 pm
Super nice!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 14, 2016, 08:06:39 pm
Gutshot,
               I'm really liking the looks of that yellow character bow you got going on... 8)  You take your good old time around them fades when you get there...
                                                                                                                                   Don

Will do Donald. If you have any advice I will take all I can get. Never done anything like it
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: JonW on February 14, 2016, 08:36:11 pm
Rich looks like ya got that little bow whooped pretty good.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 14, 2016, 08:44:17 pm
Absolutely Jon.....amazing what happens when a fella gets a ton of good advice ;) Thank you my friend.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 14, 2016, 10:02:22 pm
You haven't seen or heard from me much in the last few days. Two of my sisters visited traveling  from Torrington, WY and Aurora, CO. We had a great time and don't get the chance to do it often enough. Anyway I'm back> You are doing a fantastic job of getting things done helping each other.

Especially wish to thank Rich for staying on top of everything going on but all of you guys are doing fantastic. Your motivation is catching.

As stated in an earlier post, the first incentive drawing was held tonight and we have 3 winners.

#1 Ty_in_ND  Choice of 10" Ochsenkopf draw knife
                      #49 Nicholson pattern makers rasp or
                       Aged osage stave donated by JonW

#2 Sidmand   Defer to above after Tyler's choice.

#3 Drewster  JWHalverson's black hills gold ( pure honey and beeswax)

Congratulations to all of you. We will have another drawing next Sunday evening for 3 more donated items. Keep up the spirit!!!! >>-----> Fred
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 14, 2016, 10:07:23 pm
Congrats to Ty, Sidman and Drewster on winning. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 14, 2016, 10:41:09 pm
Oh COOL.  I love good honey.  Thanks Fred for all you're doing with this trade.  Best one I've ever been involved in.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 14, 2016, 11:12:23 pm
Love the drawings idea - Thanks Fred and to all who donated!  Congrats to those drawn you lucky rascals.

Swampman - I am liking the looks of that BL!

Ranasp - looks like that stave split just fine to me.  glad the bark came off easy.

Rich - that full draw looks great on that little bow - well done sir!

Hammer - that elm is looking good - starting to bend like it is supposed to.  Rich has good advice on the outers.

DKid - the snake pattern looks good - bet it will look really good all finished up!

Gutshot - I think you have more patience than me - the osage is coming along nicely!  Lots of work in that one.

No time to work on my bow today.  Maybe some evening this week???

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 15, 2016, 01:37:27 am
Rich, that is one seriously fine lookin tiller on that banana  :o

Gut, what you gonna call that one? The 18 rings of Hades?

Yeah, I agree the drawing is an outstanding idea-congrats you lucky dogs!

JW, what would it take to get that honey??

Just too many cool things goin on to comment on all.

Keep it going fellas!!  8)

And I did get some work done but have to get around to some pics.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 15, 2016, 07:30:52 am
Congrats to the drawing winners....makes the trade that much sweeter....I'll be getting something done today for sure!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ty_in_ND on February 15, 2016, 09:03:54 am
You haven't seen or heard from me much in the last few days. Two of my sisters visited traveling  from Torrington, WY and Aurora, CO. We had a great time and don't get the chance to do it often enough. Anyway I'm back> You are doing a fantastic job of getting things done helping each other.

Especially wish to thank Rich for staying on top of everything going on but all of you guys are doing fantastic. Your motivation is catching.

As stated in an earlier post, the first incentive drawing was held tonight and we have 3 winners.

#1 Ty_in_ND  Choice of 10" Ochsenkopf draw knife
                      #49 Nicholson pattern makers rasp or
                       Aged osage stave donated by JonW

#2 Sidmand   Defer to above after Tyler's choice.

#3 Drewster  JWHalverson's black hills gold ( pure honey and beeswax)

Congratulations to all of you. We will have another drawing next Sunday evening for 3 more donated items. Keep up the spirit!!!! >>-----> Fred

Well, for starters, I hope the visit with your sisters was good!  I'm lucky enough that my siblings will pretty close to me, so we don't go long stretches without weeing each other. 

As far as winning the drawing... all I can say is I'm humbled that I was even entered in, let alone to win something.

As for the bow, it's on to plan B for me.  I was looking at the cuts for the splice and thought "they're so close to being perfect, I can work on them just a touch more...".  I know, famous last words!  Anyway, the boards aren't ruined at all, but if I were to cut new splices, I would be left with a length of wood that would be a little on the short side for me to comfortably make a bow for my guy's stats.  I'll be trimming some more osage slats I have to size tonight!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 15, 2016, 09:04:59 am

Gut, what you gonna call that one? The 18 rings of Hades?


Dubois, probably name it the death of Me!

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 15, 2016, 09:11:44 am
Congrats to the winners and to everyone workin their a&$#s off on this trade.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PEARL DRUMS/PEARLY/PD/DRUMS on February 15, 2016, 09:18:52 am
Here  is choice 3 I am working on, Elm, 66 ntn going for a elliptical tiller, have it out to 22". see any issues? Hammertime(http://i1221.photobucket.com/albums/dd464/jeffreyakolste/26e162f7-abb7-46f1-a4c4-8f697a7ecd0a_zps624ejang.jpg)

You have a hinge off the fade in the upper. Past that hinge is dead flat. The bottom is flat from fade to tip. You need ALOT more even bending on those limbs. Use a straight edge or gizmo. I'm guessing you will need at least 10-15# to get anywhere near your desired tiller. My red lines show your flat spots. Pretty easy to them when made red.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on February 15, 2016, 09:32:36 am
Wow, I am well and truly blessed!  Thank you all so much!  Fred I will PM you this evening after work once Ty makes his choice, OK?

I didn't even get to touch my bow this weekend, my twins were born 10 years ago on Valentines day, so this weekend was all about them and the missus.  I did check my stave, it's still has some drying to do apparently.  I cut a bit off one of the ends to get it down to my chosen length, and it started checking cause I forgot to seal it.  I resealed the whole end with some titebond in hopes it stops, I think it will be fine cause it's right on the end and off to the side of where the actual limb tip will be.

I got to start chasing rings on plan b next while plan a keeps drying.  That's the next step.

You haven't seen or heard from me much in the last few days. Two of my sisters visited traveling  from Torrington, WY and Aurora, CO. We had a great time and don't get the chance to do it often enough. Anyway I'm back> You are doing a fantastic job of getting things done helping each other.

Especially wish to thank Rich for staying on top of everything going on but all of you guys are doing fantastic. Your motivation is catching.

As stated in an earlier post, the first incentive drawing was held tonight and we have 3 winners.

#1 Ty_in_ND  Choice of 10" Ochsenkopf draw knife
                      #49 Nicholson pattern makers rasp or
                       Aged osage stave donated by JonW

#2 Sidmand   Defer to above after Tyler's choice.

#3 Drewster  JWHalverson's black hills gold ( pure honey and beeswax)

Congratulations to all of you. We will have another drawing next Sunday evening for 3 more donated items. Keep up the spirit!!!! >>-----> Fred

Well, for starters, I hope the visit with your sisters was good!  I'm lucky enough that my siblings will pretty close to me, so we don't go long stretches without weeing each other. 

As far as winning the drawing... all I can say is I'm humbled that I was even entered in, let alone to win something.

As for the bow, it's on to plan B for me.  I was looking at the cuts for the splice and thought "they're so close to being perfect, I can work on them just a touch more...".  I know, famous last words!  Anyway, the boards aren't ruined at all, but if I were to cut new splices, I would be left with a length of wood that would be a little on the short side for me to comfortably make a bow for my guy's stats.  I'll be trimming some more osage slats I have to size tonight!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 15, 2016, 11:18:24 am
Got some work on the 1st choice osage 62". Thought I'd try something new to me and deflex handle and add reflex to tips. Putting faith in this one so I added tip overlays of inner bison horn bone and a little bison horn on top. Start tillering later this week!

