Author Topic: Please look, tell me what you see, and tell me what, if anything should be done.  (Read 2643 times)

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Offline Morgan

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I have a tillering stick as well as the tree. When I have questions about my bow like this I put it on the stick at full draw, lay it on the shop floor and draw an outline. Flip the bow and I can see exactly what's different. It helps sometimes.

This! You will see exactly where the difference is. Don稚 mean the tiller will be right, but you can match the limbs .

Offline ssrhythm

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Thanks to all of you.  This is incredibly helpful.  I知 going to make a tree and do the outline flip.  RH is very high until Sunday-Monday.  I値l rework the stuff area then and get things refinished enough until after hunting season.  Thanks for all the input.

Offline superdav95

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You致e likley made your decision already based on good advise here.  I agree with last outer 1/3 top limb too stiff if nit picking.  At least that is what I see with my eye based on photo.  Good luck and wonderful bow!
Sticks and stones and other poky stabby things.

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Offline Don W

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Thanks to all of you.  This is incredibly helpful.  I知 going to make a tree and do the outline flip.  RH is very high until Sunday-Monday.  I値l rework the stuff area then and get things refinished enough until after hunting season.  Thanks for all the input.

The other thing I've read, and haven't tried because I don't have a mirror in my shop, is stand in front of a mirror and look at the full draw, then flip the bow and do the same thing, and keep flipping and looking (i think this is in TBB but don't hold me to that). They say it helps, but again I haven't tried it.
Don

Offline Dances with squirrels

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Just to play the devil's advocate.... How can we give good tillering advice without comparing the drawn bow to its unbraced profile? What if the limbs aren't shaped the same unbraced? What if unbraced, the top limb has an area with a little reflex where it 'seems' to not be bending enough at full draw? In other words, how do you know you're not giving him bad advice based on an incorrect assumption that both limbs are identical unbraced?

Could be you're right... could be you're not. No way to know at this point. Without an unbraced side profile picture he shouldn't ask for or take our advice, and we shouldn't offer any. Just my 2 cents. Worth what ya paid for it  ;)
Straight wood may make a better bow, but crooked wood makes a better bowyer

Offline ssrhythm

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Just to play the devil's advocate.... How can we give good tillering advice without comparing the drawn bow to its unbraced profile? What if the limbs aren't shaped the same unbraced? What if unbraced, the top limb has an area with a little reflex where it 'seems' to not be bending enough at full draw? In other words, how do you know you're not giving him bad advice based on an incorrect assumption that both limbs are identical unbraced?

Could be you're right... could be you're not. No way to know at this point. Without an unbraced side profile picture he shouldn't ask for or take our advice, and we shouldn't offer any. Just my 2 cents. Worth what ya paid for it  ;)

You are certainly correct.  I have been posting on this bow throughout its progress from the time it was a 66" longbow that I overshot the weight reduction on, thru the cutting and recurving and sinewing, and now to all this.  It started in one thread and moved to the "Lil Eddy is Ready" thread....obcviously I was a little premature with that thread :D.  So there are unbraced and at brace pics of the bow in those threads.

I started this thread once I realized that my tiller was flipping during shooting sessions after I finished the bow and after I started the "Lil Eddy is Ready" thread, so that folks that had looked at that thread would look again to help me fix the problems, as it was becoming obvious that Lil Eddy wasn't ready.

Like most hedge sticks (Especially ones that are not tillered perfectly) this one has some knot areas, wavy grain, and some areas of natrual deflex that were removed with dry heat but still want to go back to its natural pre-heat shape.  The reason I was leaning toward the upper limb still being too stiff was due to it always having slight pos tiller when first strung that flipped to slight negative tiller during and after a shooting session.  This issue was getting more pronounced with every shooting session telling me that the bottom limb was being stressed too much in relation to the top. 

I took minimal scrapes off of three small areas in the identified stiff spots on the inner 1/3 that were definitely thicker and definitely not bending enough, and this has helped it a bunch.  The bow is holding 1/4" positive tiller after a serious 100+ arrow shooting session with a 6.75" brace height.  It seems to be shooting better also, but how much better will be determined when the wind, currently blowing a steady 15-20mph, dies down and I can run a variety pf bare shafts through it with various tip weights.

Here are the re-tillered FD pics.  My 9yo son took the pics; the concept of square and perpindicular regarding photos to him is still a bit confusing, so this is the best we can do for now.  The right pics are pretty square and I'm holding the bow straight out.  The camera angle on the left pic is a bit off, and I am holding the bow with a slight downward shot angle...so the tips are tilted in relation to the siding in the background as if I'm going to launch a 20 yard shot at a rabbit.

