Author Topic: Differences in Bodkin points?  (Read 35111 times)

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Offline D. Tiller

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #15 on: May 09, 2007, 07:32:12 pm »
Nice! How long does a point like that take to make? I may have access to a forge this summer any type of iron or steal thats best for making these out of? I was thinking of trying some rebar.
“People are less likely to shoot at you if you smile at them” - Mad Jack Churchill

sagitarius boemoru

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #16 on: May 09, 2007, 07:35:32 pm »
3/4 of hour plus some grinding. But what you need to learn is to make good sockets. If you make good socket, you can make any type of arrowhead. I suck at forging and it does not well to my ellbows.


Jaro

Offline D. Tiller

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #17 on: May 09, 2007, 07:47:10 pm »
Hmm! Maybe I should invest in a trip hammer too.  I wonder if the blacksmiths back then actually spent time on grinding the heads down? Looks nice though!  Did you use charcoal to harden the head.  I have heard mention that they may have pounde the head against charcoal laid on the anvil at temp. to harden the point like case hardenning does.
“People are less likely to shoot at you if you smile at them” - Mad Jack Churchill

sagitarius boemoru

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #18 on: May 09, 2007, 07:51:42 pm »
They did cemented (carbonised) iron arrowheads in bone mill. A kitchin fire is sufficient to do that.
Since this is steel it does not need anything.

Jaro

Offline D. Tiller

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #19 on: May 09, 2007, 07:54:48 pm »
Cool! I wonder if I used rebar if I would need to harden the points in this manor or if it is a hard enough steal to not nead it.
“People are less likely to shoot at you if you smile at them” - Mad Jack Churchill

Offline Uncouth

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #20 on: May 09, 2007, 08:13:57 pm »
Wayne Goddard has a book called the $50 Knife Shop that talks about how to set up an inexpensive home forge, and talks about different types of steel, hardening and tempering, of course it is geared toward making knives, but I don't know why the forge and the principles couldn't be used for making arrowheads.
But thats just my opinon, I could be wrong.

Offline Loki

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #21 on: May 09, 2007, 08:32:02 pm »
Didnt Bruce use old Anchors for his points?
Durham,England

Miles

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #22 on: May 09, 2007, 08:42:34 pm »
Here's a test that I did with my old 16 gauge heat-treated breastplate and some Botkin tipped arrows if you look at the types 7 needlepoint bodkins did not fare well.

 Normally this type of head gets the best penetration in my target out of my bodkins tips and the type 7 needlepoint bodkins eats chain mail for breakfast I have some very nice riveted chain mail that a needlepoint bodkins penetrate an 1 1/2 inches without breaking the rivets pushed in with my pinky finger.(I’ll work on taking photo show why it's so good versus chain mail)

The next one is a type 8 bodkin in if you look at the tip you'll see is flattened a little bit when it hit the target deflected sharply to left at an odd angle it was very cool looking to.

You can see some small dense on the breastplate in this particular piece of armor is not a good example of the later 15th-century type of armor that was heat-treated spring steel in made to optimize deflected sloping for protection versus arrows.

Cheers Miles

I like Shooting stuff

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Offline D. Tiller

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #23 on: May 09, 2007, 10:26:26 pm »
Neat! You going to try some Tudor and Heavy Bodking points next?
“People are less likely to shoot at you if you smile at them” - Mad Jack Churchill

Miles

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #24 on: May 10, 2007, 01:08:51 am »
Hi D. Tiller
Neat! You going to try some Tudor and Heavy Bodking points next?
May be some time down the road I can make up the Tudor style heavy bodkin heads arrows.

I’m looking to demonstrate the effectiveness of three basic missile weapons, war bow(my favorite), crossbow(powerful but slowwww) and handgun (to loud) of the later half 15th-century period to demonstrate the effectiveness and show the pros and cons of each of the weapons.

Cheers Miles

Miles

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #25 on: May 10, 2007, 04:31:02 am »
This is a follow-up on my first posting and I was mistaken about needlepoint bodkins type 7 the ease of penetration it's not 1 1/2 inches it's over 2 1/2 inches, the chain mail I am using is flat riveted links it's very high-quality reproduction armor, what I'm doing is putting the point through without damaging the armor to show you the ineffectiveness of this type of armor against this type of bodkins head.

This is the same test using the type 8 bodkins arrowhead it shows a very weak defense.

Chain mail in the 15th century was used in conjunction with other armors to provide limited protection.
Miles

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Far East Archer

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #26 on: May 11, 2007, 07:22:21 am »
Interesting stuff! Well I dont have a forge.....YET! but I will someday. Untill then can you tell me if this is any good?http://www.bowstick.com/storefront/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=70&products_id=652
« Last Edit: May 11, 2007, 07:33:40 am by Far East Archer »

SimonUK

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #27 on: May 11, 2007, 07:43:21 am »
It looks good to me ....but I laugh when they say it is similar to the arrow heads of 'thousands of years ago'  :D

sagitarius boemoru

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #28 on: May 11, 2007, 08:03:37 am »
The socket on that one is somehow bulbous. While I like shape of head, which might be even of some use against plate, the socket should go somehow straight to form cone. I wonder if the socket is really forged, because its hard to imagine how to arrive to this shape if you use madrell for forging.

Got better picture?

Jaro

Far East Archer

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Re: Differences in Bodkin points?
« Reply #29 on: May 11, 2007, 08:52:41 am »
SimonUK
 I laugh at most of the stuff on that site, they have a bow on there thats called a warbow that doesnt even pull 80# :o

Jaro
Yes I like the shape also thats why I thought it would be a good head but I highly doubt it was hand forged. Hmm it also said fits 11/32..... gonna need to buy some ash shaft because my spruce shafts stand no chance when shot from a heavy bow that skinny. Dont have better pic as this is the only one on the site.

So is this worth getting???? About $39 for 12

-Alex

P.S. This is bowman from PP by the way.