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 15, 2016, 11:19:41 am
Also one of my inside tiller horse. I like it cause I can get up and walk around it and get different angles and look down from t-t
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 15, 2016, 11:20:28 am
Lookin great dubois...like those overlays.  Can't wait to see it bending!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 15, 2016, 11:38:15 am
Like that design Marco. That should be a quick little bow. I need your tiller horse design so I can adapt it to a shaving horse.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Tower on February 15, 2016, 12:28:31 pm
I finally found a lil time to work an Osage stave I had.  Here are a few pics.  I will start posting more as I finish it.
(http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y506/Dontower/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-01/F060AB09-0B13-42E9-8BE1-27FCCD2F186F_zpswgaqbr3u.jpg) (http://s1278.photobucket.com/user/Dontower/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-01/F060AB09-0B13-42E9-8BE1-27FCCD2F186F_zpswgaqbr3u.jpg.html)
(http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y506/Dontower/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-01/3E5CABDA-734F-4B18-B460-3263464C820F_zpscohfuhvj.jpg) (http://s1278.photobucket.com/user/Dontower/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-01/3E5CABDA-734F-4B18-B460-3263464C820F_zpscohfuhvj.jpg.html)
(http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y506/Dontower/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-01/7ED64B49-47A4-483C-BF2C-13EEDC0CF2E4_zps2zcyq9eu.jpg) (http://s1278.photobucket.com/user/Dontower/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-01/7ED64B49-47A4-483C-BF2C-13EEDC0CF2E4_zps2zcyq9eu.jpg.html)
(http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y506/Dontower/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-01/30134931-024F-4587-8871-A6EAE3155008_zpsdeyxwv0e.jpg) (http://s1278.photobucket.com/user/Dontower/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-01/30134931-024F-4587-8871-A6EAE3155008_zpsdeyxwv0e.jpg.html)
(http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y506/Dontower/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-01/936AED47-D018-4B82-B833-C8A84C4D6CAE_zpstvojlszj.jpg) (http://s1278.photobucket.com/user/Dontower/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-01/936AED47-D018-4B82-B833-C8A84C4D6CAE_zpstvojlszj.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 15, 2016, 12:35:30 pm
Tower, that's a great looking stave.  Looks like you've been doing some knapping too :-)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 15, 2016, 12:39:00 pm
That's looking good Don. Nice stave to work with.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 15, 2016, 12:39:33 pm
Marco that's a good looking profile on that bow. Should be a screamer
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 15, 2016, 12:42:21 pm
Tower that s one straight stave right there. Possibilities unlimited.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 15, 2016, 12:55:29 pm
Made it to the shop today and got a little tillering done. Have it at top of my victims weght at bottom of his draw range. Put around 70 arrows through it and am realy liking it. Was  tearing up the bullseye at 8 yards in my shop. :)
Just need to shoot it more and stretch the draw length out a bit. Will try to get a draw pic sometime today.

(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160215_113334739.jpg)(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160215_114827019.jpg)(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160215_114800190.jpg)(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160215_114926798.jpg)(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160215_114904274.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 15, 2016, 01:15:27 pm
Between tillering sessions on the plan B bow, I was able to get a weight with new tree and digital scale, and shoot a few arrows out of the older plan A bow. Now seems to have made it to the bottom of my guy's range in weight. I'll probably send the plan B bow out because I hope it will be even better and more interesting. But this one is a sweet, fast shooter as-is. Weighs 14 oz, 60" overall.

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowA4.jpg)
(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowA1.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 15, 2016, 01:21:44 pm
I haven't seen a bow on here that I wouldn't like to have. I admire you guys that are working on a second bow. Keep them coming.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: pincushin on February 15, 2016, 01:46:10 pm
i love what I'm seeing guys this is great
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 15, 2016, 02:17:48 pm
Tower that is one straight stave!!
Turtle....that's getting it done!  I'm pretty good at 8 yards myself.
B...that first bow came out nice...like that color.

I took a break from the trade bow today.  Got an hhb branch I've been wddling down.  It's only 48" and just some practice material.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 15, 2016, 02:44:42 pm
I have the day off of work today but decided to make black cap jelly instead.  I have had a bucket of wild black caps in the freezer since last summer.  Waiting for it to cool now.  I did get a little bit of work on my plan b bow.  It is close to floor tillerred.  I chose my white birch stave to work on.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 15, 2016, 03:17:23 pm
Man...blackcap jelly sounds awful good right now!  Here's that little piece of hhb I was working on.  Got a lot twist to take out but i think it will make a bow.

(http://i.imgur.com/G3k2AME.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 15, 2016, 03:21:24 pm
Ajooter that looks sweet man!  Congrats to all the winners. And all these bows are looking sweet.
I really need to get on deck and get some tillering done. Great job everyone
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 15, 2016, 03:23:46 pm
Plan B that a sweet looking bow you got finished out there
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 15, 2016, 03:27:54 pm
Turtle, lookin good. Plan B, both look awesome. Tower, great start. Finally did some bendin today after steamin my tips last week. Low brace of 5", tillered out to 19". Gonna be under weight. So tempering belly.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 15, 2016, 04:51:29 pm
Just catching up  now! :o

Congratulations to the winners!

DuBois, I really like that profile!  :)

Tower, man, you're starting out with a bang!

Turtle, looking good, and on target with that snakey stave!

Ajooter, nice looking set of curves! :)

Swampman, looking forward to seeing another birch bow taking shape!

Gutshot, stixnstones, ajooter, thank you kindly!

Fred +1!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 15, 2016, 08:06:51 pm
Times like these a bandsaw would be nice...hatchet...ferries rasp and 45 minutes.  This will be plan b....hopefully get it reduced and then start getting that twist out and the tips in line.

(http://i.imgur.com/HLEjnYl.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 15, 2016, 08:46:59 pm
Going to start working on my plan b tomorrow but it had a knot tear out that worries me. It will still make a bow but not sure if I can get it to spec. So I dug out a set of flowering dogwood billets and will try to get them roughed out tomorrow and set em aside to dry for a while inside. They will be plan c.

(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/20160215_203033.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 15, 2016, 09:31:52 pm
After eating some black cap jelly on toast I got some energy and did some more work on my birch stave.  I reduced the belly down a lot more and roughed out the handle.  I worked up a good sweat working with my rasp.  It is just starting to flex a little now.  Next I need to take out some natural deflex on one limb tip.  Then I need to move the handle for good string alignment and then take out some prop twist.  I plan to use steam for all of this. 

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/E3ED5717-5133-42B4-87F2-FF83301196A5_zpsefocwm4i.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/E3ED5717-5133-42B4-87F2-FF83301196A5_zpsefocwm4i.jpg.html)

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/891F7ABB-FE38-48B8-B51A-46DE959907E8_zpsgusngjx8.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/891F7ABB-FE38-48B8-B51A-46DE959907E8_zpsgusngjx8.jpg.html)

(http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t475/Mrpdap/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/034BD492-8515-4210-B18B-5630A3D1AF7D_zpslrxa3fh4.jpg) (http://s1061.photobucket.com/user/Mrpdap/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/034BD492-8515-4210-B18B-5630A3D1AF7D_zpslrxa3fh4.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Blaflair2 on February 15, 2016, 09:39:37 pm
It's single digits without the windchill, so no wood chips flying over her lately
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 15, 2016, 10:45:47 pm
Everyone's bows are looking great!

I steamed the redbud and got it on the caul yesterday.  I just pulled it off to check and it is better, but still needs another adjustment.  I found out during the steaming that I need a better clamp.  My C-clamp was too small to fit so I thought I would go ahead with a bar type quick-clamp, but just couldn't generate much force.  Need to get a better clamp and try again.

While waiting, I started debarking a clean dogwood stave and plan to work on it during breaks... just in case....
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 16, 2016, 09:54:33 am
ttt
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 16, 2016, 10:58:45 am
ttt

Dubois ??? What's ttt.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 16, 2016, 11:09:55 am
Gutshot,  means "to the top"....a way to move the thread back up the list.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 16, 2016, 11:29:34 am
Oh not up on all the fancy terms
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ranasp on February 16, 2016, 11:36:30 am
I have a question about ring chasing.  I'm removing the sapwood from my Black Locust, and there's parts where I'm getting to the heartwood but right next to it the sapwood dips down into it.  Do I just keep peeling away until I've gotten rid of the heartwood, even though I'm going to make the heartwood ring thinner?  This is a big fat heartwood ring so I'd be removing a good chunk of wood if I have to go down to the next ring.  Which is worse?  A compromised ring or less material to work with, or is it even an issue as long as other rings aren't peeking through?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Josh B on February 16, 2016, 11:50:41 am
Do you have pics?  If the ring in question is the first heartwood ring, then that's normal.  It's the transition ring and it may well have some sapwood colored wood marbled in with the darker wood.  Doesn't hurt a thing and I find it quite aesthetically pleasing.  Some people refer to it as creamsickle. You want to maintain the integrity of the ring.  If you dip down into it trying to get under the lighter wood, you will still be violating the grain even if you don't go all the way through to the next ring.  I hope that helps.  Josh
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 16, 2016, 01:30:10 pm
2X what Gun Doc said.  If the ring you're chasing has valleys and ridges, use a gooseneck scraper to follow the contour more easily and leave all the thickness of the ring that you can.  Tree rings definitely do not grow symmetrically concentric as you are seeing.   
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 16, 2016, 01:36:07 pm
A most ornery hickory stave.  Per a previous post, I've been having a hard time getting the crook out of my stave at the handle.  SO, I steamed that bad girl for over an hour Sunday afternoon and clamped it up until this morning.  Five minutes after I unclamped her, she moved back to the original crook.  DANG IT.  I drug out the heat gun and greased up the area that needs to bend with Crisco.  Heated that baby for 15 minutes and tied her off.  Well see what happens this time.  If this doesn't work, guess I'll have to start on Plan B.......never had this kind of problem getting hickory to bend.

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Bend%20Handle%20Bend_zpsxfimupyo.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Bend%20Handle%20Bend_zpsxfimupyo.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 16, 2016, 02:12:37 pm
I'm surprised it didn't hold drewster....thats how I handle all my hickory.  Maybe you could try steaming it again and after its clamped in the position you want it you can hit it with the heat gun to try and cement that position into shape.