That said, I think the tiller is much better, and I'm liking that it is starting out and holding the positive tiller throughout the shooting session...telling me (I think) that the two limbs are bending and sharing the load more equally now.

The last pics are of the bow immediately after I unstrung it and approximately 30 minutes after unstringing.

Thanks again for the input and advice.
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« Last Edit: August 21, 2021, 04:42:14 pm by ssrhythm »

Offline ssrhythm

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 You can also see clearly in the last pic the area on the upper limb, where the outter 1/3 starts, the area where the natural deflex and a good bit of twist was removed with dry heat.  There was a lot of twist that had to be removed and a lot of deflex.  It still wants to go back to its deflex there during shooting, but that will be nearly or completely gone in a few hours.  There is still some twist, as I only removed what was necessary to get the string laying center belly of the recurved tip.  So that combo makes that spot look wonky if not a little hingy from one side...it does not look that way from the other side.  Regardless, its shooting sweet and fast and it's still showing 59-60lbs at 27", so I think I need to tune some arrows to it, refininsh it, and call it good for the elk hunt.  Thanks again for y'alls help.

Offline sleek

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Between these lines the upper limb is still slightly stiff. Am I nit pickin? Yes, yes I am. But, it still wants a handful of light scrapes right there. It looks miles better already though and if you choose to leave it as is, nobody will blame you. But I just want you to see it.
Tread softly and carry a bent stick.

Dont seek your happiness through the approval of others

Offline ssrhythm

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I知 going to examine that area really closely, but the significant knot just proximal to that area combined with a lesser knot at the distal 1/4 of that area and a Little beyond have it looking more non-working than it actually is (I think). 

When I looked at that limb as I was bending it, when bent but being held static, I saw the stiff area everyone was mentioning; when I flexed the limb, some small areas/spots around and within it were flexing.

And a couple of points in the stiff looking area and just beyond it were not bending.

I hit those non bending areas, and when I flex the limb now, I see the bend happening despite it still looking a little stiff in spots when held bent and static. 

The same is true for the outter 1/3 that I was originally thinking was too stiff when I looked at the pictures.  The outter 1/3 is bending more than it seems in the picsas I pull it, I see the bend happening.  It could stand to bend a scosh more thru a spot out there, but the limb is twisted there, and it痴 bending enough to work there without compromising the strength of that twisted (also a small knot swail/swale (sp)) spot. 

At this point, it is shooting dead and quiet, and it痴 accurately hitting where I知 lookingand that was in a lot of wind yesterday with a couple of weak spined arrows, one river cane and light and the other Doug fir and heavy. 

I have a new set of test packs from 35 to 100 lbs Doug fir as of yesterday.  Bow is actually now pulling 58 at 27 and 60 at 28.  As accurate as I can be with the crappy scale and rack set up I have.  So I lost ~ 2 lbs.  But that痴 weight I needed to lose to be honest.

I知 going to look hard again at the spot today and analyze carefully, but time constraints are likely going to have me finishing it up temporarily for my hunt, as I need to find the perfect arrow spine, weight, tip, and FOC combo for this one in a hurry, get some arrows built, and quit dilly-dallying instead of hardcore practicing. 

I知 very confident that any elk within 25 that I can loose an arrow at from a good angle is going to die a noble and quick death.  I壇 like to have that same confidence at 40 yards; I will not shoot past 25 at this point and not past 35 everprobably will never, ever take a 35 yard shot, but I don稚 do rangefinders, and the Western terrain has fooled this southern boy more than a lot in the three years I致e been out here. 

Regardless, I致e been shooting a variety of sticks a good bit and this one a lotI just need to shoot this one with the arrow that I find suits itand shoot it a ton with one of those arrows from all over.first-shot-is-the-only-shot-that-counts style.  Do some stump shooting and roving too.

Unless I see something different today, I値l make any micro adjustments after the hunt. In late September-October.

Thanks for you input; I WANT nitpicking and constructive advice and pointers.  I listen to every comment and consider them all whether I directly acknowledge it or not. 

Thanks again.


Offline SLIMBOB

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Just a bit to add...sometimes, a little prop twist can play havoc on reading one correctly.  From one side the top looks weak, and from the other side the bottom.  Look at them from different perspectives before taking wood off.  Ask me how I know this :)
Liberty, In God We Trust, E Pluribus Unum.  Distinctly American Values.

Offline Selfbowman

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Just a bit to add...sometimes, a little prop twist can play havoc on reading one correctly.  From one side the top looks weak, and from the other side the bottom.  Look at them from different perspectives before taking wood off.  Ask me how I know this :)

Yes and I have had some success ironing this out to an extent. Also had wigglers with good cast and plenty of shock.
Arvin
Well I'll say!!  Osage is king!!