Is it a well seasoned piece of wood?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 16, 2016, 02:14:29 pm
I have a question about ring chasing.  I'm removing the sapwood from my Black Locust, and there's parts where I'm getting to the heartwood but right next to it the sapwood dips down into it.  Do I just keep peeling away until I've gotten rid of the heartwood, even though I'm going to make the heartwood ring thinner?  This is a big fat heartwood ring so I'd be removing a good chunk of wood if I have to go down to the next ring.  Which is worse?  A compromised ring or less material to work with, or is it even an issue as long as other rings aren't peeking through?

I have wondered if using an iron and steaming the suface of the stave would help separate the sapwood and or cambium from staves cut later in the year?  Anybody try this?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DC on February 16, 2016, 02:20:28 pm
A most ornery hickory stave.  Per a previous post, I've been having a hard time getting the crook out of my stave at the handle.  SO, I steamed that bad girl for over an hour Sunday afternoon and clamped it up until this morning.  Five minutes after I unclamped her, she moved back to the original crook.  DANG IT.  I drug out the heat gun and greased up the area that needs to bend with Crisco.  Heated that baby for 15 minutes and tied her off.  Well see what happens this time.  If this doesn't work, guess I'll have to start on Plan B.......never had this kind of problem getting hickory to bend.

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Bend%20Handle%20Bend_zpsxfimupyo.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Bend%20Handle%20Bend_zpsxfimupyo.jpg.html)

How much are you trying to bend it? Like how much did you move it where the string is tied? Did you heat it where the brown ares is? All I'm thinking is if you're not trying to move it much and you heated it where the brown is, maybe the two thin sections of the handle are absorbing all the movement. If you follow me that's all I got :D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: bubby on February 16, 2016, 02:27:46 pm
If all else fails i have cut an angled slot then steam it or use dry heat and drive a wedge in gently, then after it sets pop the wedge out, coat in epoxy and re install, do this where the cut will be covered by the grip wrap
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Ranasp on February 16, 2016, 03:19:03 pm
So far it seems to be close to the end of the stave, I haven't stripped all the sapwood off the rest of it yet.  I'll get to work on that and see if it keeps happening, here's a close up and a view further back with a dotted line showing the sapwood.

Never having done this before I'm a bit nervous about how far is too far.  I think I've figured out what the "pithy" areas are talked about in Clay Hayes' videos, but is it a dealbreaker if you end up going past it?  The outermost ring is well over 1/4" thick (at least at the very end of the staff, I doubt it's consistent all the way through). 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 16, 2016, 03:53:56 pm
Ranasp,
      Usually when the majority of sapwood has been removed if any is left it will more than likely "pop" durning the floor bending or at least by the time you reack brace height......other than the fact that the "tick" when it does will scare the bejesus out of you it really is not much of an issue.
    While I have no direct experience with Locust the condition I described above happens frequently on Creep Myrtle, and some of the woods like service berry, choke cherry etc.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: bubby on February 16, 2016, 04:17:48 pm
What i do is get close with a drawknife and then use a scraper to clean up the back before continuing, is that stave cut close to bow dimensions if not go ahead and get that done no sense getting a clean back on wood that gets removed
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 16, 2016, 04:22:38 pm
I'm surprised it didn't hold drewster....thats how I handle all my hickory.  Maybe you could try steaming it again and after its clamped in the position you want it you can hit it with the heat gun to try and cement that position into shape.

Is it a well seasoned piece of wood?

Yeah, after steaming it for about 70 minutes, I'm surprised it didn't hold either.  Never had hickory to act this stubborn.  It's pretty well seasoned.  It was harvested from a road widening project almost a year ago.  I roughed out the stave and it's been in my shop that long.  I've also had it in my hot box for the past three weeks.

Thanks for your idea of steaming and heating.  When I unclamp it in the morning, I will try that if it doesn't hold.  I'll figure out SOME WAY to beat this stick of wood ;-)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 16, 2016, 04:36:23 pm
DC, I need the tip to move about an inch to get everything to line up.  The brown area is where I put the Crisco so the wood wouldn't scorch.  I heated about a 6" section......top, bottom & sides.  It was way to hot to hold your finger on.  The way it's tied moved the limb past where it needs to be so I'm hoping this will work.  If not, I'll try something else.

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Bend%20Handle%20Bend%20II_zps6eixj4bq.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Bend%20Handle%20Bend%20II_zps6eixj4bq.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 16, 2016, 04:38:56 pm
If all else fails i have cut an angled slot then steam it or use dry heat and drive a wedge in gently, then after it sets pop the wedge out, coat in epoxy and re install, do this where the cut will be covered by the grip wrap

That's a solution I've never done.  Thanks for the idea Buddy.  If all else fails, I'll do that. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DC on February 16, 2016, 04:54:07 pm
Has it moved at all?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 16, 2016, 05:14:04 pm
Has it moved at all?

Not enough that I can tell.  So far, it has returned to it original shape.  OH, maybe it's rubber wood instead of shagbark hickory :-)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: bubby on February 16, 2016, 05:36:10 pm
http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,37617.msg535506.html#msg535506
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 16, 2016, 05:40:54 pm
Little bit of a problem...I was going to try and just narrow the limb width down right at the knot or employ a torges patch.   What do you guys think?  I think I have enough limb width since I left it a little wider in this partocular location.

(http://i.imgur.com/GrJLpzR.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/jed80Tw.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 16, 2016, 06:52:23 pm
ajooter,
      Is that Ironwood?  If so and you narrow the width to get even with that knot there should be no more trouble. I've made bows to the mid 50 # having regular knots sawed right through the middle of the knot. When you get right down near final width check the pin and make sure the fracture is not toward the middle as well (right now it looks to be only on the outside edge).
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 16, 2016, 06:54:59 pm
It's actually hickory rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 16, 2016, 07:18:58 pm
Ajooter,
     Here's a thought, sir. Make a scalloped bow....put them on that side and make sure that when you lay out the scallops have that knot be the bottom of one of them. That should get rid of it.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 16, 2016, 07:38:18 pm
Am getting my plan a real close. Its right at victims max weight at middle of draw length. Am aiming for max weight at max length so going real slow at this point. Lots of exercising and shooting in between minor scraping. Worked on plan b a little and decided that getting it to my victims specs might be asking too much out of this stave so decided to save it for a bow I have in mind for my brother in law. Roughed out my plan c dogwood billets, but need to let them rest inside to dry for a little while before I go any farther with them. Will let them set inside for a few days and then put them in my hot box. Sometimes dogwood doesnt like to give up that last little bit of moisture. Will try to get a draw pic of plan a tomorrow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 16, 2016, 07:46:14 pm
Did some heat treatin tonite. Never done any temperin before so its just a lite toastin. Any advise is greatly appreciated.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 16, 2016, 07:54:04 pm
That is a great idea rich...thank you! Gonna get on that tonight fellas.  >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 16, 2016, 07:55:36 pm
Did some heat treatin tonite. Never done any temperin before so its just a lite toastin. Any advise is greatly appreciated.

Looking good stix but try to keep a even color on that heat treating
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 16, 2016, 08:03:25 pm
Thanx, Gutshot. Would it hurt if i go back tomorrow and even it out?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 16, 2016, 08:47:24 pm
Simson has done a lot of ammonia fuming to make some beautiful color, but I have also read it can also be used for putting some severe bends into wood, much more than could be accomplished with steam.  Has anyone tried ammonia for stubborn bends?  But I do like the idea to cut a slot and use a wedge, not quite as toxic :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: dylanholderman on February 16, 2016, 08:58:21 pm
got some work done on my yew stick tonight ;D

got it to a light floor tiller and then used steam to even out the reflex :)
(http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w411/dylanholderman/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/3896E158-7217-4F71-A4C1-849EC10252D9.jpg) (http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/dylanholderman/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/3896E158-7217-4F71-A4C1-849EC10252D9.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 16, 2016, 09:15:52 pm
Scalloped both limbs.  I like the way it came out and my nice even bend is still there.  Im going to rawhide back the bow soon and then heat treat/add reflex to both limbs.

On a different note if the bow ends up failing at least I know my gf found a winning recipe in a cauliflower pizza with Italian sausage and ricotta.

(http://i.imgur.com/5WbtiaQ.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/xEzLl9T.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/61qLUn3.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 16, 2016, 09:23:36 pm
Looking good ajooter. You should do your heat treating/reflexing BEFORE you rawhide back so that the heat doesnt cause the glue to let go.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 16, 2016, 09:26:35 pm
+1 what Turtle said
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 16, 2016, 09:40:02 pm
Ajooter those scallops look good.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 16, 2016, 09:43:47 pm
Simson has done a lot of ammonia fuming to make some beautiful color, but I have also read it can also be used for putting some severe bends into wood, much more than could be accomplished with steam.  Has anyone tried ammonia for stubborn bends?  But I do like the idea to cut a slot and use a wedge, not quite as toxic :)

Loope just glued my tip overlays on tonight I will shape them up tomorrow then I have 2 bows I'm going to fume a BL the trade bow and a small static recurve Osage that I'm making for the moontree gathering I will take before and after pics.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 16, 2016, 09:45:11 pm
Be honest guys I've always done it after...and never had a problem.  But thinking about it now it makes sense to do it the other way.


Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 16, 2016, 09:53:00 pm
Damn , that pizza looks gooood!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 16, 2016, 09:58:07 pm
Ajooter,

I thought I was going to be looking at pictures of bows.  Now I am hungry. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 16, 2016, 10:11:03 pm
still tillering......

want pizza.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 16, 2016, 10:22:57 pm
got some work done on my yew stick tonight ;D

got it to a light floor tiller and then used steam to even out the reflex :)
(http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w411/dylanholderman/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/3896E158-7217-4F71-A4C1-849EC10252D9.jpg) (http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/dylanholderman/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2016-02/3896E158-7217-4F71-A4C1-849EC10252D9.jpg.html)

Some you guys are getting creative on how your steaming. I mean all I can say is your'll wife's must be gone shopping. I've got a good wife and all but that's where she would lay the law down.  So my 10$ Coleman stove from a yard sale keeps everybody happy in our kitchen. Keep up the good work
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 16, 2016, 10:29:34 pm
Bless her heart, my wife tolerates me doing a little steaming in her kitchen.......as long as I clean up my mess  :-)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: dylanholderman on February 16, 2016, 10:32:25 pm


Some you guys are getting creative on how your steaming. I mean all I can say is your'll wife's must be gone shopping. I've got a good wife and all but that's where she would lay the law down.  So my 10$ Coleman stove from a yard sale keeps everybody happy in our kitchen. Keep up the good work
[/quote]

lol ;D in my case its a mom and i went out and bought a tea kettle from a thrift store for my steam bending ;)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Knoll on February 16, 2016, 10:41:46 pm
If all else fails i have cut an angled slot then steam it or use dry heat and drive a wedge in gently, then after it sets pop the wedge out, coat in epoxy and re install, do this where the cut will be covered by the grip wrap

clever, Mr Bub!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 16, 2016, 11:08:23 pm
Was able to do a little tillering tonight.  Have it braced to about 5 1/2" or so.  Pulling to 18".  Pulling from 1 1/4" above center (right limb will be the top limb).

The limbs are currently about 1/2" or so in thickness and about 1 3/4" wide.

Hackberry - parallel to about mid limb then tapering to tips. 66" ntn.
Pics are at current brace, pulling to 18", and then immediately after brace.  Sorry for the blurry one.

Have a couple of questions:  How is the bend looking?  How "thin" can you make the limbs?  Should I narrow them at this point to reduce some weight or continue to remove from the belly?

Thanks.

Mitch



Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 16, 2016, 11:17:55 pm
mwosborn, to my amateur eyes, it looks like the left limb is slightly stiffer than the right and that the outer 1/3 of each limb looks a little stiff.  Hopefully more experienced comments than mine will come in :)

I got some new C-clamps large enough to fit my caul, re-steamed the redbud, and clamped it.  Was able to get the movement this time.  Will see tomorrow how it looks when it comes off the caul.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 16, 2016, 11:40:05 pm
Mitch, I agree with Loope's assessment.  The outer limbs need your attention, but looking good at this point.  There isn't any set thickness that the limbs need to be.  Keep thinning them until you get the bending you need and keep exercising a lot between wood removal.

I haven't worked with hackberry, but the TBB suggests limb width at 1 7/8".  I would just keep thinning them and leave the width you have.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: lebhuntfish on February 17, 2016, 12:11:37 am
+1, on what drewster said.  And I would get it to your full brace height before I go any further. Also, remember that your handle thickness is a good bit more than what it will be once it's shaped. You need to take that into account when setting your final brace height.

Patrick
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PEARL DRUMS/PEARLY/PD/DRUMS on February 17, 2016, 10:12:38 am
Mitch that right limb looks dead nutz. The left limb is stiff off the fade.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 17, 2016, 01:38:14 pm
Pearl Drums, Since Mitch has done this, centered or off centered bow on tree is something I'm confused about....

When you personally tiller your own bows, and assuming the limbs are the same length, do you offset the bow where it sets on a tree, and also offset where the tillering string attaches. Or do you personally center the bow, and string? Or is there some other way you do it? And if you don't make the limbs the same length, how do you set it in the tree?

I know different people do this different ways, and have different ways they favor, I was just wanting to know your way that you handle it.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 17, 2016, 01:47:05 pm
spent a couple of hours in the 'shop and now my 2-piece take-down is a 3-piece, hope to post photos tomorrow
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PEARL DRUMS/PEARLY/PD/DRUMS on February 17, 2016, 01:54:29 pm
Pearl Drums, Since Mitch has done this, centered or off centered bow on tree is something I'm confused about....

When you personally tiller your own bows, and assuming the limbs are the same length, do you offset the bow where it sets on a tree, and also offset where the tillering string attaches. Or do you personally center the bow, and string? Or is there some other way you do it? And if you don't make the limbs the same length, how do you set it in the tree?

I know different people do this different ways, and have different ways they favor, I was just wanting to know your way that you handle it.



I do mine much differently than most. I have a 1 x 4 stick in a vice with grooves cut in for the string. Once the bow is at low brace after a good floor tiller I toss it up on my stick, on center. I get the limbs bending evenly and matched out to maybe 18-20" max. Then I do the rest by hand and feel. I don't use a tree at all, except for checking draw weight. Regardless of whether a guy centers it, offsets it or any other style, a flat spot is a flat spot. It will be there no matter where the handle is positioned on the block. Obtaining balance in the bow hand has to be done in hand, or on a tree holding the bow the same place your hand would. Unbalanced bows are easy to see in pictures and especially easy to feel in hand.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 17, 2016, 03:10:47 pm
Thanks Pearl Drums, that's very helpful to me.

Is there a different tillering balance for a bow for a person who holds a bow more toward the top of the hand between the thumb and index finger with a more open hand than one who holds the grip hitting mainly lower in the hand?

If I send a bow in a trade is it possible it seems balanced for me but not somebody else because I don't know how they hold it? (I'm right at the point in tillering now and starting to shoot it where this is something I would like to understand.)

Thanks again for answering these questions.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 17, 2016, 03:42:58 pm
Haven't been able to get a pic while drawing so took one on the tree. I'm about 3 pounds over and an inch short of draw in the pic. It feels close in my hand but just slightly off. That wonky limb is giving my eyes fits.
What do you guys see?



(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160217_151300496.jpg)(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160217_150949303.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 17, 2016, 04:11:13 pm
Turtle. Your upper limthe fade out the the bump in the limb looks flat to me. But that's me. Half Eye or Fred might see something different
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: lebhuntfish on February 17, 2016, 04:19:55 pm
Can you post an unbraced photo?

Patrick
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 17, 2016, 04:34:02 pm
Can you post an unbraced photo?

Patrick
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160215_114926798.jpg)

Turtle. Your upper limthe fade out the the bump in the limb looks flat to me. But that's me. Half Eye or Fred might see something different

Yes,  I worked the fade to about 6 inches out after I posted the pics and it seems to be coming around better.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 17, 2016, 05:03:04 pm
I don't have a good eye for tiller. It may be a tad stiff from the handle out to the woopity doo but it looks like there is also a little more reflex at that point in the limb. Better for me to always ask anytime I build a bow.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 17, 2016, 05:15:35 pm
Thanks for the help guys.  I will tiller on...slowly!   :laugh:

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 17, 2016, 05:30:26 pm
God day,
Finally got back to the bow after my birthday weekend. Got some bending done and started some tillering. Took some more reflex out and gave both limbs a more similar profile. I'm gonna get on it tonight again after I figure out how to get my scraper sharp.
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8257.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8257.jpg.html)
(http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h330/geek_usa80/IMG_8260.jpg) (http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/geek_usa80/media/IMG_8260.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Blaflair2 on February 17, 2016, 06:58:26 pm
http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,14888.0.html

How to sharpen a scraper
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 17, 2016, 07:36:18 pm
I like that, I'm gonna try it out right now.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 17, 2016, 09:09:53 pm
Ok I haven't posted a pic of the Black Locus in awhile becomes of the Osage has consumed my time. So anyways I've attempted a style of tip overlays that I've never tried before so here it is. Don't have a clue what type of wood it is besides it smells like some sort of fancy coffee when your cutting and sanding on it. Please tell me if they need to be thinner shorter or just plain take em off and try again. I'm a big boy and can take it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: lebhuntfish on February 17, 2016, 09:21:02 pm
Can you post an unbraced photo?

Patrick
(http://i1067.photobucket.com/albums/u437/stevenbennett2/2016%20pa%20bow%20trade/IMG_20160215_114926798.jpg)

Turtle. Your upper limthe fade out the the bump in the limb looks flat to me. But that's me. Half Eye or Fred might see something different

Yes,  I worked the fade to about 6 inches out after I posted the pics and it seems to be coming around better.

After you get your fade moving better. Take a look  at about a 4 inch spot just past your whoopty-doo. Looks like it's not Bending there to me. But just check it, because I would have to see it bend myself to be sure. Your thickness taper will help to.
Patrick
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: lebhuntfish on February 17, 2016, 09:32:04 pm
Gut,  you can do whatever you want with overlays. What you have will work just fine.
If they were mine I would work in getting the transition from the back of the bow to the overlay smoothed out so it looks and feels like one piece of wood. And the area past the knock groove is all excess.  You could shorten them or not, it doesn't matter but you could take some off there but not absolutely necessary.  Just what I would do.

Patrick
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 17, 2016, 09:52:38 pm
Gutshot - here are a few pics of a tip that might give you some ideas.  This is not one of my bows, they are some pics I copied and saved - don't know who to give credit to, but someone here on PA most likely!

x2 what Patrick said.  You can shape them however you like.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 17, 2016, 10:02:05 pm
Tillered a bit more on my hackberry bow.

Currently out to 20" and still have room to make weight.  Beginning to take a little set - appears to be pretty even and distributed ok.

Pics - Brace, at 20", and unbraced.

Question 1 - do you think the bends are looking ok for a parallel profile?

Question 2 - this bow has not been heated at all.  It started with just a bit of natural reflex.  Do you think it would benefit from a belly toasting and maybe a bit of added reflex at this point?  Weight is not an issue as I should be able to make that fine.  Just wondering if it would make for a snappier shooting bow?

Thanks,

Mitch

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 17, 2016, 10:09:25 pm
Started heat treating the stick....bought a mike stand....really digging it!

(http://i.imgur.com/MXx2C72.jpg?1)

That's really coming along MWO
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: lebhuntfish on February 17, 2016, 10:50:21 pm
Tillered a bit more on my hackberry bow.

Currently out to 20" and still have room to make weight.  Beginning to take a little set - appears to be pretty even and distributed ok.

Pics - Brace, at 20", and unbraced.

Question 1 - do you think the bends are looking ok for a parallel profile?

Question 2 - this bow has not been heated at all.  It started with just a bit of natural reflex.  Do you think it would benefit from a belly toasting and maybe a bit of added reflex at this point?  Weight is not an issue as I should be able to make that fine.  Just wondering if it would make for a snappier shooting bow?

Thanks,

Mitch

Looks to me like the outer third on the left limb is a bit stiff. Right limb looks like it's getting most of the bend closer to the fade. Mid limb is Bending some, but stiffer on the outer third. Just my thoughts.
Patrick
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 18, 2016, 07:06:05 am
Gutshot,  Think the overlays look nice, and the overall shape is really a matter of personal taste as was said. If they look good to your eye you can always reduce them after shooting it some if it looks like they are an issue.  They used to look like that "back in the day" when a lot of bowstringers were made with leather pockets 8)

MW,  I cant see good enough to see the actual numerators on you horizontal line but if you look at all you pics you can see that for the last 2 denominators your limb tips are stiff with veru little to no bend. That is where your set is creeping in (compared to your original line). Basically I believe that you are going for stiff tips BUT right now they are too long....so if you work the bend a little further out toward the tips you will relieve that strain point at the second denominator, and still have the stiff tips.
    It is a testament to your even tiller though that both limbs are showing the same point of set (or stress).
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PEARL DRUMS/PEARLY/PD/DRUMS on February 18, 2016, 07:51:28 am
Thanks Pearl Drums, that's very helpful to me.

Is there a different tillering balance for a bow for a person who holds a bow more toward the top of the hand between the thumb and index finger with a more open hand than one who holds the grip hitting mainly lower in the hand?

If I send a bow in a trade is it possible it seems balanced for me but not somebody else because I don't know how they hold it? (I'm right at the point in tillering now and starting to shoot it where this is something I would like to understand.)

Thanks again for answering these questions.

I suppose its possible. If you are making a bow for another person in never hurts to ask if they like a low wrist or a high wrist. That shifts the balance point by up to 2". Truth is? 98% of the bows we all build are a typical med/low wrist type grip and most any of us would shoot them fine without balance issues. And, its not hard to grab a bow and find its balance point. I shape most of my grips in a way that you cant grab them wrong, its not a choice basically.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 18, 2016, 01:03:48 pm
Thanks Patrick and Rich - appreciate the help!

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: lebhuntfish on February 18, 2016, 01:10:28 pm
No problem bud, I've been just watching for a while. Haven't felt like posting a bunch. But I'm back on track now and it feels good to help out again.

Patrick
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 18, 2016, 02:14:42 pm
Thanks, Pearl Drums, that clears up some things for me.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: lebhuntfish on February 18, 2016, 03:24:03 pm
Thanks, Pearl Drums, that clears up some things for me.

Yes thanks Pearl!  I never thought about that but I did learn something from your responses.  Myself, I kinda make the handles like you said, where you can't mistake where to hold them.

Patrick
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: sleek on February 18, 2016, 03:44:11 pm
Id appreciate a pictorial example of this.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: rps3 on February 18, 2016, 03:44:31 pm
mwosborn, I would temper that hackberry now. You will like the results.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 18, 2016, 04:42:25 pm
Got a sweet piece of Ironwood from Rich today. Never worked it before so any advice would be great. Got the temper evened out on my hackberry today and started roughin out another hackberry . Gutshot do your tips however ya want they look cool as is.MW, that hack looks nice and i agree on bringin those tips around somemore. Man i love this thread. Gettin advice from Pearl Drums, Patrick, Badly Bent and others just shows how cool bowyers really are. Thanx guys \m/
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 18, 2016, 04:43:48 pm
Here's the ironwood from Rich.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 18, 2016, 04:45:34 pm
SUCCESS FINALLY!  Well, I finally got this stave straight.  I hate to be defeated by a piece of wood :-(  Heating the section of handle made some progress but not enough. 

Hey ajooter, I used your idea of steaming it and then hitting it with the heat gun.  That finally worked.  Thanks man!  I steamed that baby for an hour last night, clamped it in my end vise, greased it up, hit it with the heat gun for ten minutes and pulled the limb 7/16" past alignment.  Finally got great alignment today when I took it out of the clamp.

So, this afternoon I refined the profile and started floor tillering.  I'll get back on the floor tillering this evening.

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Trade%20Bow%20Straight_zpspt49jnow.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Trade%20Bow%20Straight_zpspt49jnow.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 18, 2016, 05:18:27 pm
mwosborn, I would temper that hackberry now. You will like the results.



I agree - thanks.  Going to work the tips just a bit and then toast it up!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 18, 2016, 05:31:00 pm
Congratulations on that Drewster! :)
That was a tough one.
Beautiful stave Stixnstones. Rich, you're the man!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 18, 2016, 07:01:12 pm
Drewster - looks good - your persistence paid off!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 18, 2016, 07:13:37 pm
I'm just getting ready to do my layouts on a couple this weekend and you guys are damn near done!!!

I opted to wait for warmer weather. Today would have been good but I'm searching for a runaway dog and now high school state wrestling championships are going on. I won't get much done but will show some progress tomorrow.

I do have one sinewed bw drying that won't take long after the curing process I hope.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 18, 2016, 07:15:52 pm
Drewster way to hang with it

Stix that's a cool peace of wood ya got there.

I've worked the tips a little more on the BL. BUT ITS UK BASKETBALL TIME SO IM TAKING THE NIGHT OFF
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 18, 2016, 07:30:35 pm
SUCCESS FINALLY!  Well, I finally got this stave straight.  I hate to be defeated by a piece of wood :-(  Heating the section of handle made some progress but not enough. 

Hey ajooter, I used your idea of steaming it and then hitting it with the heat gun.  That finally worked.  Thanks man!  I steamed that baby for an hour last night, clamped it in my end vise, greased it up, hit it with the heat gun for ten minutes and pulled the limb 7/16" past alignment.  Finally got great alignment today when I took it out of the clamp.

So, this afternoon I refined the profile and started floor tillering.  I'll get back on the floor tillering this evening.

(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Trade%20Bow%20Straight_zpspt49jnow.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Trade%20Bow%20Straight_zpspt49jnow.jpg.html)

Drewster what kind of tools you got there hanging above the brace and bit
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jeffp51 on February 18, 2016, 07:33:37 pm
ITS UK BASKETBALL TIME SO IM TAKING THE NIGHT OFF

I didn't know basketball was big in the United Kingdom.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Badly Bent on February 18, 2016, 07:35:47 pm
Drewster, nice job taming that stave and I have to comment that your shop is real nice. It's so tidy and organized that it's making me feel like a slob, looks like a very nice place to be making bows. :)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 18, 2016, 07:52:35 pm
ITS UK BASKETBALL TIME SO IM TAKING THE NIGHT OFF

I didn't know basketball was big in the United Kingdom.

University of Kentucky not the UNITED KINDOM
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: lebhuntfish on February 18, 2016, 07:57:48 pm
Drewster, nice job taming that stave and I have to comment that your shop is real nice. It's so tidy and organized that it's making me feel like a slob, looks like a very nice place to be making bows. :)

Hey Greg, maybe we should start a competition   on a new thread. We could call it "The dirtiest shop on PA"  we could give away a toilet brush for the worst one. That way they could clean up all their crap!  >:D

Patrick
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 18, 2016, 07:59:29 pm
I don't want a toilet brush man!!!

But I'll take a plunger  ;)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: lebhuntfish on February 18, 2016, 08:05:40 pm
I don't want a toilet brush man!!!

But I'll take a plunger  ;)

Now that's funny right there!

My wife would swear that I would win! What she don't know is that it could be worse if I didn't have to work in the driveway to make my big messes!

Patrick
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 18, 2016, 08:20:03 pm
Got one limb done...might have gotten a little crazy with the reflex.  Really like using the mike stand to heat treat.

(http://i.imgur.com/fJj0IH0.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/sSJHPeC.jpg?1)(http://i.imgur.com/7OkqnW2.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 18, 2016, 08:21:27 pm
Drewster, nice job taming that stave and I have to comment that your shop is real nice. It's so tidy and organized that it's making me feel like a slob, looks like a very nice place to be making bows. :)

Hey Greg, maybe we should start a competition   on a new thread. We could call it "The dirtiest shop on PA"  we could give away a toilet brush for the worst one. That way they could clean up all their crap!  >:D

Patrick

I would be in the running for it for sure
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 18, 2016, 08:35:31 pm

Drewster what kind of tools you got there hanging above the brace and bit
[/quote]

Gutshot, a couple of bow saws.  The one on the left is a store bought one.  The one on the right is one I made many years ago......it used to be my band saw.  Don't use it much any more.  I finally got a REAL band saw   ;-)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 18, 2016, 08:40:38 pm
Ajooter, like the handle lam. I would definetly be in for messy shop, actually messy bench, the rest of garage is "organised" 😝
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 18, 2016, 08:45:04 pm
Drewster, nice job taming that stave and I have to comment that your shop is real nice. It's so tidy and organized that it's making me feel like a slob, looks like a very nice place to be making bows. :)

Thanks Greg.  Some of my shop IS NOT that well organized.  But, I do like to be able to grab the tool I need quickly and then have a home to put it back in place.  At least I "think" it makes me more efficient......sometimes ;-)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 18, 2016, 08:54:41 pm

Drewster what kind of tools you got there hanging above the brace and bit

Gutshot, a couple of bow saws.  The one on the left is a store bought one.  The one on the right is one I made many years ago......it used to be my band saw.  Don't use it much any more.  I finally got a REAL band saw   ;-)
[/quote]

That's cool I like old hand tools and sometimes you just got to ask what stuff is. Thanks
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jeffp51 on February 18, 2016, 09:02:53 pm
ITS UK BASKETBALL TIME SO IM TAKING THE NIGHT OFF

I didn't know basketball was big in the United Kingdom.

University of Kentucky not the UNITED KINDOM

Just yanking your chain  8)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 19, 2016, 01:15:22 pm
I started working on an eastern red cedar sapwood bow last night and got it bending through the handle a bit (enough to start tillering). It's just shy of 54". Anyone know anything about erc sapwood?  I'm sure it should be rawhide backed. But will it hit a 28" draw or am I wasting my time. I'll get pics up later today. It's 1 1/2"@ fades. I appreciate any advice on this guy.  I'm working this weekend but. Get off Monday morning. Going to start backing a few bows so I can get them shooting.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Sidmand on February 19, 2016, 01:20:42 pm
Hoping this weekend is going to be a littlle slower paced than last weekend.  I have my Plan B stave to chase a ring on, and I'm considereing trying to work Plan A to floor tiller to get a little less wood on there that has to dry. 

I've been watching the back on that stave to see if it has any checks appearing.  For those of you who use Osage a lot, one a ring is chased, should I reapply a sealent to the back to keep it from possibly checking? 

Also, that stave is probably 1.5" to 1.75" thick, maybe even 2 inches in places.  Should I think about splitting it again from the belly side, to get it down to maybe between 3/4 and 1" thick?  If I go that route, should I kerf it like I did the back?  If that works, maybe I can use the belly split part to make my daughter(s) a bow, I have some bamboo that would work for a backing, it's only 3/4 inch wide after thinning it to 1/8", so I can't use it on a "grownup" bow (not long enough for an ELB type bow either).
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 19, 2016, 01:28:55 pm
I'd definitely reapply a sealer do the back after chasing a ring.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: burchett.donald on February 19, 2016, 06:03:01 pm
 Sidmand, Timothy is correct, I have seen Osage check after chasing a ring even if it's a seasoned stave, not many times though...My favorite is good old Elmer's glue, just a quick thin coat and you can wipe it off with a damp rag later...
                                                                                                                                Don
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 19, 2016, 08:14:26 pm
TR - I have worked erc a couple of times, but never something that short.  I think you would be hard pressed to get 28" out of it...but you certainly could prove me wrong!  I would suggest sinew backing it.  ERC makes a really light snappy bow.  Getting it there without it exploding is the tricky part.  :laugh:

This one is mostly sapwood - sinewed back.  I hunted with it this year and shot a nice doe with it.

http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,38400.msg509821.html#msg509821

Mitch
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 19, 2016, 08:33:45 pm
Well fellas, got my 3 done and you have to settle for teaser pic.....some parts are not shown to save some surprises for recipients (like decorated bellies etc.).

Enjoy the pics >:D I'm going to start on a series of bows that I'm calling my "magnum opus". we'll see how that goes.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: burchett.donald on February 19, 2016, 08:47:54 pm
 Looking good from here Rich, 3 different designs at once, jeesh you been busy...
                                                                                                                                 Don
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 19, 2016, 08:48:03 pm
TR - I have worked erc a couple of times, but never something that short.  I think you would be hard pressed to get 28" out of it...but you certainly could prove me wrong!  I would suggest sinew backing it.  ERC makes a really light snappy bow.  Getting it there without it exploding is the tricky part.  :laugh:

This one is mostly sapwood - sinewed back.  I hunted with it this year and shot a nice doe with it.

Mitch

thanks Mitch.  I'll sinew back it and just try for a 26" draw. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: TimothyR on February 19, 2016, 08:50:44 pm
Those look great Rich!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 19, 2016, 09:37:52 pm
What ever happened to...you guys are killing me....I'm way behind...I better get to work....I don't wanna hear it rich!  8)

Those are some nice looking sticks right there...the Penobscot looks stout btw!  Which one is mine again?!  >:D
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 19, 2016, 10:34:44 pm
Those look mighty fine.  Dang Rich, you are a bow making machine. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 19, 2016, 10:38:19 pm
Well here's the latest. I tied this osage r/d from tips 1/4" past handle to 3" past and then I threw a fat course of whitetail back sinew on and then a big fat crowning course of moose leg on that. Now IU get to watch it for a couple weeks and work on the other osage. I don't think the lilac is trade material although it will still be a cool character bow if it survives me.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 19, 2016, 10:39:51 pm
Man Rich those look awesome. can't wait till the next bows you post.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 19, 2016, 11:09:34 pm
Rich - those look like mighty fine bows.  Somebody will enjoy shooting them for sure!

The sinew looks good Dubois - now wait...and wait...and wait. :laugh:

I did some heating to my hackberry and continued to tiller - try and get some pics up in a bit.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 19, 2016, 11:50:40 pm
Took some hunting but I found the Rich bows pics. Dang buddy!! Those are fine works of art there. You ever take a break  ;)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 20, 2016, 04:45:28 am
Those are some sweet looking bows Rich.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: burchett.donald on February 20, 2016, 06:27:06 am
  Since 2010 I've seen "magna opera" from you, so "magnum opus" will be interesting sir...Yea, been researching again Rich, headed to the shop to work on that saw blade steel you sent and will email you some pics later...
                                                                                                               Don
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 20, 2016, 08:52:29 am
Dubois that's a mighty fine sinew job.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Badly Bent on February 20, 2016, 09:33:11 am
Nice looking trio of bows Rich, looks like you got hammered with the white stuff up there.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 20, 2016, 09:39:20 am
Thank all of you for the nice comments. I hope the recipients like them. I think mine are pretty plain and a lot of folks dont think much of 'em.....but these three will flat send arrows 8).

I wish I had enough wood to build a trade bow for everybody in this trade, all you guys are making really nice bows and I would be proud to exchange with each and every one of you 8) 8) 8)

Doob's  please tell me it aint so, for the love of God man. >:D :-X
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 20, 2016, 10:13:01 am
Hi Guys,

got the limbs down to brace, weight seems to be about right, maybe a little light, 25# at brace but the lash-up 'riser' has served its purpose so now I will make something nice from cherry. Here's what I have learned
1. notching the limb does not help hold it in place - the notch will always act as a lever, and an incredibly poweful one at that - it literally pulled a Sapele (African mahogany) riser apart - the photos show the remains of the notch if you look carefully;
2. trying to catch the tip of a riser in a mortice is pointless - it squeaks and creaks like crazy as you cannot stop the limb tip from flexing when the limb bends;
3. you need to use the bigest washers you can on the bolts as the forces involved are huge.

(https://stuckinthemudsite.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/image-e1455979200795.jpg)
(https://stuckinthemudsite.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/image1-e1455979132836.jpg)

I realise the centre block si messing things up and the next task is to sort that out but I have a couple of questions in the meantime. The second photo is about a 2" draw, I think the levers may be too long? I believe the curve should be eliptical, so the outer third needs to be moving more?   Also, any reason I can't reflex the limbs at the handle when I carve the riser for real?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 20, 2016, 10:14:08 am
Rich, you're way ahead of all of us. Nice bows!!! I'm going to hit you up for lessons on those Penobscot. I've got to try one of those.

I did finally get some work done yesterday. We've fortunately had some nice warm weather and most of the snow from our blizzard is gone except for drifts and other low areas. Should get more work done on a couple today. Both will be 60+ osage that should bend in the handle at full draw. And the sinew on the black walnut is dry enough that I should be able to start working i on the long string.

I did get one of the osage down close enough to bow dimensions that I removed the twist and lined the handle and tips yesterday. One heat session might be all that's needed on this one. The other will take a bit more work.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 20, 2016, 11:24:26 am
Looks good fred!  I'm looking forward to putting some time into my trade bows today.  Hopefully have some pictures later.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 20, 2016, 12:12:09 pm
The steam worked on my red bud handle.  Actually, I ended up overcorrecting and the tips were off in the other direction.  The steam opened up several drying checks in the handle.  I was planning to fill these with CA glue, smooth off the back of the handle, and add another overlay on the handle to get a little more thickness.

The deflex in one limb was enough that I am having a hard time judging the stiffness while floor tillering, so I decided to put it back on a caul to take the deflex out before proceeding with tillering, and decided to use the dry heat on the handle while working on the limbs.  Will pull it off this evening to see how well it took.

In the meantime, I am getting back to the dogwood.  I have the outer bark roughed off, leaving the cambium, going to be slower getting off this inner bark to get down to the first ring.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 20, 2016, 12:45:31 pm
Looking good Fred!! Glad your getting some warmer weather.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 20, 2016, 12:52:03 pm
Rich, I just saw your photos -- I don't know how I missed the last two pages of this trade thread yesterday. Wonderful bows! No wonder you were so quiet recently......

re. "plain" bows -- I like real looking bows that show where they come from and how they were made, and look like a real person made them, easily as much as the showstopper highly finished bows. Actually, I like all styles of bows, in different ways, unless they came off a manufacturing floor. But for building them, I've gravitated toward just liking the basic form of the wood and the tree or sapling it came from. And I appreciate seeing the maker's shaping of it with his or her instincts, and whatever trials and tribulations with the wood that got them there. Every bow tells a story. That's how I see it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 20, 2016, 01:03:15 pm
JAnderson; Is that your lilac? looking good. Mine is a little thin in the handle so I am taking out of the race and will pursue a solution later.

Rich; yes I am a glutton but this thing is only 1.25" at the widest  >:D >:D

Looking good Gut, MW, Ajooter and on and on....

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 20, 2016, 01:21:12 pm
Hey Stuck....
     I have never made a take-down Mollegabet but have made a few of the regular ones. I dont think your levers are too long at all. But now that you have the limbs refined as far as you do I would recommend that you tiller from the lever fade towards the grip fade. I usually make my working limbs a round even bend.....if you start at the lever fades and work the bend in toward the grip you should minimize your high grip area stress, especially early on.
    Also you may wish to consider a thin "pad" between the limb and riser.....I've seen some that had a piece of hard, dense rubber maybe a 1/8" thick between them. Most of the old comercial models had a "blind pin" fit below the bolt to provide 2 points of alignment for each limb.
   Sorry could not be more help
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 20, 2016, 03:39:01 pm
I've made weight and draw, and had a chance to shoot the plan B bow enough to be happy with it. I guess it's time to finish it off. Here's a few last pics:

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowB10.jpg)

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowB9.jpg)

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowB11.jpg)

(http://i786.photobucket.com/albums/yy150/vtsr/vtsr/archery/TradeBowB12.jpg)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 20, 2016, 03:41:13 pm
Hey Stuck....
     I have never made a take-down Mollegabet but have made a few of the regular ones. I dont think your levers are too long at all. But now that you have the limbs refined as far as you do I would recommend that you tiller from the lever fade towards the grip fade. I usually make my working limbs a round even bend.....if you start at the lever fades and work the bend in toward the grip you should minimize your high grip area stress, especially early on.
    Also you may wish to consider a thin "pad" between the limb and riser.....I've seen some that had a piece of hard, dense rubber maybe a 1/8" thick between them. Most of the old comercial models had a "blind pin" fit below the bolt to provide 2 points of alignment for each limb.
   Sorry could not be more help
rich

 

Thanks Rich, that's really useful, do you think leather would do for a pad?  The photos don't show the limbs disassembled but there is a blind pin in each one but good to have the concept confirmed

Andrew
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 20, 2016, 03:55:42 pm
Leather should work just fine sir.....but I think some really stiff stuff like shoe sole material and thin (even if ya got to sand it) I think that the pads are there for shock absorbers so even if they seem way too stiff they probably are just right.

Mr. B.....if ya need my address again be happy to send it 8)
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: willie on February 20, 2016, 04:40:25 pm
Plan B

nice looking birch bow. The original sudbury was hickory iirc? I think that I once read the estimated weight of the original was mid 40's ? it seems like you have got the design working pretty good in birch, and a few inches shorter, to boot?     Does the handle bend slightly?
Hope you get a chance to post a pic at full draw along with the specs. There are so many bows in this thread it's hard to keep up......but thats a good thing.

willie


Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 20, 2016, 06:59:27 pm
PlanB, that bow looks excellent......nice work man!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: DuBois on February 20, 2016, 07:03:02 pm
PlanB, that bow looks excellent......nice work man!
+1 here
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 20, 2016, 07:14:42 pm
PB, that things a real looker.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 20, 2016, 07:39:11 pm
Yep - a nice looking bow PB.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jeffp51 on February 20, 2016, 08:32:10 pm
I spent the afternoon working down the back of and interesting osage stave.  Lots of knots and red streaks in it.  Thick rings, but Lunar rings too that have made it a little tricky.  The two staves I am working with are this osage and a piece of Yew I got from Fred (Thanks again Fred).  If they both work out, one will be my trade bow, and the other will go to my brother for his birthday.  If only one works out, it will be my trade bow, and my brother will get the one sent to me--so whoever has me, make it a good one for him!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: hammertime on February 20, 2016, 08:43:36 pm
WOW! you go away for a few days and it s hard to catch up on all the action, great progress all....sweet bows Rich. I will have pics of my elm progress in a day or two- Hammertime
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 20, 2016, 08:44:11 pm
PlanB. Somebody is gonna be very happy. Nice bow
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 20, 2016, 08:46:40 pm
Jeffp51 those are some good looking sticks on your shave horse
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Loope on February 20, 2016, 09:21:46 pm
I pulled the red bud off the caul and put a string on the tips... they are now lined up with the center of the handle.  Also got the dogwood scraped and ready for a layout.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 20, 2016, 10:39:58 pm
Thank all you guys for the great comments, it's a real pleasure to make a bow for someone here, and work along side of you   :)

Wilie, yes the handle does bend some. I can't give away the draw and weight right yet, but I can say it's 58-1/2" ntn, black birch, and it's the leftover piece after I snapped off a good 6" chunk of one end while steaming that tip. The fades had to be lengthened in order for me to move the handle toward the unbroken end, so it is a little more Sudbury-like in appearance than it started, but not a real replica -- quite a bit shorter, less tapered to mid limb, and the handle is a little wider. Still I do like that it went a little in that direction -- by accident or luck or something. Thought it was done for when the end snapped off.  :o

Now I'm glad it did. It isn't perfect -- it has 1-1/2" string follow, so not quite as fast as the Plan A bow.  But it is by far the most accurate bow I've built. I couldn't believe how good I was shooting today.  Or it was..... I don't think I had much to do with it! There's a little twist in one tip, which I will leave. But I think it's my best bow so far and my favorite. I'm going to finish it, and then shoot it in for a few hundred arrows to make sure. And then it will belong to somebody here.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 20, 2016, 10:45:39 pm
Loope that sure is a nice character bow
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Swampman on February 20, 2016, 10:46:39 pm
PlanB, that is a sweet looking piece of birch.  A little string follow can make for a sweet shooting bow. 

Loope, that redbud is looking real nice.

All I did today was take the deflex out of the ends of my piece of white birch with steam.  I hope to get in my shop tomorrow.  I still need to get string alignment taken care of before I do anything else.  I also started chasing a ring on another piece of BL.  I have trouble staying away from the BL because I have had such good luck with it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Dakota Kid on February 21, 2016, 02:42:20 am
I got the rock elm looking good on the tiller tree. The fades need just a little more scraping, but that's often the way my builds go. I glued on some water buffalo nock overlays and will be shaping them tomorrow after they dry. Prior to the glue up, I was only a few inches short of full draw and over weight so I should slide into home with no issues.

That's a gorgeous yew stave you got there Jeff. I don't know if you've ever worked yew before but, wood comes off with far less effort than osage that's for sure. Just a couple passes with the rasp and you remove as much wood as you do scraping OO for an hour. Just go slow, especially with the belly during tiller.

Fred, if you're just giving away perfectly straight knot free yew I'd like to remind you that you have my address sir.

Rich, when I started building I tried to make my bows look impressive, be it with the finish, fancy cut handles/shelf, or layered glue ups with exotic wood. Every time I focused on looks rather than function I ended up with firewood(even a good knot on my head once). When it comes down to it, bows aren't for lookin at. The true beauty in a bow lies in what they do with the arrow. Nice work.

Plan B, really impressive bow, especially with the chosen wood. Makes me look at birch in a new light. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 21, 2016, 07:46:56 am
Kid....I agree with your statement above through and through.  I end up in the same boat usually.

B....that bow is looking great.  That 1.5" string follow shouldn't hurt anything and with the design and stats it's probably right oon.  I would imagine e birch is a very light wood?
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 21, 2016, 09:43:34 am
While further reducing my second stave this Crack showed up.  Turns out it went clean through to the back.   I had left the cambium on and didn't think I needed to seal the back.  The Crack may have erupted from a small branch that was broken off when I cut it.

Anyway....I ended up with very little bow wood and made a small bow from the slivers that were left.  I was quite disappointed.   Had I know the Crack was there I could have split it early on and got a decent weight bow out of it.  Oh well such is life!


(http://i.imgur.com/TdQ0JRv.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: mwosborn on February 21, 2016, 10:34:55 am
Jeff - those are some nice looking staves.  Someday I will find some yew to work.

Loope - looks like you have the tips lined up - that is one crooked stick - looking forward to seeing it take shape!  The dogwood looks perfectly straight - you are working on opposites with those two!

Fred - the weather warmed up a bit for us and the snow mostly gone - glad you could get out and work some on your bows.  Looking good.  Weather looks good for the next week anyway.  Better make hay before we get our March blizzard!!

ajooter - no chance of gluing that crack with some cyanoacrylate?

Not much time to work on my trade bow yesterday - did just a little bit of tillering.  Maybe get a little time today.

Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 21, 2016, 11:15:25 am
The Crack went all the way through.  It was a hefty stave....4" wide by 2" deep.  Had a I seen the Crack early on I would have tried splitting it. 
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: jandersson on February 21, 2016, 12:47:38 pm
Some real nice stuff being posted the last few days,
Hat off for PlanB and half eye for some sweet bows!

Loope: Geez! And I thought mine had some funny curves init.

Dubois: How come you put a extra sinew along the center?  Yeah it's the lilac. I got it to 50 @12" and the way it look s now I don't think I'll have much limb left by the time I'm done with it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 21, 2016, 12:54:31 pm
Hey fellas,
    Got the strings made for the Penobscot, and checked to full draw and shot it some. Then happened to notice that the upper limb at a point of 4" or so from full draw out to full draw  torques pretty good (like twist)....and then returns to normal at brace......so I'm building another bow because this one aint going nowhere.....especially to one of you guys.
    Got a piece of real snaky stuff, nibbled that down to rough width, steam bent it to align  the tips and grip, will rough out the thickness later today.
   Here are some pics of Mr. Snaky
rich
PS: I hope all of you guys are having a good experience and a bunch of fun....I know I am and really glad to get the chance to be apart of this trade......no I dont want to get a room...but it's a real pleasure working with all of ya. 8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 21, 2016, 01:01:20 pm
Man Rich that must be a sister to that Osage I'm working on
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 21, 2016, 01:34:16 pm
I like that snake little number rich....should make a unique bow for sure!
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 21, 2016, 01:39:51 pm
Gutshot, I hear ya man.....but the belly split (sawed off) is headed south real soon so we'll see >:D

Ajooter, I sure hope it makes a good one.....never had that happen before with the Penobscot type bows so I dont know if it is a problem or not as far as longevity goes.

rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Drewster on February 21, 2016, 02:29:44 pm
Rich, it's an honor to have you helping all of us out.  This trade seems to be as good as it gets.  Great group for sure.  Sorry about that Penobscot tip twist.  Wood sure has a mind of its own and a surprise in every piece......but that's what keeps it interesting.

First Brace.   Got Miss Ornery braced for the first time this afternoon at about 3".  Let me know what you think.  The right side is the top limb.....at least for now.  The left limb has some propeller twist in the middle 2/3 section.  My next step will be heat treating and I'm hoping I can take some of this twist out during the heat treating.   Hope Miss Ornery doesn't continue to be ornery.  I wasn't looking for THIS much of a challenge for my trade bow.  Boy, every bow is a tutor.


(http://i1169.photobucket.com/albums/r509/drewsumrell/Miss%20Ornery_zpswn3tq5sf.jpg) (http://s1169.photobucket.com/user/drewsumrell/media/Miss%20Ornery_zpswn3tq5sf.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 21, 2016, 03:29:25 pm
Drew, looks pretty good for low brace. Tiller looks close but hard to tell much from photos. You're getting close to being finished from the looks of it.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 21, 2016, 03:58:31 pm
Drewster,
        I took the liberty of putting a mark on your pic. I think that a few scrapes there on the "strong side" of the limb will go a long way to helping with the twist and evening out the bend. It looks like the strong side is against the chalkboard.
       Take a look at it and make your own judgement sir.....
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: turtle on February 21, 2016, 04:47:59 pm
Sorry to here about the penobscot Rich. Cant wait to see that snake bending though.

Did get my dogwood billets moved to my hotbox today.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 21, 2016, 05:31:47 pm
Jeff P51, really nice wood you got there!
Loope, that is going to be one cool bow when you're done with it!
Swampman, really looking forward to what you can do with your white birch.
Rich, too bad about the Penobscot, but you don't seem to let much stop you! Your snake bow will be cool.
ajooter, sorry about that crack in the stave. But you've been turning out the bows, too, I bet you have yet another planned?  re. birch -- the black (sweet) birch is actually pretty heavy, but it's also very stiff, so you end up with fairly thin limbs, and similar mass to anything else. White birch is less dense, and less stiff, so it will yield a thicker limb, again at about the same mass -- at least according to the mass principle. I have a third variety -- yellow birch -- haven't tried it yet. It is dense and stiff, and also has interlocking grain, which black birch does not. Almost like elm in that respect. I will probably try some yellow birch after the spring when I plan to cut some. White, I won't be trying because most of mine has died out, and I want to let the survivors grow.

Drewster your stuff looks ten times better on the tree at any particular moment than mine does. Very neat work.
jandersson, thank you kindly!
Dakota, your elm sounds mighty fine with those tips added. re. the birch -- I'm liking black birch -- it grows straight and tall and limbless for 30 or more feet, so it's easy to get clear wood out of it. Most common hardwood I have growing here, so I'm glad i can use it. I'll be curious to see the difference in yellow birch.....
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 21, 2016, 05:48:36 pm
Mr. B
    I have made a handfull of Eastern Woodland bendies from yellow birch and they proved to be excellent bows. They are quite snappy little shooters.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: PlanB on February 21, 2016, 07:07:09 pm
Rich, I'd love to see those if you have any pix.....
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: stixnstones on February 21, 2016, 07:33:00 pm
Ok, so my plan A has been givin me fits at every turn and plan 2 is gonna be somethin to finish some other time. Sooo got my 3rd hackberry almost ruffed out. Will be postin pics in next couple days. I'm jealous of all u guys, everyone's work looks so good.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 21, 2016, 07:52:04 pm
Mr B....I'll check both compiters and see if any survived (pics that is) I know I posted at least 2 of 'em but dont know if the pics are still on the old threads. Let me check sir......
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 21, 2016, 08:32:51 pm
Well guys...id like some advice.  This is a stave I roughed out in the beginning.  Its almost 68" and longer then I would have wanted for the draw im shooting for but I want to finish the bow anyway.  I posted a picture of the unbraced profile and the current tiller at 14" @ ~35#.  I kind of wanted to keep the natural profile of the stave instead of trying to steam and heat the stave into a more desirable shape.  Right now the right limb which is the top is coming around nicely.  Im not sure what I should do with the left?

When I get it closer to brace it will probably heat treat the bow and add a little reflex (that's when I usually do it anyway).  The unbraced profile is how this stave started...didn't have any great characteristics starting out.  Just wanted to hear your thoughts.  Thanks in advance for your comments.
(http://i.imgur.com/KHdcL4h.jpg?1)
(http://i.imgur.com/kcvTkIX.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 21, 2016, 08:44:37 pm
Ajooter,
     On that left limb between the natural dippsy doodle and the grip fade the limb is stiffer than that area of the right one.  I think if you scrape a small amount of bend in that area your limb should resemble the right except the outter half of lefty will be low compared to righty but the bends will be even......if you try that go real slow and check often because it will change pretty quickly.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 21, 2016, 08:50:32 pm
Should I focus more towards the 'dipsy doodle' rich?  I agree with you....I'm sure when it decides to move it will go fast.
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 21, 2016, 09:09:56 pm
Well I ended up with a minor problem with my trade bow so I gave it a backing of raw hide and mummy fide it. Hopefully that ole BL will be ok. Any ways here's the last pic you guys will see of it until it comes out of the fummer Thursday then I will post pics of a before and after
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 21, 2016, 09:12:27 pm
This is where the left looks stiff to me sir......but they do call me "half-eye" >:D
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: half eye on February 21, 2016, 09:14:48 pm
Gutshot,   looks like ya fixed that little bugger......cant wait to see the color sir.
rich
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ---GUTSHOT---> on February 21, 2016, 09:15:04 pm
Rich when did the Sioux start branding air tools 😃
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information
Post by: ajooter on February 21, 2016, 09:26:37 pm
I'll give it a go sir....your half eye is better then both of my good ones anyway.  ;)
Title: Re: 2016 Primitive Archer Bow Trade Sign up and Information